Fuck Run Club, Join Sit Club | Hacker News Reader

Fuck Run Club, Join Sit Club

rawandferal.substack.com

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Something I learned over the last year as I got into running is that many avid runners don't even like running.

I wouldn't say that I "like" running, either. I got into running because I was experiencing a mental health crisis, and I needed something besides drugs and alcohol to deal with feelings that were otherwise impossible for me to cope with.

Suddenly, as a guy who has shouted "what are you running from?" at Bay to Breakers celebrants, what had been a joke became a dark and profound awareness. It turns out, I was asking myself that question. Running, paradoxically, helped give me the emotional resilience to face what I was running from head on.

There are very few things in this world that cost you nothing, are equally available to everyone, and can automatically, reliably and immediately improve your subjective experience.

This is a brilliant joke, and I love it. But the flip side is that almost everyone I know that ever got into running has Been Through Some Shit, is aware that running is annoying, not very fun, and kind of cringe, and Does Not Care, because whatever it is, running helps.

All of which is to say — you can think of run clubs as support groups, for everyone who has found themselves with a good reason to run, to be seen by other people who Know. For many runners I know, it's impossible to hate them anymore than they used to hate themselves. So, bring on the jokes.

Any time I have run (other than in an intentionally limited scenario like a sport) I have wondered “why am I not instead riding a bicycle or rollerblades.” We if we ever need a phrase for reinventing the wheel but, like, simpler and worse, I propose “doing a run.”

Ok I'll bite. I go running with my kids before school a few times a week. Usually a mile, but sometimes longer if time permits and we feel up to it. It's a very low-barrier activity - all you need to do is put on shoes. If we're not feeling 100%, we'll walk portions of it.

I always feel euphoric when I get back - it's a much better way to wake up than slamming coffee (although I do that too). And it improves my kids' mood and focus in the morning. I get a few minutes to chat with my kids on the cooldown walking home. They are able to improve their stamina, which makes them better athletes (they really love sports).

It's one of the highlights of my day, and my kids seem to enjoy it enough put down their iDevices for a few minutes in the morning. Sometimes it can be a bit unpleasant getting started, but that feeling usually passes within a minute or two. We could do some other activity instead - but I can't think of much that beats running when it comes to benefit vs simplicity and time commitment.

Just wanted to add a positive perspective on running. And I'm a cyclist, not a runner.

How do you guys still have knees? I've not been doing high-impact sports, just tennis a few hours a week for a few years, and my left knee always hurts now. Am I just unlucky?

The danger to your knees scales with your weight class - no matter if you're overweight/fat or muscular.

A very lean and thin person weighting in at sub 70kg will hardly ever get issued with their knees, even if they run daily

Interesting, thanks. I need to lose some fat, then.

Running mechanics also greatly impact injury risk. One of the best suggestions I got was to drastically increase my cadence, which forced me to go from longer (more powerful) strides to shorter (lower impact) strides. My observation is it also shifted much of the load from my lower legs (knees and ankles) to my core (hips and glutes).

Tennis is a sport that I think of as being especially punishing on knees - with all the quick changes in direction on hard surfaces.

In the past I had some issues with my IT band when I used to run longer distances. I was able to clear it up by using a foam roller in combination with other stretches. These days I have issues with my achilles/calf, which I’m sure I could clear up with a combination of strengthening, stretching, and weight loss - but instead have just been sticking to slower speeds and shorter distances. Cushioned shoes helped, too.

It may be worth seeing a sports or physical therapist. It’s amazing how much of a difference a strengthening exercise can make. Or if you’re like me and don’t like seeing doctors, there are a lot of physical therapy videos on YouTube to try out.

Last suggestion I have is to look into cycling. I ride with lots of guys who took up cycling after ACL injuries, achilles injuries, etc., forced them to give up other sports. With a proper bike fit, I think you shouldn’t have any issues with your knees. And can be done both indoors and outdoors (smart trainers and Zwift have come a long way in making stationary bikes more fun, though still not as fun as outdoors).

You can’t foam roll or stretch away IT band issues, fascia just doesn’t work that way.

This is all good advice, thank you. I saw an ortho doctor, he recommended weight training, which I am doing, and cycling is my favorite cardio, so I need to do more of that.

Basically, I guess "exercise the thing up to the point where it starts hurting" is the general advice for this kind of thing. I just hope the pain can go away so I can enjoy tennis again.

What are you doing for the knee pain?

If you weren’t doing any activity before, the pain is probably related to muscle imbalances, (relative) overtraining or similar. Obviously not a doctor but the takeaway shouldn’t be that exercise is bad, more that years of inactivity leads to serious atrophy that later causes injury when activity levels pick up.

Well, I was playing tennis, but that's what caused it.

I took up running in 1978. I don't run as often, let alone as far, as I did 40 years ago, but I still enjoy it. As the parent comment says, it's quick and easy to lace on the shoes.

This morning I read your comment, got out of bed and went for a run with my kids. Thank you.

I’ve always been a decent runner, won some school and county races, but I’ve never enjoyed it, it was something to get through.

I stopped running years ago when I took up weight training and I didn’t miss it at all.

Last year my wife wanted to do some Spartan races so started training, I joined her for a few training runs and due to the controlled, slower pace she was running at set by the training schedule/app I loved those runs.

Turns out I was running too fast and hating every minute. I now run once or twice a week at a slowish pace, it’s been great. Speaking to “proper runners” since starting back up this is apparently very common, most people who hate running are simply going faster than they should.

Anything that gets you outside, run/sit/ride/tennis club is a good thing so well done them for organising something.

Interesting. I like running, but need to force myself for any strength training. I wonder if I'm doing the "running too fast" version of calisthenics.

Get a trainer. A good one will help you understand the progression and the different lifts and such. And will also keep you motivated when you are figuring it out. You don’t have to keep them forever but just to get started for a couple months can be great motivation in my experience.

The best encouragement I’ve had to hit the weights is the injuries that stopped me running. Gotta get strong to get back to running

Could well be, the other thing could be that weight training is quite a bit more boring than running - I rely on music to get me into a lifting zone.

Weights becomes fun when you see the progress in your physique and in the weight you can lift going up and feel in that things that were hard are now easier.

As someone else suggested, a trainer can really help as can doing a a simple compound lift based programme like Strong Lifts 5x5 as it’s simple and you make good gains pretty quickly.

In my experience, strength training is about gradually increasing the weight, start with something like 2.5 lbs, then move to 5 lbs as you go. But only add weight once you can do your sets and reps with proper form. Form really matters, bad form is how you get injured.

The other things that make a big difference: eating enough (you need more calories to lift more) and getting enough sleep as well as rest between workouts.

Like every other exercise, it's a question of building a habit.

I get that this is harmless fun - and I am legitimately happy that people got out and had some fun making up flyers and hanging out with other people. When I saw all those people hanging out in the park on a glorious Spring day, I admit I felt a twinge of jealousy as I sit here alone at my desk.

But I've got to say... I find it a bit distasteful how Americans increasingly seem to be more united by their dislikes than their interests.

Recently there was a frontpage HN news post about "stoop coffee" [1] - and that felt like a much more chill and constructive approach to doing nothing with other people.

[1] https://supernuclear.substack.com/p/stoop-coffee-how-a-simpl...

Yes exactly. I think it’s because it is easy and cheap to find someone with your opinion and it requires no effort if that opinion is disliking something. If you like model trains you have to build them, run their routes, talk to others if you want to build a larger town or whatever, it’s very involved and you can spend your time and money pursuing the hobby. If you hate model trains you only need to find someone on the internet who will comment back to you and already you have completed your hate and can move on to the next train to hate.

This is all why I have come to the conclusion that no matter what my thoughts are about something I should mostly keep them to myself if I’m unwilling to do things related to those thoughts. This has helped me find a lot of time I spent disliking things and discussing those dislikes and now I spend that time either trying to fix what I dislike or focus on something I do like.

Also that stoop coffee post is a great post.

5 years ago I blew out a knee running and we ended up getting a Peloton (coincidentally the end of Feb 2020) since the doctor said it would be less stress on my knees.

Used their service some, but I 3D printed a phone holder for the handlebars. Now instead of sitting in a chair watching videos and scrolling HN, I do it with an elevated heart rate for 30 minutes.

Sure it's not the "right" way to exercise, but I've lost weight (in combination with an improved diet), have more energy and I feel less guilty about screentime.

Why isn't it the "right" way to do exercise? I do something similar with my "zone 2" cycling workouts, where I throw a movie on Netflix while I mindlessly pedal at a fixed power output. It's a great way to get in some exercise, especially in the Winter months when it's hard/unappealing to get outside.

Applying the principle of least resistance to working out is the right way. The best workout will always be the one you can do consistently.

https://matt.might.net/articles/hacking-strength/

Years ago a coworker asked me if it's okay to take his multivitamin before going to bed.

I replied, "taking them at all is the hurdle. Don't worry about not getting 5% of your multivitamin, because you're still getting the other 95%."

Starting something is the biggest hurdle.

This. Most people don't finish [definiton of your race] not because they give up but because they don't try.

It is the right way to exercise. I think that the modern "if it is fun and pleasant then it does not count enough" is what keeps people off exercising, off learning, etc.

I have a bad ankle/foot that is causing me trouble when I run so I switched to cycling. I never had knee problems when running but I now get knee pain from cycling...

It could be an issue with your position (seat too high, too low, cranks too long, if you are using clipless pedals maybe need to get wider stance, ...). I would get a professional bike fit.

I own a stationary indoor exercise bicycle. Its quite fancy.. has a magnetically coupled flywheel to adjust the difficulty setting and has all the electronic counters etc. I try use it every day/second day and on those days I really have to motivate myself to get on it and do my 40 min cycle. The first 10 mins is really tough for me and I find I have to put in a lot of mental effort to enter a meditative frame of mind that helps me finish the workout but, by the end of those 40 mins and for the rest of the day I feel on top of the world... its the one thing that helps to motivate me to get back on it everyday.

I suspect its the same thing with most endurance type sports which include running. Most people don't actually like the idea of it but the feeling of well-being makes them keep on doing it.

I’ve been enjoying the local Fuck Run Club. Great way to meet people.

Is there a comma in there some place? Maybe between the first two words?

Why not between all of them?

I read "Fuck" as an adjective modifying "Run". You know... they go on Fuck Runs.

Because it's lots of fun during the first two, but not fun at all when you're the one getting clubbed.

Wherever you want. It's a very open-minded club.

We don't talk about sit club

I like running, and I don't even wear shoes, from nike or any other maker.

The wet sand on the beach at low tide is the ultimate running surface.

And getting away from streets and cars and noise and barking dogs and most of the rest of our idiot primate species is a major mental refreshment, as well as a physical improvment.

I highly recommend it...

p.s. I enjoy sitting too, but like most engineers my work already has me sitting WAY too much. And the authors complaint about corporate "big run" is then followed up with how they start each weekend at a corporate coffee corps. Sad lack of awareness, really.

I love the writing style, and ended up binge reading 4-5 other pieces! This one is my favorite:

https://rawandferal.substack.com/p/cooking-up-mehrans-steak-...

This is why we still love San Francisco.

A few years ago my wife and I went to the Lard Butt 1K. It was a single lap around the Polo Fields track, with beer stands before and after and donut stands every few hundred feet around the course. Instead of time groups they had weight classes. I dressed as The Dude. We ambled next to a guy dressed as a cockroach pulling a wagon full of his similarly dressed children; he was Papa Roach.

We've got our problems here, to be sure, but there's nowhere I'd rather be.

This is great! Looks like it only went on in 2018 and is mostly a Seattle thing. Would be great to bring this back to San Francisco.

We went twice in SF (and have the tshirts to prove it). And yes, they absolutely should bring it back.

You should check out the beer mile races

I'll keep an eye out!

Small children love running around.

I think adult running maybe takes the fun out of it by making you run 5km rather than 50m.

Also the runners who look sexy tend to be the 100m sprinters rather than the marathoners.

As an avid runner this doesn’t seem to sit too well with me.

Will they also be ultra sittings? 24h without getting up? Categories toilet seat and hardcore?

And what happens if your nose starts running during those 24h?

Man, I should join a run club.

Triathlon Club when?

As in sit, watch TV and drink beer?

I'd be more in favour of parcour/shoot a tv/run away, then celebrate with beer after.

Fuck Sit Club, join Shit Club. Al you need to do is say hello to the person in the stall next to you and presto, you're part of the club. Competition schedule will follow forthwith.

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