Why Do You Work So Hard? | Hacker News Reader

Why Do You Work So Hard?

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33 pointsyters29 comments

I joined a new company. about 40 people, semi-startup mode. I was working on larger company (about 220+ ) people, and after going through 6 managers in two years, with the latest being the corporate/pointy hair type, I had enough. I stopped working hard, and I realized I needed to move on doing something more meaningful. So I joined a small company that is in the beginning of executing a new strategy (yes a gamble, but all startups are). I am working extra hard, full cylinders firing. I believe "performance = ability + motivation". I have both right now, and my work is really showing it. Here are the main motivators for me:

1. Green card and freedom -- The process takes long time, so I need to make sure the company is doing good and it will be around when the process is done, otherwise I will be in trouble. Meaning going the extra mile about everything I do. Meaning that everything I do, is to secure the company is doing well and will be around. For other people might be their mortgage they have to pay, or expecting kids, or other responsibilities.

2. Pay is good. Really good. --HR types love to say that pay is not a motivator, but I can say for sure that low pay is sure DE-Motivator. And pay is relative. When everybody else is getting a pay-cut,and I got a huge raise, it makes me motivated to work extra hard to make the money they are paying worth it. And honestly, a large pay, makes me feel more appreciated.

3. Visibility and work relevance -- I make a huge difference in this company. I am about 10% of the technical output of the company. I work in very important project, and my direct performance has a lot of say on the future of the company. When you are one of one hundred engineers, your direct performance matters less. You can slack off (work half the time), and it only affects .5% of the engineering output. When you are one of the 12 engines, there is a huge responsibility on your shoulders.

4. Management hears what I say. -- If you are good, you can truly excel and shine in small companies/startups. My manager and director are impressed by what I am doing, and they hear my feedback, and act on it accordingly. I am not just a cog, replaceable widget, but a important part of the company. Replaceable, (yes, everybody is), but at a great expense. They realize that I am totally vested on the company's success, so my comments/suggestions are selfless, not self-promoting, but how to get things done faster and better.

5. Stock options -- Yes, I have a bunch of them. But they are more of a bet. I am not planing to be rich on them (maybe the founders will), but it is nice to know that if the company will do really well, then I get a piece of the pie too.

Not long ago, the CEO of one of the largest and most powerful international real estate firms in the nation quit his job. Stepped down. Not, as you might imagine, for retirement and not to play more golf and not to travel the world staying only in Four Seasons suites, but to work on rebuilding his relationship with his estranged wife.

CEOs always say they want to spend more time with their family when they step down. To me, it seems like good timing for the CEO of a real estate company to step down before the current meltdown.

This is true. However, there is a difference between, "I'd like to spend more time with my family," which is, as you say, kind of a generic excuse, and, "I want to rebuild my relationship with my estranged wife," which is a lot more personal and displays a level of vulnerability. Add to that the insider comments on the touchingness of the memo and I think it's unlikely that this was the typical generic excuse.

Then there's another article on the front page (From $80,000 a year to eviction) full of stories of people leaving their jobs and then getting screwed when they need a new one.

Not everything is as simple as "leave your crappy, back-breaking job and you'll be happy." At the very least, you need enough money to live with some level of comfort.

Yes, people are focussing on the wrong thing here at HN:

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=455233

I say many people here are interested in startups more for the sake of financial freedom than for making cool stuff. The startup aspects of startups only detract from making cool stuff. So, we should be focusing more on financial freedom.

Not in the sense of constricting all HN posts to be about financial freedom, but at least devoting some thought to developing easy, dependable, and efficient plans for achieving it. As of now, I have seen 0 posts, excluding my own, on the topic. I don't expect people to jump on my bandwagon, or do my work for me. But, I will put together a plan and post it within the next couple months, to prove my point.

Here is my preliminary work, from awhile ago:

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=122341

If you're studying for an N.D., you're not in medical school.

This comment has absolutely nothing to do with the point of the article -- it's just a snarky attack on the author's sister.

You're the one who is interpreting the snark and the attack. It was a statement of fact with no judgment at all.

The comment has nothing to do with the subject of the article. It is a criticism of one minor statement, in one sentence of a piece that has absolutely nothing to do with medicine nor naturopathy, nor the difference between them.

I thought that the editorial was a great piece of writing, with provocative questions that matter deeply to most of us. Yet, of the universe of insightful things that could have been said about the meaning of work, the American work ethic, or the value of work/life balance, a one-line, off-topic comment has been voted the second most insightful remark in the thread. No, it's not ad hominem (because it doesn't go so far as to discredit the author's opinion based on his sister's degree), but it's close.

Finally, a factual correction. The author's sister could have been pursuing a degree in pickle studies at Hamburger University for all I care; his point would have been just as valid. But regardless of your personal feelings about naturopathy, NDs are certified to prescribe medicines and perform surgical procedures in at least a dozen states, and in some others, they're even licensed to be primary care providers. That sure sounds like "medicine" to me.

I initially upvoted you because I agree with your comment itself, but on reflection, this is the kind of response I'd expect from...other online news communities. Picking out one relatively irrelevant line from an article because it touches on an issue about which you have an opinion doesn't facilitate good conversation about the article itself.

Why do I work so hard?

Because I friggin' love my job! While there are parts of it that suck (like any job), on balance it's so completely enjoyable that I have a hard time relating to people for whom work is a grind.

There is no mythical secret to why I work so hard, its quite simple really.

I work hard, because I enjoy what I do.

I wrote a couple related posts recently:

Lack of financial freedom discussion on HN

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=455233

Poll on purpose for doing a startup

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=455335

Others from awhile ago:

A little research I've done on becoming financially free

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=122341

Asking who gives away financial freedom

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=60793

spend 14 hours a day at the office

What's that got to do with hard work?

The fact is, fellow hackers, as much as we'd all hate to admit it, hardly anyone here knows squat about hard work.

Go ahead and haul those 300 barrels up to the loading dock. Or hot tar that roof when it's 100 degrees out. Or open the restaurant every morning at 6:00 am and feed 2,000 people every day (yes, 7 days per week). And never miss a day or you don't eat. How about painting every room in every school building all day every day until you die. With nothing to look forward to except that maybe, just maybe, someday your grandchildren might go to college.

Don't get me wrong: I'm grateful that I sit at a desk in a heated/air conditioned office making something out of nothing. This was possible at no other time in history.

But please don't confuse long hours with hard work. Too many others really worked hard so that we wouldn't have to.

That is a good point, but not really what the article is about. I probably should have changed the title. It's not so much working hard as working hard on things without good reason.

It is good to work hard to provide for a family.

It is good to work hard to pursue a dream and further human progress.

It is not good to work hard just to gain unused material possessions, especially at the expense of my family.

A little off topic, but I've always felt that physical labour is undervalued in our society. I did some work for a removalist and that was alot harder (and probably more satisfying) than my better-paid office job. My perfect job would involve some blend of physical and knowledge work, but I'm sure the economists would point out the inefficiencies of such a job.

the people that usually do physical labour, generally have lower IQ. (i know, I am heavy generalizing), so to them it is ok.

For a very smart person, just the thought of doing the same physical routine, everyday, will drive them nuts. Even the thought of it can be depressing.

Probably, for a blue collar worker, the idea of sitting all day in front of the computer, and thinking these wierd problems, will drive them nuts too.

A typical day for me is entirely in front of a computer screen, but has over the past year occasionally involved physical work actually putting together a robot. I can attest, some time away from the PC doing mechanical work can be nice.

Work has nothing to do with pain or physical discomfort.

Thinking is hard.

I totally agree with this. My brother is a nurse. Although he works for 8-9 hours straight and mostly standing up, when he gets home, he rests and relaxes. I on the other hand work 9 hours a day sitting on a chair. When I get home I still think of work and other freelance projects. I can't relax and I get tired even though I work sitting down :-/

The fact is, fellow hackers, as much as we'd all hate to admit it, hardly anyone here knows squat about hard work.

Are you saying that only physical labor fits in the definition of hard work?

Hauling barrels? Luxury. How about licking the road clean with your tongue?

Nonsense. When I was your age I was killing Nazis for a living.

Kids these days...

I'm glad to see this perspective here. It's bizarre how much of a sense of entitlement we can get working at jobs whose high-level description is 'go build cool stuff', and where if you're any good and you don't like the one you're at, there are 10 more looking for you even in a down economy.

I've already worked 32 hours this week (I usually work a 40 hour week) and I've been wondering that myself.I don't even really care about the money except that if I get laid off I don't have to worry for probably a year or so..

back to work.

Simple: so I don't have to work hard later.

Plus, web development is fun.

I don't.

The article is fairly substance free, but I like to encourage the sentiment.

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