German tourist held indefinitely in San Diego area immigrant detention facility
kpbs.org
kpbs.org
https://www.instagram.com/jessica.lia.tt/?hl=en Jessica Lia Blood Bank
Mexico - 06.12 -25.01
Los Angeles - 26.01 - 16.01
Berlin - 24.02 -20.04
DM
Edited to add back locations, she has used fun UTF8 characters for stylized letters that got stripped out by hacker news.
> The most recent DHS data released this week shows that fewer than 600 people per day have been booked into ICE detention facilities across the country during the first three weeks of February — well below the pace of 1,200 to 1,500 arrests a day that administration officials have said they want.
The more detainees they have, and the longer they have them, the more they get paid.
A quick search shows that in the past, she had posted on social media about being in the U.S. and working. It’s likely that her equipment raised a red flag, and during additional screening, they found those posts. It’s unfortunate for her, but ultimately, it was her own doing.
I know plenty of digital nomads who work in the U.S. without proper visas, but the difference is they keep a low profile. Visa laws aren’t unique to the U.S., and most countries take violations seriously. In fact, the U.S. isn’t even among the strictest.
There’s plenty to be outraged about in the world without making things up.
edit: I'm not going to justify this reddit post with any sources. It's obviously bait and 20 seconds of googling confirms it.
If you'd like to go through the article and provide actual examples I'll help you with being a critical reader. When it says something "amounts" to solitary confinment, that isn't the same as saying she was held in solitary confinment. That's shifty reporting trying to spin the facts without the legal repercussions of directly lying. When you get to the part about her having violent outbursts and punching walls until there is "blood everywhere" you might then ask yourself "could this person be a risk to themselves or a cell mate" or maybe "what are the international consequences if she were to harm herself or someone else while in custody?" The world is never black and white and there are plenty of these points in the article where you should be asking questions and maybe looking to other sources for answers.
The article is using her friend/girlfriend as the primary source, even though she is clearly biased and has no actual information, which she has no right to given she isn't a family member, her lawyer, or the German consulate. It's almost like they are purposely ignoring the actual facts and are trying to manufacture an emotional response to get this to go viral and somehow receive a more favorable outcome. Seriously, find an article that isn't tabloid quality. Even better, do a search of reputable German news sources like der Spiegel. If she were actually being hidden away and mistreated they would be reporting on it in Germany.
From the few facts that are available, it sounds like she would have been released and sent back to Germany had she just admitted she fucked up and plead guilty. My guess, mostly just based on the fact that she was punching walls in jail, she lacks some degree of emotional intelligence, doesn't like the idea of being barred from the US, and thinks she can fight it and win. Now she has to remain in custody until she is tried, which will likely be fairly soon, or a deal is worked out. These are processes that were agreed on (and as the last couple sentences of the article mentions is actively being handled) between the respective governments. Anyone caught doing the same in Germany would face similar consequences.
I think what a lot of commenters here don't realize is that most western countries, including the US and Germany, have artist visas for this specific scenario. These are relatively easy to get and would have allowed her to do what she was doing. Instead she chose to commit a federal offense and is paying the price for that choice. I'm not mentioning this to deflect, I'm directly responding to the article which tries to make it sound like she was "doing everything right" and is being unjustly held.
Jail isn't great but it's not actual torture. It's mostly just uncomfortable and extremely boring. It's not anymore cruel or tortuous than it has to be given the circumstances.
> “She says it was like a horror movie,” Lofving said. “There were people screaming from the rooms all around. They are feeding her through a little mailbox hole. She didn’t have a blanket, she didn’t have a pillow. It’s basically a yoga mat on the ground and a toilet on the corner.”
> Spending that many days in one of CBP’s short-term detention facilities appears to be a violation of the agency's own internal detention standards, which, “generally limit detention in these facilities to 72 hours,” according to a 2023 report from the Office of Inspector General.
> Inspectors conducted unannounced inspections of four short-term facilities in San Diego and El Centro. They found that of the 447 migrants detained in all four stations, 42% of them exceeded the 72-hour standard, with some being there for more than 20 days.
If nothing else, I think it's obvious that most people can't sleep under circumstances like that. After 9+ days of those conditions, you find it at all surprising that she broke?
I find those conditions to be morally repugnant. And frankly, I find attempts at justifying them equally repugnant.
Okay, let's put on our critical reading hat again. What order are these events taking place in? Why isn't the author just using a simple chronological telling of her ordeal? What does it mean to "generally limit" it to 72 hours? That doesn't sound very concrete; what does it mean to be a standard vs a policy, law, or rule? So most detainees are out before 72 hours, does that sound like they are folowing the "general" standard? What is the median amount of time someone is in there? What is the average? How long are the other 42% in there? When does processing take place? Do they process on Saturday? Sunday? What portion were in there for 4-5 days? How many is "some" when it comes to the 20 days? Is one? If the majority are out in 3 days, why do some take longer? How do they ID a foreign national? How do they know who to call or where to send someone who isn't being cooperative with there identity?
You see, things can be a bit more complicated than how a single ragebait article makes it sound?
I had a fun weekend in college that lead to me spending 6 consecutive days in a county jail, so I'll concede that I might have a better understanding of the setting than you do. The being fed through a "mailbox hole" literally means there is a big slot in the middle of the door that they slide a balanced meal through on a cafeteria tray three times a day at standard times, so everyone can just enjoy their meal in relative peace and safety. How would you propose they do that differently? What do the logistics look like for having dozens of short term inmates, that you might know their identity but really have no idea of their personalities, together in a cafeteria? How would you prefer to eat in this situation? Again, pay attention to the wording of the article. "Basically" a yoga mat is not the same as saying she only had a yoga mat. From my experience it was about 1.5" thick and was more similar to a thick backpacking sleeping pad. I did have a springless, elevated, flat metal platform to put my pad on, but I was in the upper Midwest where it's too cold half the year to sleep directly on the floor so they welded this platform to the wall. The toilet is likely a stainless steel, flushing toilet with a sink built into the back. Personally, I'd prefer having a private toilet but I got to have the fun of sharing mine with my methhead cellmate who didn't have a solid shit the three days he was in the cell with me. How would you do her sleeping situation differently? Remember, this isn't a prison, it's a short term facility where you have no idea of who the inmates are. As for what "amounted" to solitary confinement, what does that mean? Well I imagine it's similar to a county jail. You are in your cell most of the day. You get out in small groups to shower and wash up and you may get an hour of physical time where you might have a basketball or more likely you just walk the perimeter of a tiny gym. It isn't torture, it's just really, really boring. Yeah, there were people in there with real emotional issues that would yell and talk loudly to themselves in their cells, but it is a concrete building with heavy doors and it's annoying but not deafening. It's also not 24-7. Try and yell for an hour. Now imagining doing that all day or night? Or maybe you'd relate more if you think about how your voice is the next day after going to a concert or a loud bar with your friends. Also, the guards are just people too. Talk to a local sheriff deputy who works the county jail. They don't want to be there anymore than the inmates. They are doing a job that is all the worst parts of law enforcement, customer service, and day care, all rolled into one. They don't want to listen to yelling all day and night either and do a fairly decent job of going around and quieting people down and distracting the problem people. As for sleep, that is basically all people do in there. It's the best way to pass time.
A day is waking up at 6am for breakfast, sleep, bodyweight workout in cell, shower, sleep, eat lunch, do problems in your head/day dream, sleep, more thinking, dinner at 5pm, think some more, sleep. It's amazing how much you can force yourself to sleep when that is all you have left to do after a couple days of your brain going a mile a minute from the boredom.
It's not a horror film. The other inmates aren't monsters, they are people too. Though I'm sure to her entitled ass, all those unkempt poors might have seemed pretty scary. They are in the same (possibly worse) situation she is. Everyone just wants to get through it and move on. Which brings up a good point, who are the other inmates? While you are worried about the woman who will soon be back in her wealthy and safe country, with arguably one of the best qualities of life in the world, where do they go? While you defend the lady who was free to come and go from the US as she pleased and willfully broke the law knowing she could have filled out a couple forms and paid a fee to be here legally, there are people in those facilities whose only crime is being born in a shitty country. Those people would do anything to be in her position. They would do anything just for the chance to have a fraction of the privilege she has. They packed up their families and migrated thousands of miles, sometimes by foot, just for the chance of asylum. No simple form. No guarantee. Just a chance at a better life. What happens to those people? Do you think they are sitting around crying about how horrible jail was? After they get shipped to another third-world country (which may or may not be the country they are from) with no money or way to support themselves, do you think they'll jump on tik-tok and make countless videos about how poorly they were mistreated? You think they'll capitalize on the outrage?
So go ahead and call me repugnant for not being instantly outraged and daring to think critically about the article. Personally, I find what she did, and the narrative her friend is pushing, to be extremely ignorant and orders of magnitude more repugnant. If the system is so awful and the facility is so crowded that they are having trouble moving people out of it in a timely matter, do you think her being their helped it any? Do you think the resources they are using to deal with her emotionally stunted tantrums are well spent? Do you think the resources they are spending as she tries to weasel out of the consequences are well spent? To be that out of touch and entitled is just gross and you are equally gross and entitled for defending it.
Elementary, Watson. "Private contractors" make their money billing the government. She is a source of income.
This seems to be key point - but sounds awfully subjective if you can just be accused. Did she bring her tattoo equipment or something? I mean a person could type or code on a laptop too for work...
Edit: yes, apparently:
> According to Lofving, Brösche had equipment on her that she used for tattooing, and this may have been part of the reason for her detention.
https://www.tag24.com/lifestyle/tattoos/vacationing-tattoo-a...
Still seems a dumb criteria.
If it's true, it seems pretty open and shut, so I'm not really sure why this is popping up on HN now.
I wonder what made them arrive at that assumption. My best guess: she was carrying work equipment (for working as a tattoo artist) in her luggage?!
I don't get why she was detained instead of just refusing entry though.
2) You have to be an idiot to visit currently. The rule of law is now nothing more than guidelines and Trump and his ilk have publicly stated they alone can decide what's right or wrong.
Edit: Somebody fucking explain. She tried to cross the border on the 25th, 5 days after Trump's presidency started and after he started rounding up and deporting people.
Don’t visit the US. Don’t come here and spend your money. Don’t send your kids to our universities. Don’t vacation here. Stay away for the next 4 or so years. It’s clear this administration is brain dead and can’t govern.
From the article: “Brösche had her German passport, confirmation of her visa waiver to enter the country, along with a copy of her return ticket back to Berlin, Lofving said. A U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) agent pulled Brösche aside for a secondary inspection.
“I look at her and go, ‘I’m going to wait right outside for you,’” Lofving recalled.
She didn’t know it then, but it would be 25 days before Lofving would see her friend again. Brösche would spend that time in federal detention, where she remains, waiting for a deportation flight back to Berlin.”
Though the article doesn’t say when they determined that, how they could have known, and anything from the woman detained.
That government was elected by the majority of Americans, and continue to be supported by them. Blaming this in the administration alone is too easy and hoping this American problem will just go away after Trump's legislation period is naive. If the majority of Americans don't receive a proper education and open their eyes to what their decisions do to your country, the following 4 years will be hust as awful.
debatable, poll numbers are cratering
What is concerning here, as an occasional bona fide business visitor to the US, is that it was always my expectation that if I were refused for some reason then I would just find myself turned around and placed on the next flight back. Seeing someone held in a private, for-profit, detention centre for an extended time period is not the behaviour I had previously expected from the US. It is a worry.
It is absolutely a system that's designed to disappear people. It's just headcount for income, no-one cares who those heads belong to.
None of that is guarantee of entry into the US, which is completely at the discretion of the CBP officer. And the protocol on denial of entry for much longer than this administration has been around is to detain you until you can be put on a flight back to your country of origin. The saga also goes on your record, and you will have to mention & explain it in the DS-160 form for any future visa applications.
Those of us from certain countries who've had cause to visit the US have been well aware of this for decades, with the corresponding game you have to play with the CBP officer (Everything is designed to trip you up. Have every possible document on hand, even if not explicitly mentioned as a requirement. Never use certain trigger words (like work) even if travelling on company time, instead say that it's a business trip. And so on).
It's not even unique to the US either, though US border (and embassy) officials IMO tend to have a pretty big chip on their shoulders. The only place I've had a more hostile experience is the Maldives (the manager of my hotel very kindly vouched that I would leave the country on my return ticket date even though we hadn't spoken at all before my rather frantic call to him, which was the only thing that swayed them enough to let me leave the airport).
IIRC the only limits are 2 days for you to be taken to a facility (so you're not just being held in an interrogation room in an airport or wherever), and 90 days for you to be removed once there is an order for your deportation. The actual detention in between is limitless. Of course there's incentive to keep people moving through (and most people have a home country/embassy that they can eventually appeal to to expedite things), so in practice it isn't literally a de facto life sentence.
These are things that have been happening at your borders (and, in different forms, at other borders around the world) for years - you're just less likely to see it if you have one of the strongest passports in the world. But to be fair, whenever you wake up is your own morning.
Other countries of course are worse - I hear very bad things about Japan, and in places like Syria and Russia prison is there for torture and death.
There was another recent story, about an inmate in a NYC jail being killed in what looks to be a routine beating by guards.
Compared to Russia there is little corruption and lawfulness. The justice system reflects the conservative retaliation values most Americans have when it comes to justice system. People just want justice system to cause suffering. Nothing is more American comedy than men being raped in prison.
Is this really true? Because it is my instinctual belief for staying on internet too much, but when i think about who i've met there, i don't think it's true (well, most of them were hippies and back-to-lander, the few who had a job worked in natural parks or as musicians, so maybe i did not meet the average USian)
I suspect what OP means is that people outside America don’t make similar jokes, not that it’s quintessential American comedy. It’s just (mostly?) uniquely American comedy.
Legal aid for migrant children has now ended, leaving many to navigate courts alone https://apnews.com/article/trump-legal-aid-unaccompanied-chi... US Judges, liberal and conservative, just continue sit there day after day and don't find that "right to fair trial" is not violated.
More generally US plea bargaining system is just cruel. See US Bar Association Plea Bargain Task Force Report: https://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/aba/publications/cri... Prosecutors are effectively coercing people to take prison sentences.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-end-eb-5-immigrant-in...
What is the plan here? To send her to Guantanamo?
Seems like the USA has very low standards for what's "right" these days.
Needless to say, this doesn't clear the bar.
Neither of the women even deny the accusations..