Apple iPhone 5 US Carrier Comparison Chart | Hacker News Reader

Apple iPhone 5 US Carrier Comparison Chart

mgalligan.com

80 pointsindiekid104 comments

Here’s a comparison chart I made to compare the different reasons to choose AT&T, Sprint, or Verizon as your carrier for the iPhone 5.

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This is cool but if you could, please add prepaid? Specifically add the following?

- 4th column for StraighTalk as one of the carriers

- 5th column for Tmobile as one of the carriers)

- Cost to buy iphone (199 normally, but full price prepaid)

- Cost over the entire life of the plan

See:

- Tmobile: http://9to5mac.com/2012/09/10/t-mobile-unveils-its-big-plans...

- StraighTalk: http://9to5mac.com/2012/07/30/review-the-iphone-on-straight-...

Note: Since StraightTalk resells AT&T using their own antennas, the available service would be same. Correct?

Also Cricket/Leap Wireless which is the only iPhone 5 announced yet

There's no point in adding Straight Talk at this time because official word (via their Twitter) is that they do not have nano SIMs and they have no (announce-able) plans to sell nano SIMs at this time.

Micro-SIMs cannot be cut down to nano-SIM dimensions and be used.

Why not? Is there a difference in the actual chip? I thought it was just a trimming of the plastic around the chip.

Nano sims are also thinner.

Source: http://www.gottabemobile.com/2012/09/12/dont-plan-on-cutting...

But it looks like you can hack it: http://www.idownloadblog.com/2012/09/14/convert-micro-sim-ip...

StraightTalk doesn't have LTE. I'm not sure if an iPhone 4S claims it is using 4G as it does on AT&T.

Americans pay a LOT for their cellular service. I mean $100/month is just absolutely insane.

Currently I pay about $17/month but if I wanted unlimited everything I could get it for $32/month.

We don't pay to receive calls or texts however so there is little need to have "unlimited" either. Even the thought that I am paying for advertisers to send me junk text messages or calls would drive me insane, if I was in the US.

The US and Canada really have it rough with mobile and internet services...

I was shocked at the dropped call rates. I can't recall the last time I got a dropped call, a 4.6% has to bee annoying.

Cherry-picking one number and comparing it to another country by converting the dollar amount is a ridiculous and meaningless comparison.

Looking on here:

http://shop.o2.co.uk/mobile_phone/pay_monthly/24_months/Medi...

It looks like the cost is $70/month for unlimited text/voice and 1 GB of data. That doesn't seem much cheaper at all to me.

I'm living in NYC and paying ~$80/month for limited everything (900 minutes/1000 texts/2GB/other perks but other discounts).

I visited Berlin in June. I prepaid 15 Eur for unlimited one week everything on Vodafone. I could have gotten prepaid everything for 30 Eur/month, but I was only there for a week.

And the 3G speeds I received were actually higher than the ones I usually get in NYC.

What about prepaid?

I'm dying to find out if, say, Cricket or Virgin's iPhone5 plans will be any better - I'm willing to buy up front.

Same here. I'm curious to know what Sprint LTE coverage will be like once it launches here in Southern California. Hopefully it's better than their 3G coverage/equivalent speeds compared to other carriers (Virgin is on Sprint's network).

Has Virgin confirmed iPhone 5? The only one I've seen so far is Cricket. I'm just hoping that the $25 unlimited data & messaging with 300 minutes plan is available!

Looks like Virgin has announced their pricing for Australia but not for the US: http://www.virginmobile.com.au/iphone

Virgin's iPhone5 will likely remain a better value than any subscription option mentioned in the article. Unfortunately Sprint (and therefore Virgin) can't get close to Verizon's US 4G coverage.

Those Australia plans all have stiff data caps. Will that be the same in the US as well? Hopefully we can still get the unlimited plan for $35/month.

Not relevant to LTE devices AFIAK, but I bought my Android phone outright and have it on the $30/month T-mo unlimited data, text, 100 mins plan. Couldn't be happier with it. Amazed to think I was spending over $100 with AT&T before.

I really fail to see why 'tethering' should cost you anything, _especially_ if you're capped in bandwidth already. If you pay for x GB you should be able to use as much, using any device you like. Weird.

Imagine how much of an advantage it'd be to only enforce a 1 year contract. That'd be a huge differentiator, as it would allow you to upgrade your iPhone on it's yearly release. I'm sure that would cause a massive switch in carriers for Apple fans.

In Canada, it would be great if they started 2 year contracts like the USA.

Imagine if they just gave you the phone, no contract. Someone is eating that cost. In the US, you get a subsidy on the phone, but you also get locked in. That's how the industry works and no one really does anything different (TMobile tried for a while).

If you buy the phone outright, T-mobile no-contract plans work out to cost less than subsidized contracts, as it should be. The other carriers want 2-year lock-in so bad that they refuse to offer different terms when you own the phone.

Or just buy it unlocked and use Straight Talk (which is AT&T).

This comment: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4523530 ... indicates that won't happen, as Straight-Talk won't offer NanoSims

AT&T used to allow iPhone users an upgrade annually for the new iPhone despite being on a two-year contract. I'm not sure if they have for this round, but every other year, they simply changed upgrade eligibility for iPhone users right before the iPhone came out.

The problem is that this is very expensive. An iPhone costs $650 and you get it for $200. That means that the carrier is eating $450. Even if you argue that a carrier is getting a discount and it's only costing them $300-350, they have to earn that back. $300-350 over 12 months is $25-29.17 per month that they have to earn back, plus interest. So, you have a $30 data plan, and only $0.83-$5 of that is going to actually implementing, maintaining, etc. the network. If they're subsidizing the device by $400, giving you an upgrade ever 12 months would mean taking a loss of $40 not including the cost of creating and maintaining the network.

So, it's quite detrimental to a company's bottom line to offer that to the point that it isn't wonderfully feasible. Sure, you can say that it gets you the voice plans of those people who switch and maybe that can go to the subsidy as well and whatnot, but the margins are thin. I'm quite literally paying $40/mo for my iPhone plan as an add-on to a family plan (plus 1/5th of $20 for texting ($4) and 1/5th of $70 for voice ($14)). So, I'm paying a total of $58 and getting a $450 discount on the device. $450 over 12 months is $37.50 plus interest and so I would only be paying $20.50 per month for my actual usage. Even if I bring my own phone, there isn't a carrier that would give me a price near that low.

Frankly, I think it would be better for uses to pay the $649 up-front and have cheaper plans (and this does happen in many countries and can happen here if you want to buy the iPhone 5 for T-Mobile). However, even there I wouldn't be getting such a value. T-Mobile offers 500 minutes plus texting plus 2GB of data for $50/mo. For $8 more on a family plan, I'm getting $450 off my device which even if I can only upgrade every 24 months is an $18.75/mo value.

It would definitely be a huge differentiator. AT&T did this for many years to keep Apple fans happy and to prevent their yelling from overwhelming the press around the new device. However, it's really expensive. Even if you gained more customers, it likely wouldn't be worth it.

If you ask nicely, AT&T will upgrade every year -- they have for me. They'll tell you about the "early upgrade fee" ($250), so just ask them what your current early termination fee is -- it'll be less (that's why they raised it last year).

So you pay the ETF and switch to Verizon. If you got the 4S last year, you're looking at $215 right now for an ETF vs $250 for the "early upgrade fee". Chances are, they want to retain you as a customer, so they'll waive the upgrade fee.

I certainly don't feel bad for AT&T, my average monthly bill is $130, so I'm paying them ~$1600 in monthlies per year plus the annual $200 (& change!) upgrade fee. So I don't think it's unreasonable to get a new $650 iPhone each year for the $2K I'm paying (which as you say probably only costs them $350).

I just wish they'd formalize this into a "Apple fanboi" plan so I don't have to threaten to cancel, argue with managers etc to get that shiny new phone on release day!

Full disclosure: I do sell the previous phone via eBay, so I guess I'm at least making the $200 upgrade fee back.

Hmm, the AT&t prices are too high based on their new mobile share plan. $70 for 4 gigs and $40 per smartphone with unlimited talk and text.

http://www.att.com/mobileshare

Does anyone have info on the Sprint tethering pricing listed here? I don't see it on their site or a Google search, and the existence of such would be very compelling for me (obnoxious overage price notwithstanding).

They had the info when I was checking out. I don't remember the specific amounts of data, but the rates were +$20 and +$50 per month to your plan.

I saw that as well... 2 and 6 gb. I understood the infographic to mean a base amount of tethering data was free per month, which sure isn't how it looks on Sprint's site.

I also interpreted the infographic to mean that you can tether up to 5GB per month for free, but I think that's incorrect.

I can update the chart if someone finds a definitive price.

Not relevant for people who switch phone in two years, but AT&T's phone unlocking at the end of the contract or with account charges taken care of, is pretty neat.

If a Verizon account has been in good standing for at least 60 days, supposedly they'll unlock your device: http://news.cnet.com/8301-30686_3-57361283-266/will-verizon-...

Only for international use. Domestic use is still locked to Verizon.

Here's the AT&T unlock request page for anyone looking to unlock their out-of-contract iPhone4(S): https://www.att.com/deviceunlock/

I put in my request yesterday, but it has yet to go through...

Not looking forward to basically a 100% increase in my bill when Verizon pulls the plug on the grandfather unlimited plans.

I felt that was a disingenuous part of the chart. The author said that FaceTime only worked over cellular for AT&T when you moved to a shared data plan, but always worked on Verizon. That's technically true, but only really because Verizon won't offer customers subsidized pricing without moving to a shared data plan.

From Verizon's perspective, if you pay their post-pay rates and bring your own iPhone, you're paying them an additional $18+/mo since they don't have to cover the subsidy. As such, if you have a grandfathered plan, they care less since you're basically paying for a higher rate plan by not using a subsidy.

That $18.75/month buys you much more than unlimited data, if it's a truly unlocked phone.

It's a CDMA phone which by definition can't be unlocked.

That's not true. CDMA is just one band. The iPhone 5 supports multiple bands, including GSM bands and LTE bands. It also includes a SIM card slot. The iPhone 5 can be unlocked and a new SIM inserted.

Not the iPhone. You can use the SIM internationally but not in the US. Put an AT&T or T-Mobile SIM in your "unlocked" Verizon iPhone and it will not work.

UPDATE: I should also add that if you buy an factory unlocked iPhone from Apple, there is no way to activate it on any CDMA network. CDMA is inherently a locked network.

Sprint seems to have it together on this one.

The biggest drawback for Sprint is their abysmal LTE coverage. They bet too early on with WiMAX and lost out on the LTE train. It's going to be a good long while before they're caught up there.

That's not necessarily true. There is little difference between WiMAX and LTE on all of the hard parts: antenna configuration, transceivers, and amplifiers. Even the modulation scheme is the same: OFDM. Sprint started installing firmware-upgradable base stations a little while ago and I strongly suspect that the process for converting from WiMAX to LTE is governed by staff time limitations than outright technical debt.

Unfortunately LTE-based devices on Sprint still won't be backwards compatible with the converted WiMAX towers as they only output in 2.3 GHz, 2.5 GHz and 3.5 GHz bands. The iPhone 5 specifically maxes out at a 2.1GHz band.

Oh ya, the user terminals out there are going to have to be replaced wholesale. My only point was that Sprint is going to be able to convert to LTE a lot quicker than people expect. Building up a user base is another issue entirely.

They just announced recently that they are planning to have 100 markets covered in the "coming months". http://www.engadget.com/2012/09/10/sprint-announces-huge-lte...

It's even better when you realize you don't have to get the full unlimited plan and can save $30 by getting the 450 plan.

Especially for those of us with grandfathered SERO accounts :)

How are you using one of their "premium" phones in a SERO plan? I had a friend holding out with some crappy WinMo 6.5 phone because switching to Android or iPhone meant leaving SERO.

They changed things up a year or two ago. SERO +$10 gets you any iPhone/Android/Blackberry/etc., and then an additional +$10 for any phone with 4g/LTE.

Only if you live in an area covered by LTE. In my area, city of ~250,000, there is no LTE or plans to implement but I usually have four to five bars on 3G. Seemingly the 3G connection strength would be a good thing but I get 3G data speeds comparable to dial up. If I am not connected to wifi, the data features (Siri, dictation, pic/vid texts etc. etc.) are virtually useless. Trying to browse the internet is also a pointless task about 75% of the time. The unlimited data offered by Sprint is moot point if you can't use LTE.

AT&T: Tethering is included (no additional cost, using your existing data pool) with the new shared data plans.

Corrected that part. Thanks.

You should also fix the cheapest unlimited plan with 4 GB is $110 not $120 with 1 GB.

His AT&T pricing is inaccurate (he is reporting it too low). This looks like a great comparison chart, but the first thing that jumped out at me was the low prices he used for his analysis. After doing my own research it turns out his #'s for w/1 phone is wrong, w/2 phones it's even more wrong, etc.

For people with LTE: Is the difference significant enough to warrant upgrading from a 4 or 4s?

It's typically faster than any Wifi I can connect to. So yeah, absolutely.

Would that still be the case when adoption rate is higher, though?

Does anyone have an idea what kind of internet pipes LTE base stations get, and how much bandwidth they can (realistically) provide to every phone once they are operating at planned capacity?

Same as other guy said. It's so much better than wifi that I leave wifi off all the time (thanks unlimited data!). I can stream netflix/hbogo in high quality with no issues.

It's pretty sweet.

By itself? Probably not. I leave LTE disabled on my Galaxy Nexus to save battery life most of the time. I can't even remember the last time I turned it on. It's nice for tethering I suppose but for normal usage it's not worth the battery cost. If you're on AT&T HSPA+ is actually fairly close to LTE speeds already though the latency is generally higher. I see about 7-8Mbit/sec on Verizon LTE and about 4-5Mbit/sec on AT&T HSPA+ -- not a huge difference.

I actually didn't know only AT&T is able to do voice+data. For me, that option alone seems to justify the carrier choice. Nothing better than looking things up online or checking map directions while staying on the line with somebody.

Yeah, same here. I do this all the time. The fact that AT&T is the cheapest option for me ($75/month for unlimited data, 450min, 1000 sms) and that it's the only one here that does this basically forced me to keep it. — Now, I just have to figure out how to unlock my phone (@cutyoursim?) and whether or not I want to rent a phone for LTE or just get a SIM Card whenever I travel.

I'm sort of debating - I'm grandfathered in w/ one of the AT&T unlimited data contracts at around $80/mo, but am thinking of switching to verizon for the extra LTE bands and what looks like better network support in general...

This doesn't seem right. My individual plan cost me $69/mo for an iPhone 4S with unlimited data. I just switched to a family plan with two iPhones and it's costing me $110/mo, before taxes and surcharges of course.

Anyone know if VZW will let you use something other than the "Share Everything" plans with the iPhone 5?

I'd like to switch (they're the only ones with LTE coverage in my city) but probably half of my calling is to/from/in Canada.

Thats the default option on store.apple.com. I jumped from AT&T to VZW, and they put you on the Share Everything with no other option

Share everything is the only current option.

If you're going to Canada a lot, your best option would be the AT&T iPhone as the Verizon iPhone won't support Canadian LTE bands.

I'm in Canada a lot, but I'm here (Bellingham) more, so I'm torn.

Right now I'm trying to decide between sticking with AT&T's Nationwide plus Canada and a global data add-on ($110/month) and Verizon's cheapest Sharing is Caring option plus a prepaid Virgin Mobile Canada plan (once VZW will unlock my SIM slot -- $105/month total).

With AT&T I only have one phone number and get free long distance calling to and from Canada (which I do a lot). But the closest LTE market is out of state, and I would need to use my old phone for overseas use with a local SIM.

With Verizon I get LTE in my hometown and much of the rest of the world, and I can use local SIMs when I travel, but I would need to use Skype or FaceTime to call people across the US/Canada border, and probably wouldn't get missed call or voicemail notifications until I crossed into each carrier's coverage area.

The AT&T option appeals to my practical side and the VZW option appeals to my hacker side. Anyway I'm traveling till October so I have a couple of weeks to decide.

So, as for people not from US, could someone, please, explain - how much would it cost monthly to use a single iPhone5 device with unlimited text/voice, 2GB data and tethering? Just curious.

Can someone explain the business logic behind reducing the cost per phone on a shared plan?

Incentive to move multiple devices to a single plan. Reduces attrition.

The thing that sucks is that I have two iPhone 4's that are grandfathered into the AT&T unlimited accounts and pay less than $100 a month for both. I'll probably never upgrade since I know I'll just get screwed by AT&T when they force me to move to LTE accounts.

AT&T isn't forcing customers to change plans (at least not during this upgrade cycle). Verizon is requiring shared data plans for upgrades, but AT&T is allowing grandfathered users to keep their plans. AT&T is, however, throttling past 5GB, but they're doing that whether you upgrade or not, IIRC.

Does anyone know what sorts of speeds I can expect with throttling?

Since when is CDMA a 'worldphone' compatible format?

It's not. That's why the iPhone 5 has GSM bands supported as well.

Could you explain this? This chart* would suggest that, while LTE bands are shared between the CDMA model and the non-North America GSM model, none of the models are both GSM and CDMA capable and therefore are not "worldphone capable". I would love to be wrong about this so please elucidate the situation if you are able.

*http://www.apple.com/iphone/LTE/

The CDMA model does GSM as well: http://www.apple.com/iphone/specs.html

CDMA model A1429: CDMA EV-DO Rev. A and Rev. B (800, 1900, 2100 MHz); UMTS/HSPA+/DC-HSDPA (850, 900, 1900, 2100 MHz); GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz); LTE (Bands 1, 3, 5, 13, 25)

The CDMA iPhone 4S was the same (minus LTE), it has a SIM card slot for global roaming and everything.

Thanks for the info.

Looks like there's no competition here - Verizon is dominant. Even when it comes to price, they're not much more expensive, and actually cheaper if you've got 3+ members on a family plan.

Looks like AT&T is still the only option for simultaneous voice+data, though, due to antenna limitations: http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/09/still-no-simultaneous-v...

It's really weird that there is that restriction because all of the other 4G phones on Verizon can do simultaneous voice+data. Must be something weird about this new all-in-one qualcomm chip they are using.

This is SUCH a bummer. Honestly, I'm really happy with my iPhone 4. The one feature I was excited about was LTE and the promise that I'd get simultaneous voice and data on Verizon (I had an AT&T iPhone for years -- VZW service is vastly superior in Oregon). Now I'm seriously considering an Android device. If only I weren't so deep in the Apple ecosystem.

To be honest, that use case has rarely come up for me, if at all. I'd much rather have the confidence that I'll be able to make a call (something you have with Verizon, but not with AT&T).

Even if you use a lot of data? Seems like Sprint would be the best choice in that case.

Well, with Sprint you don't even have 4G in the vast majority of areas. So it really depends on whether you want speed or uncapped service.

Verizon doesn't do rollover minutes month to month though which is very annoying.

The share everything plan for Verizon gives unlimited talk and text so there is no need for rollover minutes.

I guess that matters for some people, but do you really use your phone to call people all that often? I'm still on my parents' family plan with 700 shared minutes and we rarely run out. And I'm never leaving the plan either, because I've got grandfathered unlimited data, which is a dream come true on Verizon, especially with a Galaxy Nexus running Jelly Bean.

Doesn't the current phone not support VoLTE?

No current network supports VoLTE so I'm not sure this can be confirmed yet.

Right, but what if the network began supporting it? My understanding was that even if turned on, the current device still relies on either CDMA or HSPA/whatever for voice no matter what.

I dont think it's clear yet; changes to the network may only require a change in software to get this VoLTE function. The document suggests Verizon is testing this, but where did he get that info? There is no footnote about it. Also, would the phone even support it?

If early termination fees are just ~$350, what's stopping people from doing that and selling the phone on eBay for $400? Am I missing something?

If you can do that, why would anyone be willing to pay $400 on eBay?

Because the combined eBay/PayPal fees are 10%, and you also have to pay $199 for the phone.

+1 for doing all the math

In short, nothing. CNET does a nice job at explaining the early upgrade situation. http://news.cnet.com/8301-33620_3-57512788-278/for-iphone-5-...

This makes no sense, Lets say i was to get an iphone 5 keep it for 3-4 months so that is 199$ + 285$ termination fee. that makes around 485 $ , and then sell my iphone 5 for like 515 $. I would make a profit, or is there a 6 months or so no changing carrier clause. ( As i am not an american i don't know how these things work)

If you kept it for 3-4 months you would still have to pay for service during that time, making it not really worth waiting just to pay a lesser termination fee.

Do you have to give the phone back when you terminate?

If you did, that would eliminate the reason for the ETF (and also another profit point for the carrier.)

>If you did, that would eliminate the reason for the ETF.

I always figured the early termination fee is because you broke a contract. It's got nothing to do with if it costs the carrier any money, it's simply a penalty for breaking a contract.

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