Brazilians hail strength of democracy as Bolsonaro is called to account | Hacker News Reader

Brazilians hail strength of democracy as Bolsonaro is called to account

theguardian.com

31 pointsPaulHoule9 comments

Is this the same "strong democracy" that got Lula out of jail as a bargaining chip offered by Bolsonaro to stop the Federal Police investigation that was closing in on himself and his family?

Brazil is not a strong democracy, it's just two faces of the same political elites playing power games where they occasionally have to sacrifice one of their pieces.

This gives me hope that democracy can prevail even in the face of extreme inequality. Hopefully this administrations ongoing actions are evident to those whose minds need changing, and that those folks aren't too far gone (too accepting and welcoming of autocracy) to do the right thing for the country.

Democracy has long prevailed in places outside the wealthy West.

Americans can learn what they taught others: Democracy is something to believe in, to stand up for, and it generally wins when you do - because it's the right thing.

Still, as a counterpoint to the OP: Trump has been investigated and charged, but his election prevented him from being convicted so far.

One reason Trump is not prosecuted now is that he controls the Justice Department, which makes prosecution decisions. In other countries, those decisions are made by judges. How does it work in Brazil?

It has always seemed odd to me that the political leader controls prosecutions in the US government, due to the obvious risk of politicization. In many/most states and localities, attorney generals and district attorneys are elected separately from the political head of government.

That said, there is a benefit to prosecutors being independent from judges; the judges also are human and have biases and can be corrupt.

Even if the president didn't control the Justice Department, couldn't he just pardon himself?

You can pardon for crimes, but my weak understanding is that violation of a court order is not something you can pardon or enable, by law at least.

The executive branch can just not comply with civil contempt sanctions against its own members (not pay fines, and the Marshal’s Service can just not take people into custody for civil confinement), and either pardon or decline to prosecute (or both) for criminal contempt, and then the court order has no teeth.

Agreed. That's a separate issue. Presumably if the US populace changed one (with a constitutional amendment), it might change the other.

The fear that potentially prosecuting an executive incentivizes coups is silly in this context. Brazil's influence in this respect sure would better my government.

C'mon Brazilians, lean on us.

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