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Comment by rodly | Hacker News Reader

Only one I disagree with is #12, "Chastity. Rarely use venery but for health or offspring, never to dullness, weakness, or the injury of your own or another's peace or reputation.", this is breaking his own moderation virtue and is heavily motivated by social pressures on sex.

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Maybe he learned something after frequenting brothels (http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/20...) and siring an illegitimate son in his youth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Franklin).

He always had high ideas about chastity but seldom followed them. In my mind Franklin has always embodied "Do as I say, not as I do"--almost in a mischievous or humorous way. I think he did learn from his actions, but not in the same way we usually think of someone "learning" from their actions. He always knew the right answers but preferred to have a little fun.

I don't think so. I think he is making a conscious decision to limit something in his life that is not necessary, and that he might find as a distraction. Sexuality for all its enjoyable qualities can be a distraction to the best of us, and there is nothing wrong with taking an attitude towards it that says I will limit something that is good and I enjoy for something I perceive to be better.

    that is not necessary,

If more people had more (safe) sex, the world would be a better place.

You could probably state something similar about marijuana. The real point being that too many people are up-tight and need to find a way to relax/unwind that releases a bunch of endorphins. I'm sure there are plenty of ways to do this that don't have to involve sex.

At least one other commenter picked up on for health. It wasn't something people wrote down back in those days, (I don't have a citation) many people then considered complete sexual abstinence unhealthy. So Franklin is saying you should engage often enough to maintain health; and Franklin was no prude, his oldest son was illegitimate, and so was that son's son, William Temple, who Franklin more or less adopted, and who returned the favor by collecting and publishing Franklin's papers http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Temple_Franklin

Technology is the chief driver of social mores. In Franklin's time, too much sex would likely expose you to health hazards such as syphilis, or unwanted babies. Today, we have medicine and contraception that should minimize these risks. But I think this point still applies - it just depends on your definition of "rarely"... no more than twice a day perhaps!

That one threw me too. Especially since I was under the impression that chastity was not his main concern in Paris... but then again, that's Paris ;)

I think "for health" covers it. The admonition "never to dullness, weakness, or ... injury ..." is being rediscovered en masse over here: http://reddit.com/r/nofap

Many people express this fetish for delaying gratification, but it's not for everyone. It's cute to see people getting into it and thinking the rest of us should go without.

Definitely some puritan influence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritanism)

Puritanism influences everyone. But Franklin was no puritan, and to assume that the beliefs of puritans were the basis for his tips on chastity adds no real insight to this discussion. Anyone can easily identify ideals in our present and past that seem adverse to liberal sexuality and cry "Puritan!"--but this discounts the brilliance of people like Franklin. He had a high level view of the different ideals in his culture and often addressed them with a tongue-in-cheek or satirical tone.

As an aside, neither the Puritans nor mainstream culture in Franklin's era were especially prudish about sexual activity. What people call 'puritanical' today is really an artifact of the Victorian era.

Back then you couldn't just take a pill to get rid of any diseases you might pick up.

How is "have sex as needed for your health" in opposition to moderation?

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