The only thing I find to improve it is to not be tired or stressed when eating with others, or lively conversation as a distraction. Easy, right?
The only thing I find to improve it is to not be tired or stressed when eating with others, or lively conversation as a distraction. Easy, right?
- People don't want to feel judged, and people will assume you are judging them (not the core issue with misophonia)
- It takes energy to change and accommodate and people might rather not
- If you don't have misophonia, it's not very understandable or relatable to others
While I wish I could snap my fingers and have everyone change, I think I'm more of the mindset now of:
- I need to try to get help (therapy) to minimize the impact on myself
- It's worth asking the few people you spend the most time around to meet you halfway on this stuff
- It's probably unreasonable to ask most people to alter their behavior (and tiring to keep asking everyone)
That said… I'd be lying if I didn't often think "OK man it's not that hard to just close your mouth." But that's more of an inside thought.
Really? Scott Alexander had a response to this very article pointing out that judgment does indeed seem to be the core issue with misophonia ( https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/misophonia-beyond-sensory-s... ):
> So it’s a sensory hypersensitivity, right? Maybe not. There’s increasing evidence - which I learned about from Jake [author of the Asterisk piece], but which didn’t make it into the article - that misophonia is less about sound than it seems.
> Misophoniacs who go deaf report that it doesn’t go away. Now they get triggered if they see someone chewing. It’s the same with other noises. Someone who gets triggered by the sound of forks scraping against a table will eventually get triggered by the sight of the scraping fork. Someone triggered by music will eventually get triggered by someone playing a music video on mute.
> If you trick misophoniacs into thinking their trigger sounds are something else, they won’t get triggered. In this study, scientists played people who hated chewing sounds a video (with audio) of someone chewing; unsurprisingly, they hated it. Then they played them a video of someone walking on squelching snow, but the audio track was secretly actually the same chewing sounds. It looked like the snow was making the noise - now the misophoniacs didn’t hate it!
> some misophoniacs say that they’re only triggered by specific people - usually those close to them. If some rando chews loudly, they’ll be mildly annoyed; if their brother does, they’ll flip out. Probably there’s a reasonable explanation here too, but at this point maybe we should also be considering a larger-scale update.
> even as misophonia makes me miserable - even as I absolutely fail to overcome it - I can’t help feeling like it’s sort of fake. I’d already noticed something like the thing about people close to me. The way I thought of it was something about righteous anger. The sound of the wind in the trees barely bothered me at all, because there was no one to get angry at. Sounds that were natural parts of the social order were nearly as benign - I didn’t like hearing the bus driver announce the next stop, but it was an inevitable part of the bus-riding experience and I was resigned to it. But if a group of gangbangers scared the kids out of the nearby park and put on loud music while smoking drugs, I would go through the roof.
He doesn't actually make the connection, but the way he describes his own experience with misophonia is pretty much identical to the phenomenon of e.g. compulsively checking a Twitter feed from someone you hate.
But given my lifestyle, I almost never have to be around anybody who's eating, except in contexts in which I can't hear them eating (busy brunch, say).
However, I'm not sure I agree that the taboo you describe is a kind of unreasonable cultural quirk. It is a pretty uncomfortable imposition to be asked to eat more quietly. It's more confrontational by nature than e.g. asking somebody if they wouldn't mind being a little quieter in the theater. And yes, some people surely become too provoked by the request, but also the person making the request could often do a better job with the tone. Either way though, finding a truly non-provocative angle for this request is basically intractable.
I agree. At a minimum, it needs to clearly come off as a "it's not you or personal, it's this weird condition I have, it's difficult for me to control at this time, and it causes me distress" - which is 100% true.
> Either way though, finding a truly non-provocative angle for this request is basically intractable.
You definitely never know what you're going to get from people! But, I suppose it's good to know if others have room to make space for you.
In any case that still wasn't good enough for them, so I proffered some helpful suggestions for alternative solutions to the problem, which was that they take themselves somewhere else, or they could learn to deal with it themselves. Unfortunately this was taken extremely personally and caused great offense, judging by the reaction.
I have even pointed out to them when they are eating loudly and they do the revenge chew thing you're talking about, lol. I don't think the rational part of their brain has reconciled the fact that it's not actually possible for them to eat silently with their unreasonable demands of others.
At some point if your behavior is outside the norm, things are going to go more smoothly for you if you cater to the rest of society and deal rather than the other way around. You can always ask people to eat quieter and maybe they should but you'll certainly annoy and/or embarrass many people by asking, that's the reality.
> The only thing I find to improve it is to not be tired or stressed when eating with others, or lively conversation as a distraction. Easy, right?
That does actually sound easy unless you work at a restaurant or on a submarine or something.
"I'm not sure if you're aware, but you are chewing quite loudly"
Tone (neutral) is important. Sometimes they genuinely aren't aware. They know it's theoretically a social faux pas but never thought to check themselves.
I think they've grown up around loud eaters.
I've had nice conversations about it, the person listened, but was only able to be reasonable quiet for a short period of time. And then simply reverted. (they didn't care)
I found the best solution was simply to face this head on and deaden my reactions to it. This reduced my reactions to a living tolerable level.
Well, that's just you not empathizing with them. Chewing is not too different from walking. Imagine if someone told you they think your gait is too short, and could you take longer steps. How long would you be able to hold your affected gait before going back to your optimal gait?
Any subconscious behavior has to be controlled with a lot of effort and focus to change.
Almost no one I have ever met has changed a subconscious behavior, just because I asked in a certain way.
Walking can be met half way, or I can adjust _my_ gait to match there's. There's no equivalent to an irritating behavior.