Comment by Johanx64 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by Johanx64 | Hacker News Reader

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> There’s also a facet of strict benthamite utilitarianism that falls into the trap of accepting reified societal norms as being objective reality - for instance, the core idea that pain and suffering are bad.

Man, people DO vax poetic online, but when you introduce them to the blowtorch, some tweezers and a steel pipe, they don't need much convincing that pain and suffering is ... in fact ... objectively bad.

They convert to recognizing the badness of pain and suffering..... very, very quickly.

> I would hold that they are the whetstones that sharpen the soul

You really have no idea what you're talking about, are you? How can anyone type this naive drivel?

There’s a difference between being tortured in the “to death” sense, and milder forms of suffering. Hunger pangs, mild sleep deprivation, pushing through exhaustion, mild hypothermia, etc are a form of suffering. But they are also something people are routinely willing to subject themselves to during sport.

I would like anesthesia for surgery, but I still participate in endurance sports…

I think endurance sports (and many other sports, like rock climbing, which I enjoy), are a mix of type 1 and type 2 fun (https://www.rei.com/blog/climb/fun-scale). There may be some suffering while you do it, but the overall experience is positive when you look back at it. This is quite different from surgery without anesthesia, which would definitely not be fun in the end, at least for most people.

It wouldn’t be fun, no, but it would sure as hell make you appreciate not undergoing surgery without anaesthesia.

From a personal perspective, I spent years suffering from a mystery illness (ah, the joys of tropical diseases), and it made me appreciate the times when I wasn’t having an acute episode immensely, which otherwise would have been “ordinary”. My wife would be like “there are leaves all over the driveway!” and I would be like “yes, aren’t they beautiful?”.

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