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Comment by konfusinomicon | Hacker News Reader

I delved into the world of soy sauce a few years back and id say if your looking to go beyond kikkoman, or god forbid that swill they call la choy, go for kimlan. super special, I-Jen (for something a little different), light, or aged..pearl river bridge isn't too bad either just watch out for brands with a bunch of added chemicals in the ingredients

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or god forbid that swill they call la choy

An interesting note: La Choy is synthetically fermented (whatever what means!) and is usually the only alcohol-free option for those with medical or religious restrictions on the consumption of alcohol. Soy sauce is specifically listed as something recovering alcoholics taking Antabuse should avoid [1], though I've read it only rarely triggers any reaction. But there is a sometimes a reason for La Choy!

[1] https://advantagetherapy.com.au/the-impact-of-antabuse-on-al...

yikes, antabuse users I'll give a sympathetic pass, but if whatever god one prays to condemns its followers to a life to salty water+caramel coloring condiments, all believers must collectively come together in songs of praise to request a slight rule change.

A tiny amount of alcohol produced through natural fermentation, especially less than 1%, is generally considered permissible or halal.

The main verses from the Quran for alcohol intoxicant prohibition come from this verse [1]:

O believers! Intoxicants, gambling, idols, and drawing lots for decisions are all evil of Satan’s handiwork. So shun them so you may be successful.

And another [2]:

They ask you O Prophet about intoxicants and gambling. Say, “There is great evil in both, as well as some benefit for people - but the evil outweighs the benefit. They also ask you O Prophet what they should donate. Say, Whatever you can spare. This is how Allah makes His revelations clear to you believers, so perhaps you may reflect.

Fun facts, Surah Al-Maidah name literal meaning is The Table Spread with Food, in reference to the event of the Jesus apostles were asking for ready foods directly from heavens, from God (not Jesus since Islam consider him as one of the prophets sent by God similar to Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses and Muhammad). This particular event is famously known as The Last Supper [3].

[1] Surah Al-Maidah (The Table Spread with Food), verse 90:

https://quran.com/al-maidah/90

[2] Surah Al-Baqarah (The Cow), verse 219:

https://quran.com/ms/al-baqarah/219

[3] Last Supper (Section: In Islam):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Supper

I suppose we can be greatful MSG wasn't discovered until 1908 and hasn't made it into any holy texts yet, the intoxicating allure of its flavor experience as it may be. if it was any better the gods would have kept it for themselves.

> if it was any better the gods would have kept it for themselves.

Fun facts, in Semite languages namely Arabic, Hebrew and Aramaic (language of Jesus) God is called Allah. This word has no plural meaning, thus God by this very definition is only one.

Funny that you mentioned MSG, personally I can detect certain amount of MSG that went into my consumed food by my nose being itchy and uncomfortable.

MSG however is not intoxicant to the brain like alcohol, marijuana, meth, etc that badly effect the state of mind immediately. The verse clearly mentioned intoxicant and by extension any new substances that make you lose your mind (temporarily or permanent) is not permissible or haram.

This is an excellent video by the health experts if you not yet convinced that any amount of alcohol consumption is bad for human brain and health in general based on published research evidences [1].

[1] Psychiatrist Reveals What Alcohol Actually Does to Your Brain [video]:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QWMSLmVVyw

Pearl River Bridge has a seasoned soy sauce that's been my constant for over a decade.

La choy is to soy sauce what Maruchen is to real ramen or Kraft to French cheese. Try San J, available in most 'health' grocers, eg Food Hole, Sprouts, etc. it's not fine, but it's good.

> La choy is to soy sauce what Maruchen is to real ramen

Oh come on now, surely Maruchan deserves a bit more credit...at the very least, no one is breaking the bank while desecrating their soul.

In contrast, at my local Walmart, a 15-oz bottle of La Choy is priced +50% higher than its (subjectively superior) Kikkoman alternative of the same size!

I'm enjoying the throes of salmonella presently and it all seems unappealing. The fucking pain. But even in this wretched state, I have some memory of desire for Paldo, but none for Maruchan.

Yeah, I'm in genuine agony, probably preparing to puke from all holes, and I'm reading HN... while writhing and moaning.

I guess you could say I'm sick. And so is la choy

Which prepared foods show off the qualities of the soy sauce best?

I feel like in most of my cooking the soy sauce is overpowered.

This is a good question. I would offer that there are at least two major types of soy sauce: light and dark. They are used in a variety of ways in Northeast Asian cooking (Mainland China, Koreas, Japan, Taiwan, Hongkong, Macao). For example, when you steam a fish (southern Chinese/Canto style), you use a combination of light and dark soy sauces. (I have no idea why, but this is a traditional recipe taught to me years ago.) Soy sauce has two primary "taste" components (previously I discussed visual components): (a) the fermented soy beans and (b) the umami (MSG/monosodium glutamate). Even if you feel like (a) is overwhelmed by your cooking, it is still enhanced by (b) which, for most people, makes any savory food taste more appealing.

For me, nothing beats raw fish (sashimi or sushi) as a taste test for a soy sauce, but I frequently use a mixture with Japanese ponzu... so ignore any expertise that I have on the matter! I am sure that each culinary region in Northeast Asia will have a different answer. You could probably interview 100 chefs from the region and get 25 different answers.

Lastly, there is a third type of soy sauce used in Southeast Asia called sweet soy sauce, or kecap manis in Bahasa Melayu/Indonesia.

Surely, "salt" has to be mentioned when talking about the primary taste components of soy? Normal soy is around 17% salt, which is a lot and really plays a part, in my opinion.

Soy sauce is meant to largely replace the salt component of your dish. If you're using so much that it's particularly salty, you're using too much.

Way back in the day, when salt was scarce and expensive, the whole point of stuff like fish sauce, miso, soy sauce, etc... was to provide salt but also cut it by adding other ingredients.

Fun facts, the Malay word garam for salt most probably come from the Roman word Garum, a very popular fermented fish sauce from an ancient Malay Champa kingdom [1]. The Champa kingdom used to rule majority of Vietnam and the South China Sea used to be called Champa Sea even in ancient Chinese chronicles [2]. If I'm not mistaken the Vietnamese themselves still calling this particular fish sauce as Champa fish sauce, while the rest of the world call this Vietnamese fish sauce [3].

The original world from Old Malay for salt is probably "asin", that's now become the word for taste of salt or "masin" meaning salty.

[1] Garum:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garum

[2] The Cham: Descendants of Ancient Rulers of South China Sea Watch Maritime Dispute From Sidelines:

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/140616-so...

[3] Did fish sauce in Vietnam come from ancient Rome via the Silk Road? (111 comments):

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23980279

Oh, sweet soy sauce is a thing in Asia? I thought it was a French invention (all restaurants here give you both savory and sweet soy sauce).

Also I just had gyozas with Lee Kum Kee light soy sauce and thought it's a good test for it.

I assume if it appears in France, then it was borrowed from their SE Asian colonies.

Kecap manis is delicious, I get the ABC brand. It's as thick as molasses. Wonderful drizzled over some chicken rice

Have you tried Bango brand kecap manis? I recommend it. It is less sweet and has stronger flavour.

I haven't. Thanks for the recommendation, I'll try it out

plain white rice is a good vessel

Once you step outside the usual suspects like Kikkoman, there's a whole world of nuance out there.

Will vouch for Kimlan, my late mother's favorite!

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