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Comment by dawnofdusk | Hacker News Reader

Staying at home row is not really about ergonomics. The best thing you can do (without breaking the bank, i.e., no bespoke split keyboard setups) for your hand ergonomics at the computer is to get a vertical mouse and tilt your keyboard downwards and away from you (the opposite of what most keyboard feet do, which is tilt your keyboard up and towards you). Both of these keep your wrist neutral/in slight flexion, whereas the typical setup keep your wrists in constant extension which contributes to carpal tunnel.

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When my old mouse died, I bought a vertical mouse and sold it after a week. I was just too cumbersome to use. When I use a mouse, I keep the forearm and the wrist static and move it mainly with the tips of my thumb and pinkie. This was impossible with a vertical mouse, which expects you to grab it with the whole hand.

I found a regular mouse instead, but a decidedly asymmetrical one. This way my hand can stay in a less pronated position while still controlling the mouse the way I am used to.

Interestingly, vertical mice I've tried (yes plural) feel intensely uncomfortable and make my wrist hurt. I actually quite like to use a trackball, but I'm not sure that did much for me either. Best I've ever done is just use the mouse less I guess. Maybe I'll learn to use a pen tablet as my primary pointing device instead.

Interesting! My personal experience is that using a vertical mouse very quickly cured wrist and forearm pain that I had, and that the reason is because the "handshake" position is the most neutral hand/forearm posture from an anatomical perspective. But everyone is different, of course

I also agree that it doesn't feel like it makes any sense, hence trying it a few times. I never actually tried going to a medical professional to figure out why though, and thankfully it has not gotten worse (mostly better, with being more careful.)

I'm a big fan of using the mouse less. When I was having issues, I learned to use the mouse with my left hand. I got used to it enough to be nearly as fast, but I never liked it so it encouraged me to just use keyboard shortcuts.

I thought I invented it, but I've since seen occupational health and safety websites recommend alternating.

Here's a link to an Australian gov PDF: https://www.comcare.gov.au/about/forms-pubs/docs/pubs/safety...

I've seen it in NZ too. I think they suggested swapping the mouse buttons but I prefer to just leave them and do my left clicking with both fingers when using my left hand.

I use a trackball mouse and anything else feels very cumbersome. It's so much movement moving my entire hand. With the trackball I just flick it directionally with one finger and then catch it with the other finger.

It's more natural for your palms to be basically facing each other. That's how they are when you're just standing up. Also think of steering wheel, joystick on e.g. a crane, or control yokes on aircraft where people have to hold it for hours at a time and possibly apply force. Neutral grip is also a thing in resistance training, for instance neutral grip pull-ups are easier on the joints. It stands to reason the sideways mouse, and some kind of keyboard that allows the hands to lie in a more natural position, would be less stressful on the various small parts. You don't want to be constantly moving things far away from their natural position!

I have been using a vertical mouse for a long time now, and it is very comfortable for me. But it does take some getting used to, when I watch others trying to use my computer they always struggle with it. Interestingly as well as being more comfortable to use, I find that it improves my pointing accuracy, feels like fewer unnecessary movements.

I wasn't getting RSI per se, more like my arms were fatigued after a day of development.

I did the pricey split keyboard thing. One advantage there is that my vertical mouse sits between the keyboard halves which means I don't have to "reach around" to grip it which has saved a whole bunch of muscle movement.

I do this but with a trackball. Works great.

I got a split keyboard and for the first time in my life, my wrists are quite strained when I type. It might be a learning curve thing, but I wouldn’t go for a split keyboard for health reasons, just because they’re cool.

I use my standing desk to change the height for sitting here and there. I imagine it helps my wrists and shoulders.

Yes.

Instead of the endless search for the perfect static posture, just keep moving the various joints now and then. Adjust your elbow or wrist or the desk or the chair every now and then. This can make you look "unprofessionally" seated if you take it far enough so hopefully your workplace doesn't mind that.

Even if you are moving between multiple so-called "bad" postures, you'll be much better off compared to just being static in a "good" posture for 4 hours.

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