Comment by drweevil | Hacker News Reader

Comment by drweevil | Hacker News Reader

To me the biggest problem is the over-financialization of almost all aspects of our lives. Our financial sector is much larger now than it was during WWII, when we were facing a national emergency. The emphasis is always on money and double-digit profits; whether it is our health care system, which always weighs our health against investor returns (and are happy to medicate our resulting mental distress, for a nice profit); our jobs, which are structured for "maximum efficiency"--for the owners, of course, at the expense of workers, who get low pay, low satisfaction, and burnout; all the products which we "buy" but don't own; automakers who have "innovated" new ways to squeeze every penny they can out of customers (subscribe to heated seats!).

Tech is not at all exempt from this. If anything tech is more affected by this phenomenon than most other industries due to the nature of its products, which are particularly susceptible to enshitification. Tech has no shame in actively manipulating its users to their ends, as we have seen with social media, and now with this phenomenon of AI psychosis. Further, tech leaders and investors are much more interested in the next unicorn than in meeting real needs and providing genuine user satisfaction. So yes, this is a hot mess. And it is driving people mad. To me, the interesting question is, what can we do to fight back?

Jacques Ellul's classic The Technological Society is very relevant here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Technological_Society

What he said in the 1950's has come true now;

From Confronting the Technological Society - https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/confronting-the-...

Rather, it [i.e. Technique] is “the totality of methods rationally arrived at and having absolute efficiency … in every field of human activity. ... The machine has created the modern, industrial world, but it was originally a poor fit for society; technique was the process of adapting social conditions to the smooth churning of the machine,”

Ellul distills the essential characteristics of technique to a list of seven. The two most obvious ones, he says, have been addressed so often by other scholars that he can set them aside: rationality (for example, systematization and standardization) and artificiality (subjugation and often the destruction of nature). The other five characteristics of technique are less widely discussed. They are automatism, which is the process of technical means asserting themselves according to mathematical standards of efficiency; self-augmentation, the process of technical advances multiplying at a growing rate and building on each other, while the number of technicians also increases; wholeness, the feature of all individual techniques and their various uses sharing a common essence; universalism, the fact that technique and technicians are spreading worldwide; and autonomy, the phenomenon of technique as a closed system, “a reality in itself … with its special laws and its own determinations.”

Also see Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society Overview - https://medium.com/@NimaCheraghi/jacques-ellul-the-technolog...

Awesome, came here to mention this important work of Ellul!

Following a parallel theme of labour vs. work vs. action and the dissolution of the public sphere (as enabled by technology), I can also recommend Arendt's The Human Condition for further reading.

Jacques Ellul's two classics The Technological Society and Propaganda: The Formation of Men's Attitudes (wikipedia has an excellent overview - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propaganda:_The_Formation_of_M...) should be required reading for every educated person today. With the rise of AI and its unconstrained applications his works seem even more prescient than before.

Technology and "Technique" have become so inherent and intrinsic to modern society and life today that hardly any intellectual is able to stand apart from it and critique it like Ellul was able to. We are already in the early stages of a social dystopia but are unable to recognize it since the paintings of it (by vested interests) are so very seductive.

Assuming you're a technologist of sorts, did this knowledge impact your life choices? I'm currently diving deeper into philosophy with the aim of gaining a wider perspective on things and maybe, one day, find a more meaningful job than my current one.

Yes, i would say my study of Philosophy, Understanding of Science, Practice of Technology, Applications to Psychology (both Individual and Group) has had a powerful impact on my life choices. It enabled me to sacrifice my job/career/future in the tech. industry a decade ago so that i could live with/take care of my aged Mother until her end without too much regret.

Philosophy taught me to discount Money/Worldly standards, Science taught me the need to have mental philosophical worldviews not be too dissonant from Objective Reality, Technology enabled me to earn my livelihood and finally Psychology enabled the coming together of all of the above in one's own being.

The way to think about this is;

1) What is the meaning of Life objectively i.e. outside-in from the pov of the Universe? This question is meaningless and unanswerable. However you can know aspects of Objective Reality using the Scientific Method and learn to manipulate/adapt it thus enhancing your subjective experience of it. This is the realm of all the Modern Hard Sciences and Technologies which are borne out of them.

2) What is the meaning of my Life subjectively i.e. inside-out from the pov of personal Experiences/Feelings/Emotions/Thoughts/Actions? This the fundamental question of Human Condition and answered by the various extent Philosophies/Religions/Psychologies. You devise "Worldviews" into Objective Reality but taking care that you don't stray into fantasy land.

The various Hindu Schools of philosophies and their derivative Buddhist schools have much to offer here. In particular the Samkhya School (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samkhya) provides a good Worldview which meshes nicely with our Modern Sciences. A practical realization of the above Worldview is provided by the Ashtanga Yoga school of Patanjali (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashtanga_(eight_limbs_of_yoga) and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoga_Sutras_of_Patanjali)

The Greek schools of philosophies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greek_philosophy and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenistic_philosophy) also have much to offer here though their focus is more on harmoniously interfacing to/experiencing of/modulating of Objective Reality for a Good Life.

PS: You might also find the book Philosophy in a Meaningless Life: A System of Nihilism, Consciousness and Reality by James Tartaglia interesting. Pdf available at https://www.bloomsburycollections.com/monograph?docid=b-9781...

> To me, the interesting question is, what can we do to fight back?

Well for starters: consume less, vote, volunteer, get outside, engage with your local community, etc. Just be mindful that it’s easy to get discouraged when you are seemingly trying to take on the world. Small steps matter in the grand scheme of things.

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