A real fMRI high: My ecstasy brain scan
newscientist.com
newscientist.com
( http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/jan/23/magic-mushroom... )
For any of you HNers out there hesitant to utilizing any of these of substances in your life, remember that they help change your perspective and allow you to look at problems from new angles. I will leave you with a Steve Jobs quote on the topic:
“Taking LSD was a profound experience, one of the most important things in my life. LSD shows you that there’s another side to the coin, and you can’t remember it when it wears off, but you know it. It reinforced my sense of what was important—creating great things instead of making money, putting things back into the stream of history and of human consciousness as much as I could.”
In combination with meditation I found the experience quite manageable, and unique in terms of the concepts I could explore and the insights into existing situations in my life.
I can see how recreational use can be quite damaging, but with the right intent and goals, deliberate application of psychedelics for troubleshooting and problem solving is something I'd happily explore again if it were more acceptable where I live.
It is a matter of looking at these substances as entheogens (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entheogens) and not a party tools and considering yourself a Psychonaut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychonaut) and not a party animal.
After the first couple of hours of my trip I introduced a lot of metal music and horror films to see exactly where it would go. There was nothing pleasant about that experience but I felt together enough to still observe it without being lost in it. However I couldn't consider deeply enough how horrifying it would be if you didn't have some sort of anchor inside of the experience.
For anyone who thinks this is airy-fairy crap, I can provide a very real example. I've been taking MDMA regularly for the last 6 months (~2 doses x 2 instances per month) and recently, after coming home while peaking I admitted to my partner of 9 years how I'd been abused as a child by particular relatives. I'd never told anyone up until that point, and it was what had been driving my alcoholism since my early 20's (now early 30's). As I recalled some of the details to her, what would have normally made me break down instead made me reflect on those events. I moved those memories from a traumatic area to a (for lack of a better phrase) "done and dusted" area. I made peace with those people and made peace with myself. Since then my desire to drink to excess has waned, and what was a constant anxiety is quickly fading.
For anyone who has a dark side, I recommend you try MDMA - especially in the company of someone you love or trust.
I disagree. Twice a month (two pills /in one night/ ~ two weeks apart) and doing it in a social situation isn't indicative of abuse or dependency. It's indicative of recreational use.
> The current thinking is that such frequent use does not give your brain nearly enough time to recover and can lead to serious negative life-long consequences, such as depression.
You are correct regarding depression - at least on a temporary basis. However the latest and most comprehensive study funded by NIDA has shown no marked residual cognitive effects in ecstasy users. See my other comment for more details including a link to the study: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4541273
> if you didn't hear about it previously, is so-called "loss of magic."
I hadn't heard of it but I looked it up. My experience to date, having tried different [MDMA] pills, is that you have mixed results. The most recent ones I've taken have been the best in terms of shortest activation time, "peak" and lack of come-down. It's likely correlated to the total MDMA content of the pill. YMMV.
"MATERIALS AND METHOD:
We prospectively studied, as part of the NeXT (Netherlands XTC toxicity) study, sustained effects of a low dose of ecstasy on brain function in 25 subjects before and after their first episode of ecstasy use (mean 2.0 +/- 1.4 ecstasy pills, on average 11.1 +/- 12.9 weeks since last ecstasy use), compared to 24 persistent ecstasy-naive controls, also measured twice and matched with the novice users on age, gender, IQ, and cannabis use. Cognitive brain function was measured in the domains of working memory, selective attention, and associative memory using fMRI.
RESULTS: No significant effects were found of a low dose of ecstasy on working memory, selective attention, or associative memory neither at the behavioral level nor at the neurophysiological level.
CONCLUSIONS: This study yielded no firm evidence for sustained effects of a low dose of ecstasy on human cognitive brain function. The present findings are relevant for the development of prevention and harm reduction strategies. Furthermore, the study is relevant to the discussion concerning potential therapeutic use of ecstasy. "
I've also had psilocybin on 5 occasions. The first and second were particularly scary, because I held so tightly to my "normal" self. I then learned to completely abandon myself to the drug, and I've come out of the last three experiences with an unusually great outlook on life.
And as the Greek already knew, pleasure resides in moderation. To anyone wanting to try psychedelic drugs, my opinion is the same as matznerd's.
Bullshit.
http://www.wired.com/magazine/2012/02/ff_forgettingpill/all/...
Simplification: the act of recollection involves the memory being erased and then rewritten. If you're "happy" when you rewrite it then some of the negative emotions get knocked off for the next time you recall it.
In case anyone is not already aware, David Nutt was the head of the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD), a scientific advisory body to the UK government. In 2009 he published an editorial comparing the harm from taking ecstasy (MDMA) to the harm from horse riding (in short, you can make a powerful case that horse riding is much more dangerous than taking ecstasy). In October 2009 he was dismissed from his position, because "he cannot be both a government adviser and a campaigner against government policy."
In my view it was a terrible decision by the UK government, and showcased their reluctance to make evidence-based decisions on politically charged subjects (like drugs, prison sentences, immigration etc). Since then, David Nutt has formed the Independent Scientific Committee on Drugs (ISCD), whose website [1] is well worth visiting if you want the most up to date and scientifically reliable information on drugs.
http://www.amazon.com/Drugs-Without-Hot-David-Nutt/dp/190686...
edit: Economist review of said book: http://www.economist.com/node/21560223
Recreational use of MDMA has given me panic attacks, increased anxiety, emotional dependence and depression. There is a lot of anecdotal evidence online that tells the same story, which is something you rarely hear anyone talk about. It seems like different people respond differently to MDMA. Perhaps it's dependent on your personality or brain chemistry. For people like me the effect on the serotonin system in the brain can be very dangerous and sometimes cause permanent damage.
I used to be very liberal towards drug use in general until I experienced the down sides first hand.
Did you have a test kit to determine whether your experience was actually with pure MDMA?
This is pretty important when talking about recreational use of MDMA. It's often pretty hard to find reasonably pure MDMA in many parts of the US. For more information on what pure MDMA looks like and common adulterants, erowid.org is a great resource.
http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/02/05/ecstasy-related-deat...
"Ecstasy is so consistently adulterated that when pure MDMA turns up on the street, it’s likely be to sold on the street under the name MDMA or sometimes “Molly.” Corporal Luc Chicoine, the national co-ordinator for the RCMP’s pharmaceutical and synthetic drug operations, has worked on the street in drug operations for 18 years and said he can’t remember ever seeing pure MDMA."
http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/03/19/deaths-spur-research...
"For a sense of just what might be in a given pill, Hudson points to Ecstasydata.org — a Sacramento-based website listing active ingredients and proportions in mailed-in samples — which has tested thousands of hits of “ecstasy” since 2001.
A growing majority contain no ecstasy at all. Since 2010, 61% of 533 samples tested had no MDMA, with 111 containing the drug, and another 96 some combination of MDMA and other chemicals. Of 27 Canadian samples studied since 2010, 14 active chemicals were discovered, including caffeine, methamphetamine, benzylpiperazine (BZP) and procaine."
The short version is that there is lots of DEA-funded propaganda and verifiably flawed scientific studies out there. Buddhist monks and therapists have used MDMA before in their practice where they claim that one dose of MDMA is equivalent to a full year of couples therapy. I'm really glad more research is going on in the open about MDMA; for too long it's just been the DEA using fear mongering.
Psychedelics have become a small but important part of my spiritual practice, yet I do not belong to Santo Daime or the UDV so my practice is illegal. I find it strange and quite sad that a person following his or her own path is not granted the same legal rights as someone who chooses a path with the defined structure of a church. I guess we haven't gotten past persecuting our alchemists and witches yet.
Mushrooms, MDMA, DMT, are category 1 drugs in the US, which means that there is no known medical use for them according to the government. This is a very sad joke.
This is why it's impossible to do a truly double blind study of this kind. So you give them MDMA or psilocybin and ask if it helped their PTSD therapy or if they had a religious experience, and they are more likely to say yes.
I remember, years ago, seeing brain scans showing something like serotonin receptors before MDMA usage, and months after, and if i remember right, things hadn't gotten back to normal long after. Anyone know anything about the long term effects?
"New Study Finds No Cognitive Impairment Among Ecstasy Users
[...] a team of researchers has conducted one of the largest studies ever undertaken to re-examine the cognitive effects of ecstasy, funded by a $1.8 million grant from the National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA) and published in the journal Addiction."
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/02/110215081736.ht...
Conclusion from the actual study (journal behind paywall):
"In a study designed to minimize limitations found in many prior investigations, we failed to demonstrate marked residual cognitive effects in ecstasy users. This finding contrasts with many previous findings—including our own—and emphasizes the need for continued caution in interpreting field studies of cognitive function in illicit ecstasy users."
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1360-0443.2010....
Dear Dr. Shulgin:
Lately I've been hearing a lot of talk about how every
time you take ecstasy it does permanent damage to the
brain. I've also heard that ecstasy puts holes in the
brain. Are these statements true?
-- Road Dog
Dear Road Dog:
No, they are not. The "permanent brain damage" is based
totally on studies done with experimental animals, with
the findings extrapolated to encompass the human subject.
In a simple statement, there have been no studies in man
that have indicated brain damage.
The "holes in the brain" is an even more outrageous
deception. These popular holes are areas in brain scans
that appear less active in attracting radiolabelled agents
that are agonists for certain receptor site areas. The
pictures that are shown for comparison are not of the same
person with or without MDMA in them, but of different
people, one of whom has used a lot of ecstasy and the
other one without any such history. The quintessence of
this line of mythology is an article that appeared
recently in the Willamette Week. It not only assured the
reader that there were holes generated by serotonin loss,
but that they became flooded with dopamine (the default
neurotransmitter) and, being attacked by hydrogen
peroxide, produced rust.
Sorry, drug warriors. No damage, no holes, no rust.
-- Dr. Shulgin
I can also strongly recommend reading the information on MDMA (and other psychoactive substances) on erowid.org[3][1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Shulgin
[2] - http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/shulgin/adsarchive/brainhole...
I wonder to what extent this can affect the readings of the MRI. Any brain scientist in the crowd?
'The hypothesis was that MDMA would make the negative memories less painful. "We saw a boosted brain response to positive memories, and a weaker response to negative ones," says Carhart-Harris. "It fits the idea that MDMA can help people access negative memories without being overwhelmed by them and they might be able to change the way they feel about what happened."'
I have Asperger's, and so not only have I a pallid response to gore or human pain but I can understand it, visualize it, repeat it in thought, allot it a mental space. Horrific murder is latent with images, which I believe only become a growing gestalt in the mind's of those humans with Optimally Performing Long-Term Memories. It is perpetual moral education, as if with an admonishing tone, on the significance of human life. The morbid sense of humor which Aspies tend to develop becomes a fatal flaw in a world incapable of sustaining its own net happiness. (News which promulgates, indirectly, our Net Unhappiness Quotient. -- News becomes the Negative Nancy to unwitting optimists, aspie or otherwise. Granted, good news without explanation is pointless, and News' marketing format is non-amenable to Demonstration, Explanation, Maturation, and Observation (DEMO) of Knowledge.)
Of course a point is often made that industrial capitalism depends on a sufficiently self-imposed unhappiness, otherwise "no one would work," etc. The cost, however, is that those who can remember what is good in "bargain reality," and remember it well, flack and flail at those who are habitually forgetful, habitually like an agent whose sense of time must be perpetually engineered for them.
MDMA does not "wake one up" but established a greater memory retention for those events existentially nurturing to one's happiness.
Indeed, though I would add that, in addition to increasing memory retention, it makes possible events that are themselves more existentially nurturing than one would normally experience.
The first experience on MDMA is often the most seratonin one has ever 'felt', which is to say it is often the 'happiest' one has ever felt (though it is a very specific kind of happiness).
The memory of that experience can set, if you will, a new bar for how 'good' life can be.