Having separate commands for creating/modifying selections and for editing their contents is more orthogonal. In kakoune, you can select a word, multiple words, multiple search results, a brace-delimited block, or an arbitrary sequence of characters (it's pretty common that I want to include a bit of whitespace, or instance), and the same 'c' command works on all of them. The same 'd', 'i', and 'a' commands also work on all of them. In straight-line editing it's no more keystrokes than vim, and hardly more than any other editor, but for complex operations it lets you tailor and preview them as you go. The thing that confuses me is why it would even be a debate that this is better.

Because immediate visual feedback is more natural than having to imagine an operation in your head, it's the same logic for multiple cursors - where it's even harder to understand what "change this word" will actually change.

> why THAT of all things?

Because that's a fundamental improvement

There were a few blogs with more detailed explanations, not sure about Helix, but kakoune had it covered https://kakoune.org/why-kakoune/why-kakoune.html

> Kakoune tries hard to fix one of the big problems with the vi model: its lack of interactivity. Because of the verb followed by object grammar, vi changes are made in the dark, we don’t see their effect until the whole editing sentence is finished

the lack of a `gq` equivalent to reflow a paragraph, which julia mentioned, was the nail in the coffin for me when I tried it.

It's a nice project though, I just use that feature constantly

(for kakoune, not helix) i've used kakoune daily for almost 2 years now, and i still mix up e.g. `(?<!` vs `(?!<` for lookbehind regexes. i appreciate the ability to select a region and watch whether my regex has selected what i expect.

but, this is probably less important than the simplicity of the selection first model, as it ties into multisel, etc. a selection is a cursor and an anchor. other keys manipulate the selection(s) in very particular ways, which are predictable. external tools interface easily with the selection format, as it represents cursors and anchors.

each benefit taken alone is quite small, but together they offer kakoune a very lean, predictable design when combined with its use of external programs for tasks like sorts or paragraph reflows.

helix is similar to kakoune w.r.t. the editing model. kakoune has `w` to select the next word (and move the anchor to the start of the next word), and `W` to select the next word (and keep the anchor where it is, so you now have two words selected). helix has `v` to enter visual mode, which is essentially equivalent to caps lock with kakoune --- `vw` in helix is equivalent to `W` in kakoune (i believe).

i think selection first is better, but i think it's fair to prefer vim's style, obviously. but there's certainly ample reasoning, though helix might not explain it thoroughly, because (at least, at one point) they may have expected users to have viewed kakoune previously, and understand its philosophy, as helix is essentially a batteries-included kakoune (and kakoune explains the reasoning quite thoroughly).

I use both helix and vim every day. After a while your brain just adjusts. It's like playing on playstation and nintendo for a long time. Eventually as soon as your hands touch the controller it switches to the appropriate mode.

Where does evil-mode land?