I would rather not live my life with the sole purpose of people pleasing managers
There’s no part of expecting people to hand you money that doesn’t obviously lead to your sole purpose being to please those people. Even if you’re a solo contractor you’re going to spend your time pleasing clients - sure, you can shed bad ones more easily than you can a bad manager, but you’re still beholden to someone who controls the purse. If you found a start up you’re pleasing your investors. If you’re a CEO of a large company you’re pleasing your board.
Work is just the act of pleasing other people in specific ways based on your skillset.
IMO, the people who need to be pleased are the customers, and, IME, management's expectations very often run contrary to those of the customers.
Turns out that anagement really doesn't like negative feedback from engineers which turns out to be echoed by users. I'd rather see career advice on how to prevent management from tanking the company without causing them to resent the engineer(s).
Conversely, if you're mediocre, there's nowhere to hide.
Or maybe instead of saying there aren't politics at small companies, it's more accurate to say that there are politics, but they're simple--everyone strives to make the (hopefully benevolent) dictator, I mean founder, happy. If your founder is awesome, life is good. If your founder is not awesome, well, everyone is going to have a bad time anyway.
I thoroughly believed this after working at a small company with little politics in one of my first jobs.
But then a couple of the later small companies/startups I worked for had politics to such an insane degree that I no longer believe small companies are better or worse in general. They just have a larger variance.
The larger the company, the more the workforce trends toward the mean. When you hire 10,000 people you can't exclusively build a company of low-politics people.
With a 10-person company you technically can build that company of mostyl 1-in-100 employees who work well together. However, you could also stumble into a company where you're working with 10 people who have worked together previously and have no intention of bringing you into their inner circle. The politics at this latter type of company is truly next level hell because there's nowhere to go, unlike at a big company or FAANG where you can transfer teams or rely on your resume to get you into the application process at another company easily.
> It's just obvious to everyone who is delivering value and who is not.
In my experience at highly political small companies, this doesn't matter. The people running the political show want the upper echelon of the company to be composed of their close friends and allies. They want the people who produce to be stuck doing the grunt work.
This does not align with my experience at small tech companies at all, and I've worked an many.
But the flavor of the politics is very different. At a small company as an IC you will very likely be working directly with multiple C-levels, often providing important context between them. A senior IC will need to be reaching out pretty actively across teams to make sure things are happening and you'll quickly build an internal network of "good people who get shit done fast".
Politics can seem no existent because in some cases just getting along well with leadership can be enough to make your life very easy. But you'll see how truly political these situations are if you have the opposite situation: someone in leadership just doesn't like you. One bad relationship can ruin you in a small company.
In a large company it's not too hard to just keep your head down (at least as an IC) and largely let your manager worry about politics. For managers it can seem more political because typically the "be friends with leadership" doesn't work because the hierarchy is both broader and deeper.
I’ve gotten along with _almost_ every person I’ve worked with, including some pretty challenging personalities. I’ve always done very well at my job duties and gone “above and beyond” regularly. The only times I felt that might not be nearly enough, was at the two large companies I’ve worked at. Someone several levels away from me, that I would never meet, would decide whether I got a promotion or a raise or a juicy new assignment based on a game of organizational telephone. Frankly, when I tried I did pretty well at that game, but it was the first time in my career that I was tempted to do something out of cynical self ambition or winning rewards for my team instead of just trying to do the right thing for the customer or the business.
That’s what I think of when I hear “politics” and why, by comparison, it felt to me like at a small enough scale it’s not a thing. But if politics means needing leadership to like and appreciate you, then yeah absolutely, that is true anywhere there’s even one level of hierarchy.
This line alone makes me believe you've never worked at small companies.
Small companies are where people who don't have better options go to coast either voluntarily, or involuntarily.
The main divide I've seen between what makes people happy in one or the other style tech company is whether they really enjoy solving problems or doing their job. If you want to check in, do only what is technically required of you and get out, then big tech corp is for you. If you are mainly interested in finding solutions to problems and you are happy to employ whatever is necessary to do so, you'll have more enjoy small companies much more.
I would swear by this when I started working in IT, but 3y later I changed job and took a gig at a big corporation. It was eye opening and jaw dropping. Everything was lightyears ahead in terms of tech, management, money, investments in people, and much more compared to the small company. It geniuinely made me mad for not doing this sooner.
Of course there's a lot of variance among small companies (much moreso than large ones). But the one thing that all small companies have is people who can actually get shit done not matter what it requires. The amount of "not my lane" nonsense that occupies corporate life is both exhausting and boring. I understand why this exists for practical reasons, but it's no fun.
But I still did the same thing the article and commenters suggested. I stayed strictly aligned with what the CTO wanted and just from that, I was able to guide the entire technical architecture of the company for two years even though I had no hands on experience with AWS.
Let’s not be fooled though. My next job after that startup that had 60 people was at the second largest employer in the US - AWS working in the consulting division (AWS Professional Services).
It was an immediate 50% bump in pay. An even greater contrast is that an intern I mentored got a return offer at 22 in 2022 that was the same I made at 46 in 2020. They are now at 25 making slightly more than I’m making at a medium size third party consulting company working full time as a staff consultant.
Your principled stand is leaving a lot of money on the table.
At 51, I would rather get a daily anal probe with a cactus than ever work at any large company again and I have turned down a position that was going to be created for me at another large well known non technical company where a former coworker was a director and ignored overtures from GCP in their professional services department that would pay a lot more.
I also wouldn’t like the company I work at now with around 700 people if I weren’t brought in as a staff engineer where I have almost complete autonomy on how I lead my projects and the ear of the CxOs
But let’s not pretend the extra $75K to $100K+ I could be making isn’t worth playing politics. I’m just at a place in life where I can prioritize other things than money.
Also, at 51, I’ve learned a few things. Not to make your “career” at any company and to always be prepared to jump ship when the environment changes or the raises don’t keep up with the market. I’m now on my 10th job.
If I were 22 post 2010, instead of 1996, you damn well better be believe I would have been “grinding leetcode to get into a FAANG” instead of wallowing in enterprise dev making what a returning intern makes at BigTech.
I’m not bitter, by 2012 I was 38, recently remarried and wasn’t about to uproot my (step)kids. But by youngest graduated from high school in May 2020 and I had an offer from BigTech June of 2020.
I definitely encourage any younger developer to play the game.
As far as jumping ship, if my goal is to exchange labor for money, why wouldn’t I exchange the most money for my labor given my other priorities? Instead of letting a company pay me less than market value or even worse what they pay someone coming in at my level.
Besides, I had my first house built in 2002 for $175K when I was making $65K and had no student loans. Neither is true for most students graduating today.
And it’s copium thinking that people at BigTech making 50%+ more at every level work that much harder than an enterprise CRUD developer doing Java at a bank.
I’m not advocating someone works 70 hours a week at a startup getting underpaid with the promise of “equity” that will statistically be worthless. I am advocating they get paid in cash and/or RSUs and immediately sell as soon as they vest and diversify.
And next year will be my 30th year working, I’ve never experienced burn out because I exercise my agency to say “no” to being overworked knowing I could get another job worse case and continue exchanging my labor for money and stay housed and fed.
When you're invested in the success of the business above all else, and you make that known, you'll carve out a position where you're valued.
Not because you went on a "carving out your importance" mission, but because your energy goes into your work, and the details and care for the long term business objectives. Also... you can then enjoy yourself more, which opens creativity which opens innovation. Sometimes this might mean disagreeing with managers or working on stuff nobody really knows you're working on right now.
> "So if you want to get something technical done in a tech company, you ought to wait for the appropriate wave"
No. That doesn't work. You have to start building it. Don't wait.
You still need to:
1. Be good at what you do.
2. Be good at politics/communication when that's needed.
3. Be in an organization that has good people and also cares. There are organizations where there's just a complete disconnect from the business for various reasons. Dysfunctional.
Picking your battles;
Negotiate rather than fight;
Be better at analytics and research than anyone else. So you have the data to measure or predict success about a particular feature or direction.
Armed with your data, you must carefully communicate findings without shaming others.
One time a manager hinted to me to be a snitch on my coworkers just so he could see I have “leader” attributes to get promoted later. Stay away from corps..
This isn’t a thread about your whole life.