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Comment by suddenlybananas | Hacker News Reader

Companies lie all the time, I don't know why you have such faith in them

Anonymous Internet comment section stories are confused and/or lie a lot, too. I’m not sure why you have so much faith in them.

Also, this conspiracy requires coordination across two separate companies (GitHub for the repos and the LLM providers requesting private repos to integrate into training data). It would involve thousands or tens of thousands of engineers to execute. All of them would have to keep the conspiracy quiet.

It would also permanently taint their frontier models, opening them up to millions of lawsuits (across all GitHub users) and making them untouchable in the future, guaranteeing their demise as soon a single person involved decided to leak the fact that it was happening.

I know some people will never trust any corporation for anything and assume the worst, but this is the type of conspiracy that requires a lot of people from multiple companies to implement and keep quiet. It also has very low payoff for company-destroying levels of risk.

So if you don’t trust any companies (or you make decisions based on vague HN anecdotes claiming conspiracy theories) then I guess the only acceptable provider is to self-host on your own hardware.

I really don't see how tens of thousands of engineers would be required.

With the current admin I don't think they really have any legal exposure here. If they ever do get caught, it's easy enough to just issue some flimsy excuse about ACLs being "accidentally" omitted and then maybe they stop doing it for a little while.

This is going to be the same disruption as Airbnb or Uber. Move fast and break things. Why would you expect otherwise?

Another thing that would permanently taint models and open their creators to lawsuits is if they were trained on many terabytes worth of pirated ebooks. Yet that didn't seem to stop Meta with Llama[0]. This industry is rife with such cases; OpenAI's CTO famously could not answer a simple question about whether Sora was trained on Youtube data or not. And now it seems they might be trained on video game content [1], which opens up another lawsuit avenue.

The key question from the perspective of the company is not whether there will be lawsuits, but whether the company will get away with it. And so far, the answer seems to be: "yes".

The only exception that is likely is private repos owned by enterprise customer. It's unlikely that GitHub would train LLMs on that, as the customer might walk away if they found out. And Fortune 500 companies have way more legal resources to sue them than random internet activists. But if you are not a paying customer, well, the cliche is that you are the product.

[0]: https://cybernews.com/tech/meta-leeched-82-terabytes-of-pira... [1]: https://techcrunch.com/2024/12/11/it-sure-looks-like-openai-...

I work for <company>, we lie, in fact, many of us in our industry lie, to each other, but most importantly to regulators. I lie for them because I get paid to. I recommend you vote for any representative that is hostile towards the marketing industry.

And companies are conspirators by nature, plenty of large movie/game production companies manage to keep pretty quiet about game details and release-dates (and they often don't even pay well!).

I genuinely don't understand why you would legitimately "trust" a Corporation at all, actually, especially if it relates to them not generating revenue/marketshare where they otherwise could.

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