WB offers replacements, but no refunds, for DVDs rotting prematurely
arstechnica.com
arstechnica.com
Some people online at the time mentioned WB replaced a few of their disks with bluray's but I never managed to get WB to respond to my inquiries.
I ended up flying the jolly roger, I mean I own a legal copy, so its just format shifting...
[1](https://www.backblaze.com/blog/the-3-2-1-backup-strategy/)
This matters because discs are not a physical product so much as a representative of a license you own. If the license doesn’t expire, the format shouldn’t matter at all.
So again, your comment was way off topic because this has nothing to do with the idea of superior storage techniques, but fallout from licensing-based approaches.
Disk is a physical copy. Those who think it's a "representation of the license" are just luddites who cause harm to preservation of art.
If your solution is “just break the law”, there are an enormous number of problems you could get past.
DMCA 1201 shouldn't exist too for the reference. Its proponents are all corrupt crooks.
I already mentioned the solution above - start selling video DRM free. Repealing junk laws like DMCA 1201 is just a bonus to that.
And if the other half is throwing up your hands and hoping the companies with a vested interest and legitimate use cases will randomly stop, I have bad news about the likelihood of that succeeding.
At some point, things just don't work anymore, even if two decades is significantly less time than other DVDs.
When your media is advertised to last for 100 years, it is reasonable to want a replacement when it lasts less than a quarter of that time
Yet the comments here talk like we have norms that don't exist. The actual norms we have are that you're SOL if your product breaks after the warranty, even due to a defect, and even for things that cost 1000x the price of a DVD.
That's not technically true. Implied warranties are a thing. The law in the US and many other places does place obligations of warranty on sellers beyond the whims of their voluntary warranties.
There's a reason every piece of FOSS software doesn't simply come without a warranty, they all disclaim warranty.
Now it isn't likely that it would be applicable to products quite as old as these, but the idea that "the manufacturer's written warranty is the only warranty" is a total falsehood that large companies want you to believe.
Warranty is about fitness for use, merchantability, and honoring sales contracts. It has nothing to do with issues of intellectual property.
If you sold someone a book, filled with public domain content, and the ink faded after a week, you can't just throw up your hands and say that the buyer should have made another copy. You'd likely be liable for warranty of merchantability.
The fact that it's a limited license attached to the physical disc only makes my case more clear, I think. There's even less expectation that I have some claim to the content if the disc breaks in 20 years.
The US didn't correctly defend the right to backup, but that leaves a funny grey zone where WB being bad at making DVDs means less ability to shame "piracy" tool makers because backups is normalized and in no way suspicious if the media isn't perfect like they said.
It was only with the advent of toner based xerox in the 70s that photocopying books became vaguely practical, but still cost about 5 cents a page, at a time when a mass market paperback might cost $1.25.
When no replacement discs are available, that's a more interesting edge case where they should feel obligated to do something to make it right in some other way, and I'd say a refund should be on the table.
I'll trade you a copy of "Big Momma's House 2" for your damaged copy of "The Two Towers".
Heck, I have DiscoVision discs from the 70s that still work.
DVDs from 2006 should definitely still work.
Also, storage conditions can deeply affect how well a medium lasts but that's no excuse for defective discs.
It would be like if you had a known batch of badly-bound books that fell apart prematurely even under good storage conditions.
The laws around DVDs are the same. You have a right to access and view the contents of the DVD. You don't have a right to make copies of the dvd.
I'd also point out products like cheap paperbacks which obliterate themselves after 4 or 5 reads.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for some good reforms and regulations around copyrights and media access, especially in the digital age. I just think it's a little bit ridiculous to expect purchased media to never degrade.
Nobody expects that. We just expect to not have to pay for the content again just because the media degraded and needed replacement.
And would anyone have paid the extra money for a 20+ year warranty for some DVDs? Absolutely not.
> > Apparantly most releases from Warner Bros on HD-DVD have laser rot. I have many titles that just freeze in the middle of the movie. I thought it was a problem with my player, but I read on other forums that this is a manufacturing fault from the discs...
https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?p=10181&sid=5039399ce60...
https://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=840
Or in 2015, where some forum users narrow down the year range and manufacturing code:
> > It seems like the problematic discs were produced from 2006 to 2009 or so. I haven't found any DVDs from before or after those dates that exhibit these problems (even the original DVDs I bought in December of 2000 still look and play perfectly).
https://nitrateville.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=20399&sid=3238...
If you buy a monitor and it fails after a week of use, should you be SOL? If the failure is due to a manufacturing defect, and not the user's treatment of the product or just the expected lifespan of that product class, consumer protection laws should protect the consumer.
30 years later, still sticks with me.
That's the point of a "copy right". That only one entity holds the legal right to make copies.
We have the concept of the finite warranty. And part of that is because there's a point where it's infeasible to expect everything you buy to last forever nor someone to be on the hook forever for things that don't last forever.
Car warranties are typically three years.
But what about DVDs that break due to a defect after 20 years?
If I can't pirate it, then I expect it to be replaced, this is the system they demanded.
Saying you're "renting" the disc is just plain disingenuous, though. You own it free and clear. You can give it to anyone you like, for free or for a profit (i.e. how Netflix did things back in the day). The original owner is not asserting the right to come and take it back from you. It is in no way a rental, it is a sale.
I would for my cello if a repair or replacement wasn't doable because it came with a lifetime warranty against defects.