Coco Controller (YC S12) Will Turn Your iPhone Into A Gaming Powerhouse | Hacker News Reader

Coco Controller (YC S12) Will Turn Your iPhone Into A Gaming Powerhouse

techcrunch.com

83 pointsanandkulkarni45 comments

YC will back anything these days. Paul Graham talks about "Frighteningly Ambitious Startup Ideas" and tackling the real hard problems, and then we get a little controller for an iPhone. Yawn.

http://www.paulgraham.com/organic.html

"Don't be discouraged if what you produce initially is something other people dismiss as a toy. In fact, that's a good sign. That's probably why everyone else has been overlooking the idea. The first microcomputers were dismissed as toys. And the first planes, and the first cars. At this point, when someone comes to us with something that users like but that we could envision forum trolls dismissing as a toy, it makes us especially likely to invest."

but this is a toy...

So was the JoyBoard.

Do you know what the JoyBoard's designers went on to create, what they were trying to build all along?

The freaking Amiga.

Actually, that was a toy too. But it was a phenomenally cool toy that was vastly more powerful than a lot of people's work computers.

And look how that turned out...

Just sayin

I'm looking... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amiga#Amiga_community Looks awesome.

I wonder if you would really be able to identify a startup that was really tackling a "Frighteningly Ambitious Startup Idea."

At the point that they are coming out of YC they would probably be tackling one small, seemingly non-consequential part of a larger problem.

Maybe they would explicitly state 'we are going to eventually revolutionize X' - but my bet would be they would fly under the radar for a while.

There are already about 4 other products exactly like this already on the market. I kind of question how large the third-party iPhone snap-on-controller market size is to necessitate both YC and Kickstarter.

Agreed, in fact I have never seen anyone using one of these smartphone gamepads and quite frankly I can see why: it's another thing you have to carry with you and besides not all games are/will be compatible.

That's the bit that surprised me most about this article. Controllers for phones are NOT new.

iCade Mobile, iControlPad, and the umpteen bluetooth ones that don't clip on, but connect wirelessly and give you a PROPER gamepad for your iPhone/iPad.

As for Android, you can connect PS3 controllers and any number of aftermarket ones like above.

I get that the above linked one works for both iOS and Android, but very few people own (and regularly game on) both types of phone at once, so needing a multi-platform controller seems like a pretty niche market.

Not to mention the new version of Blutrol (jailbreak tweak, see http://www.ringwald.ch/cydia/blutrol/) which lets you connect up and use with any game (not just dev-supported) an iCade, iControlPad, standard bluetooth keyboard, PhoneJoy, Wiimote, or Zeemote JS1.

Here's one more for your list:

http://tenonedesign.com/flingmini.php

You can back both world-changers and toys. It's not either-or.

Why isn't there a link to Coco[1]? Or its Kickstarter page[2]?

[1]: http://cococontroller.com/games/

[2]: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/games/the-coco-controlle...

It feels like a tough sell to me. We've seen quite a few iPhone gamepads of varying quality and as far as I'm aware, none have really taken off. Even a super simple SDK takes time to implement properly, and if it's only going to benefit a few percent of your users at best, I don't see why devs would bother; and if there isn't much support, gamers won't bite.

What bothers me the most is their belief that "Real Games Need Real Buttons". On the contrary, game devs seem to be doing perfectly well without buttons on smartphones, and customers don't seem to be complaining either, judging by the success of touch-native games like Angry Birds, Tiny Wings, Flight Control, Cut the Rope, etc. You might think that these aren't 'real games' but that's a remarkably narrow-minded opinion.

Regarding the price: the $42 coco is described as being "less than stores" which suggests a ~$50 price tag. If you got a few games for free, that'd be OK, but otherwise it's very steep.

I have to disagree. All of the games you just mentioned are casual titles with little to no complexity. Action and platformer titles in particular require more precise controls. As a long time gamer on both consoles and handhelds, I can tell you that there's a definite improvement when I can physically feel the buttons and build muscle memory.

Imagine as a developer having to switch to a keyboard with no tactile response. A completely button-less piece of glass with virtual keys on it. Your productivity would no doubt diminish greatly.

In addition, a large install base of these kinds of devices would make it easier and more profitable for studios to port their games over to the iOS platform, giving us even more game choices in the app store.

Doesn't mean they aren't fun and popular games. I don't doubt that there are things buttons can do that touchscreens can't - I like my Assassin's Creed and Mass Effect just as much as the next person - but they're different animals, ones that take full advantage of big screens, complex controllers, and comparatively long play sessions.

A lot of iPhone gaming takes place in short sessions, and I'm not about to keep snapping a coco on and off just for five minutes at a time.

In any case, I'd prefer it if studios didn't bother porting their games over to iOS. They're optimised for consoles, not for handhelds, and even with a millions cocos out there, the economics probably wouldn't be that attractive to most big devs when set alongside the hundreds of millions of people who don't have them.

You know I was persuaded by the big screen/long play session argument the other day, but don't the gameboy and DS seem like contradictory evidence?

There are certainly great games that lend themselves to touch, but there are also some great games that would be much nicer to play with tactile controls: platformers like League of Evil, Muffin Knight; dual stick shooters; GTA 3 and Max Payne, etc. Not to mention NES/SNES emulators.

That said, I'd like to see more titles or publishers supporting the project before pulling the trigger.

Very awkward placement of the analog stick - you can use either the stick or the buttons, never both at the same time. I don't believe any of the mainstream handhelds or console controllers have had this arrangement, probably with good reason.

Our design feelings were that the camera/look controls (right analog stick) generally need to be tighter than movement (left d-pad). Almost every standard controller places buttons on the same side as the camera/look analog stick. We would, though, still like to provide analog input for directions, too.

Yeah I rewatched the sections with the guy playing it and it seemed the hand positions weren't comfortable. But hard to tell with the shots in the video and without getting one's hands on it.

Doesn't the Xbox 360 controller have this? On the left, there is an analog stick (and d-pad), and on the right is an analog stick and 4 buttons.

The 360 controller also has triggers for your index fingers.

Yes, and this allows you to use an analog stick and the buttons at the same time, unlike here.

Yet another device that interfaces through the audio port.

I think it is tragic that Apple's restrictive approach to hardware interfacing to iOS devices is leaving developers with no options. Talk about going back a few decades.

You can't even do a simple serial port interface on an iOS device without going through the MFI gauntlet. Absolutely ridiculous in 2012.

amen

This could actually be huge. All they need is a few high DAU accounts to help them market this device. I totally agree with their premise that current games are limited by the touch functionality. If they can bring the price down and just get to a medium-sized installed base, their free app will work wonders for small indie-sized devs. Current game devs are being priced out of the market for advertising, but if they can innovate on the discovery end, they could become a low-cost Xbox competitor with a much larger catalog of games.

Congrats Connor and Colton! So excited to use this.

Second that!

third! :P

This is one of those ideas that, on the surface, seems to make sense...but I just don't see a big enough market out there for it to gain any traction.

I don't think people are going to carry this thing around with their iPhone, and if they really care about games, they already have dedicated consoles with way better AAA titles than iOS will have for at least a few more years. These types of gamers may also have a 3DS.

If this somehow takes off like the Ouya did on kickstarter, it'll be interesting to see if it sticks. Good luck, regardless of my skepticism! :)

Also - this should be linking to the kickstarter, not some techcrunch babble.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/games/the-coco-controlle...

I have noticed that touchscreen implementations of controls and joysticks, while sometimes quite good, leave some things to be desired. (Meteor Blitz on the iPhone is a good example. It's very well done, but I find it's fatiguing for extended playing.)

Between this, the iCade, and the HDMI-out I wonder why someone isn't trying to develop TV/living room-oriented game hardware for iOS devices?

airplay to your tv. it already is.

Is it going to become a new standard for incubator/investor backed startups to turn to Kickstarter?

Or is this specific to the gaming community?

This is awesome. It opens the door to using your phone to play almost any game you'd usually play on an xbox or playstation (or n64 in my case). I didn't like the idea of playing first person shooters on my phone before. Or, really anything past simple tap or slide games. This definitely does change things.

I make iOS games for a living, and our hands are full enough trying to handle the fragmentation of device capabilities on iOS/Android. Adding another code path we have to worry about testing so that we can support a market that will be a tiny, tiny percentage of the whole? Yea, no.

This looked more interesting to me, but for whatever reason the kickstart has been canceled. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/bladepad/bladepadthe-det...

This essentially makes your phone into an OUYA. Awesome. I hope these guys can capture some of the furor that fueled the OUYA kickstarter. If this takes off it will seriously change the face of mobile gaming.

At first glance, I thought this had something to do with the TRS-80 CoCo. What a let down!

This is great! One of the few products I've seen in HN that I think I would really buy.

just use joypad instead. joypadapp.com :-)

oops http://getjoypad.com/ instead.

does 20 ms latency cut it?

If this has any sign of success... A Chinese clone of it will be out on the US market for half the announced price before these even hit the store shelves.

Bookmark it.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com