Tesla shows no sign of improvement in May sales data
arstechnica.com
arstechnica.com
Whether that makes sense is pretty subjective. Personally I think they're overly optimistic and that's why I'm not a Tesla shareholder.
Now, he seems to be spending his days on ketamine fueled posting binges and fist fights in the white house instead of running Tesla and SpaceX.
If I was a tesla investor I would want out immediately.
Owing to the difference in sensor suite, I'm curious if Tesla FSD will be able to truly keep that same margin of safety, but I'm not super confident, and having to pause or rollback the trial would be a big hit in the underlying "value" of TSLA, I reckon.
I'll believe the self-driving taxi hype when I am every able to drive own to my place of brith. I am pretty confident that is not going to happen before I die.
The military will pay him because there are no alternatives. So will many countries.
$TSLA isn’t a car company anymore, it’s $ELON and he’s trying to be a trillionaire and be more powerful than heads of state. Gilded age indeed.
Fun fact, John D. Rockefeller at his peak of wealth was equivilent to 3% of the GDP of the United States. That 3% figure right now would be $870B.
Obviously in the current environment it's not worth having the fight. Musk's brand implosion will be studied for decades as probably the biggest preventable destruction of shareholder value in history.
Nonetheless the cars remain great cars, even if it's no longer appropriate to say so. FWIW: used values have dropped too. If you don't want to line DOGE pockets or whatever, you can get a great deal on one from Carvana et. al.
But nonetheless they are and remain really great, frankly transformational vehicles and they remain easily accessible if you want to investigate for yourself.
What ultimately matters is the statistics, and while the statistics Tesla has released are not very convincing, we can at least be sure that supervised FSD is not dramatically more dangerous than human drivers. That would definitely have been obvious in the statistics by now.
It remains a mediocre car that was cool in 2017 when you could forgive the parts where it doesn’t deliver as promised because it was supposed to be revolutionary. But in 2025, a $50k car that promises 350 miles of range but can barely pull 200 can not be seriously called a great or revolutionary by any metric.
The whole market is totally insane at the market, inflated on promises not delivery. There's only one way it's going.
Those things do happen from time to time but especially when they become popular they create an opportunity for counter elites to disrupt you. Competent leaders seem to (I'd argue appropriately) consider these a liability more than an asset. I think the market is going to be neutral on them for that reason.
I also think conspiracies are much more rare than people like to think. A lot of them turn out to just be similar people thinking the same thing.
For example if the DC chargers on a road trip are $0.25/kWh and an EV averages 4 mi/kWh then a Toyota Prius will do that road trip for less if gas averages under $3.50/gal. Gas is under that in most states.
If you have to pay $0.40/kWh than a Prius will beat an EV if gas is under $5.60, which I believe is currently the case even in California.
If you don't do road trips and can charge at home (which in most places should be a lot less than commercial DC charging) then EVs win in most states, although there are a few where due to high home electricity costs and low gas costs hybrids win even against home charging.
It will take a while for stories like this to filter to the top-line numbers because car replacement cycles are so long, but just on anecdotes I really don't see Tesla returning to growth anytime soon. The brand is absolutely toxic now.
Is there a mature independent repair shop market yet? What is third-party part availability like? I've talked with a bunch of folk who have considered getting a used Tesla given how dirt cheap they are, but no one was confident they could operate a Tesla without giving the company money.
I had considered getting a Tesla for years but there’s no way I can make that purchase make sense now.
Having said that, I'm with you, for me my car takes me from place to place, that's all I want.
Absolutely nothing changed (and people generally don't change, not for the better at least), he is still same pos he was globally considered few months ago. Still same person who was making up pedophile claims of a french diver who actually rescued kids trapped in cave, not some boasting of submarine who would be too little too late, if ever. I know people love to quickly forget bad parts of people they admire or worship, but I don't see a reason why.
Competition offers a lot, people don't have to be ashamed to drive it or be afraid to let it be parked anywhere.
No dashboard, no stalks, everything on the central touchscreen. It is not minimalist elegance, it is cheap cost-cutting. Even the s/x are cheapified.
previous generation Model S with a dashboard and stalks is much nicer to control than the new s/x/3/y/truck.
You can flash your headlights, you can control details of autopilot, you can shift quickly into forward/reverse when doing a tricky parking maneuver, you can separate controls on center screen from info on the dashboard. direct wiper controls. There is a place to rest your finger while hunting for a control on the central screen. navigation highlights upcoming turns ahead of you on the screen.
then 3 takes away dashboard. The smaller central display has extremely cluttered information along the left edge. The controls require attention, and hard right from the direction you should be looking to drive.
And each generation this seems to go a little further. Removing the stalks is too far imho.
the cybertruck main screen where you adjust everything is just a wall of on-screen touch areas.
I personally think all of this is the classic presales vs postsales dilemma.
Something that looks clean and modern in the store only ends up showing its shortcomings when in daily use.
Just my opinion. Personally I think tesla should add a $2k option for stalks, a dashboard and a couple dedicated buttons. I'll bet it would help with sales.
Simply because there is no other way to really explain it.
No rational basis for a P/E of 180. No reason for the stock price to increase while sales and earnings decline. No reason for industry analysts to maintain a buy rating on a stock that is clearly WAY over bought.
Unless they have some undisclosed incentive for putting their reputation on the line to do so.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/buying-teslas-stock-ahead-...
Uber is just minimally profitable --- without investing large sums in autos or assuming liability for their operation. No way Telsa can do so, undercut them on price and be crazy profitable all at the same time.
I probably will replace it with a Tesla, but I’m hoping they release a 3 row with a reasonable 3rd row seat that would be great for my family and there’s no rush because I don’t really drive too much.
That being said, I think Tesla’s are obviously incredible engineering feats that everyone should want. Politics aside.
Admittedly just a hunch, but I suspect the data for the more recent cohorts and Tesla models is much better than this data shows
Unbelievable.
I had to stay out of TSLA after the first year or so because the valuation made no sense to me. Other than a FOMO / YOLO play like BTC.
I'm shocked that the valuation continues to remain so high after so many lies and mediocre results. Was the Cybertruck a success? There definitely are not a million Tesla robotaxis on the road as Elon suggested there would be by 2020.
> obviously to me that sending money to shady petro states all over the world is just a bad idea
Do you not see the contradiction, in the same sentence?
Their regime: not sending them money is just the sensible thing to do
Well they did mention several other non-political reasons.
https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2024-us-init...
The extravagantly botched release of the long delayed Cyber Truck as well.
So given that information I feel like a decision to purchase a Tesla is actually more due to politics than a decision to not purchase one.
I and many others will not support the megolmaniac that took a chainsaw to our federal government. Musk not only hired a bunch of palantir, ballet machine hackers, but he also ensured the many lawsuits against him were dropped, the investigations into his companies that should have cost him billions were dropped, and that his companies get $100s of millions of no competition government contracts.
Correct. I will not support Musk ever again, regardless of his current PR bombardment. Musk has shown who he is and now he will reap the rewards of that reputation.
All of this is backed by evidence. Easily searchable on your favorite search engine.
I wonder if there's a connection there.
So easy. ;-)
Which is all to say that what you want is much more likely to come from Toyota or Ford or Hyundai or Kia than it is from Tesla.
As a current owner, I wouldn't buy again because of the abysmal customer service and repair experience. This car is a huge computer, and has plenty of glitches appearing now that it's out of warranty.
The main benefit of a Tesla vs other electric cars was the supercharging network, but with the adoption of NACS across most manufacturers, that advantage is gone.
There are plenty of high quality reasonably priced electric vehicles people can buy – they're just not Teslas.
And Tesla had an edge but it has been eroding with some idiotic decisions (like the no stalks model 3) and Elon's recent behavior completely destroyed the brand to those mostly likely to buy one.
Leaving everything else you've written aside... Really‽ You believe that it's possible to make a single kind of car with minimal variation in styles and capabilities that will appeal to the entire world, at every price point, every demographic?
I suggest you are over-extrapolating your own confirmation bias. I drive a Volvo, it is not possible for Tesla to sell me a vehicle with a single flat screen to replace my buttons, screen, digital gauge cluster, and heads-up display. It is not possible to sell me a Model Y or Model X to replace my wagon. I am obviously not Tesla's market for Tesla's current product lineup, period.
My neighbour has a cottage and owns a truck they use for all sorts of hauling things around. I have spoken with them, it is not possible to sell them a CyberTruck, they are interested in the F150 Lightning, a vehicle designed for truck owners who want to electrify. My neighbour is not Tesla's market either.
Tesla is not into broad market segmentation. Tesla is into having a well-defined market and offering a handful of models to that market. You're in that market and you're happy with your Tesla. Ok. But come on, do you understand that the rest of the 7 billion people on this planet make up a wide variety of humans with a wide variety of wants and needs where a vehicle is concerned?
And that literally ZERO manufacturers can make a handful of cars that everyone will want?
So they're both better and worse technology, depending on what you focus on.
But I think a functioning democracy is something that everyone should want, incredible engineering feats aside.
And that's just North America. BYD and NIO have extremely compelling options outside of this side of the planet.
My current car is a 2018 tesla, I'll drive it until the wheels fall off. My next EV won't be. Primarily because I can't support a Nazi.
But for what they actually offer (excluding the "betas" and "Muskian Promises"), most manufacturers make a car that's comparable / better depending on your needs.
And if things are comparable, than you can bring in other things to make a decision. And the politics of the company's outspoken CEO is certainly something you could consider.
The US has been a net exporter of oil for several years now and what it does import is mainly (>70%) production from Canada and Mexico. As far as crude oil goes, in 2024 the US imported 6.48 million barrels per day and exported 4.06 million. Of those 2.42 million barrels of crude oil, approximately 1.7 million came from oilfields in Canada and Mexico.
While we as a society should transition away from fossil fuels as quickly as practical, there is actually a very small chance a gallon of gasoline pumped into a vehicle originated in a shady petrostate.
>Tesla’s are obviously incredible engineering feats that everyone should want
Teslas were impressive, technologically, to normal consumers ten years ago.
Having driven every single model of Tesla ever made they are not for me except for the Roadster; their dynamics more closely resemble a heavily laden minivan with fantastic acceleration than a fun-to-drive car and their styling is design-by-committee bland.
It's not 5 years ago. There are now quite a few makers of quality reasonably priced EVs. If someone decides to avoid one particular maker over politics there are plenty of other choices.