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Comment by baselessness | Hacker News Reader

Everyone is bracing for a labor supply shock. It will move in the direction opposite what investors expect.

2030 will be 2020 all over again.

Why?

If (a) companies lay too many people off because the magic robots will make engineers unnecessary and (b) the pipeline collapses, because being a software engineer is an undesirable career because it is being replaced by robots and (c) it emerges that the robots are kinda bullshit, then there's going to be one hell of a shortage.

When I started a CS degree in 2003, we were still kinda in the "dot com crash has happened, no-one will ever hire a programmer again" phase, and there were about 50 people in my starting class. I think in the same course two years ago, there'd been about 200. The 'correct' number, for actual future demand, was certainly closer to 200 than 50, and the industry as a whole had a bit of a labour crunch in the early 10s in particular.

I believe we are vastly underestimating the number of programmers needed, as some companies reap unusually high rewards from hiring programmers. Companies like Google can pay huge sums of money to programmers because they make even higher sums of money from the programmer's work.

This means that they inflate programmer salaries, which makes it impossible for most companies that could benefit from software development to hire developers.

We could probably have five times as many software developers as we have now, and they would not be out of work; they would only decrease average salaries for programmers.

If a company could benefit from software developers but can’t afford them, then they can purchase Saas offerings written by companies that can afford developers. I don’t think we’ve run out of opportunities to improve the business world with software quite yet.

The fact that there is a market for these products, but they are almost universally terrible, supports my point.

But if only Google or similarly sized companies can pay that well, and there’s tons of programmers, obviously the average salary will balance out lower than what Google pay but will still be competitive to the thousands of programmers who didn’t get hired at Google.

>but will still be competitive to the thousands of programmers who didn’t get hired at Google

Why would this be the case? Many programmers join Google or Meta (or similar tier companies) and immediately double or triple their income. Software salaries are famously bimodal and people often transition from the lower mode to the higher mode practically overnight.

In fact (and I'm not an economist) I conjecture that the lower mode exists because the upper mode exists. That is, people purposefully don't really care what their salary is (i.e. don't put upward wage pressure) when they're at lower-mode companies because they know one day they'll make the leap to the upper-mode. In other words, the fact that Google-tier companies pay well allows other companies to pay poorly because those guys are just padding their resumes to get a 350k job at Google and don't really care whether Bank of Nowhere pays them $90k or $110k.

People absolutely do care what their salary is. And most people never work at Google...

Well clearly not enough to make the two modes meet.

You could make this argument about almost literally every field.

Holding on for that sweet sweet pay bump after the coming AI winter

I think it might be worse that that as staff reductions are across the board, not just in software development roles. My hope is start up creation will be unprecedented to take advantage of the complacency. They will wonder why AI deleted their customers when they thought it was supposed to delete their employees.

Combine a bunch of factors:

1) fewer students are studying computer science, I'm faculty at a top CS program and we saw our enrollment decline for the first time ever. Other universities are seeing similar slowdowns of enrollment [1]

2) fewer immigrants coming to the united states to work and live, US is perhaps looking at its first population decline ever [2]

3) Current juniors are being stunted by AI, they will not develop the necessary skills to become seniors.

4) Seniors retiring faster because they don't want to have to deal with this AI crap, taking their knowledge with them.

So we're looking at a negative bubble forming in the software engineering expertise pipeline. The money people are hoping that AI can become proficient enough to fill that space before before everything bursts. Engineers, per usual, are pointing out the problem before it becomes one and no one is listening.

[1]: https://www.theatlantic.com/economy/archive/2025/06/computer...

[2]: https://nypost.com/2025/09/03/us-news/us-population-could-sh...

1. OBBB rolled back the R&D deduction changes in Section 174 that (allegedly) triggered the layoffs and froze up hiring in 2022-2023.

2. It looks like rates will keep going down.

3. Fewer people are going into CS due to the AI hysteria. You might say oh there's a 4 year lag, but not quite. We should see an immediate impact from career changers, CS grads choosing between career and professional school, and those switching out of CS careers.

The tech AI fear hysteria is so widespread that I've even heard of people avoiding non-SWE tech careers like PM.

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