Hacker News Reader

Comment by buyucu | Hacker News Reader

aren't tesla cars (in)famous for their very bad build quality?

Perhaps, but I find the insane service policy from Tesla (the one that's nonexistent) to be the most decisive factor in failing the inspections. Many of these issues would have been caught in routine inspections at service intervals.

I have 2 Teslas at home. Previously have been a user of premium brands like Mercedes and Audi. I have to say that the build quality of my Model 3 and Y is way better than what I got from those "premium" German auto brands. Suspension geometry and design is what you would expect from a car priced much higher.

The issue with these Teslas (and also other electrics) is that you almost never press the brake pedal. This becomes a problem in the inspection when the brakes are not performing as they should. One should keep special attention to these parts when driving an electric vehicle with one-pedal driving. You must use the brakes from time to time.

I haven't explicitly checked my current EV, but IIRC the BMW i3 I had previously would track regen usage and periodically forego regen in order to exercise the brakes. The point being to avoid old crusty brakes when you need them the most.

My Hyundai does the same.

A lot of cars automatically turn on the AC unit when you turn on the defroster / defogger. This does of course help with fog, but it also ensures that the AC unit gets used all winter. I've been told a problem they used to have with AC in cars was that they'd stop working after 6 months of not being used in the winter; turning on the AC with the defroster effectively fixes that problem.

So it seems like the obvious thing to do would be to have the electronics system make sure to exercise the brakes for you -- e.g., once a week use the disc brakes even if regen braking is on; and possibly just put the brakes on when the car is stopped or stopping, even if it's not necessary.

My car always brakes the last 10kph down to zero normally, also solves the problem.

Putting the brakes on if the car is stopped wouldn't help solve the whole issue (move the calipers - yes, but the wear surfaces remain essentially untouched).

There are many many many other EV and hybrids which weirdly don't exhibit this issue

I don't think suspension geometry and design is what people mean when they say build quality. Stuff like panel gaps and alignment, roofs flying off on highways, inability to handle drive-through car washes, and so on is what the "build quality" complaints refer to.

I know most people don't look at those things when evaluating build quality (but some others do). From personal experience I cannot say I've experienced any of the things you mentioned, but it's true that first US made batches of Model 3 were notorious for panel gap alignment issues, and we know those were produced "in a rush" in order to create a viable product.

I believe those issues are not related to the article in question though. The article mentions defects in cars, that given the segment and usage pattern, are to be expected imho. People need to learn how to maintain properly those cars (particularly suspension bushings, wheels and brakes). If you're not familiar with cars, I would recommend taking your car periodically (once a year) for an inspection by a professional.

I've driven a couple Model 3s from carsharing and while they're not built badly I wouldn't say they are at the level of german brands if you start looking for issues. They kinda get away with it since the interior and exterior are extremely simple though and they do drive very well. I haven't driven other as powerful electrics but the way you can treat the throttle as an on/off switch in corners and jerk the wheel without losing control is kinda incredible. It lets you drive like a complete mong and still be fast. It's quite hilarious.

Yes and no. They gained a lot of fame on how poorly outer parts fit together (but I think they overcame that)

But in terms of engine and safety they are considered absolutely top notch and it is surprising that they are not doing well after only 4 years.

They tend to resolve their problems over time but new releases do suffer.

Cybertruck for example has been a complete mess.

Yes

There have been many reports of poor build quality over the years, yes [1] - leaking gull-wing doors, visibly inconsistent gaps in panel work, the latest and greatest models like cybertrucks having water ingress problems, and so on.

But at the same time many other vehicle manufacturers have been making some less-than-ideal decisions with their EV offerings.

For example, Teslas have water-cooled batteries, while the (considerably cheaper) Nissan Leaf doesn't. So if your measure of quality is "will it keep going beyond 150,000 miles?" you'll find the vehicles with battery cooling do a lot better on that metric.

[1] https://youtu.be/jPBGVI2oFLI?t=139

The Leaf with the problematic battery was discontinued eight years ago, FWIW; AFAIK the 2017 model's batteries age fairly well.

That used to be the case, but nowadays on par with every other car manufacturer

It depends on how you view things. Shoddy body/panel work is infamous at this point (maybe fixed?).

And later on, servicing is notoriously shady and closed.

> servicing is notoriously shady and closed.

Afaik in most of the world car companies are required to offer the tools to third party service stations at a reasonable price. Then again if you control the full supply line you can make repairs near impossible so there is that. And also reasonable does not mean economicaly viable unfortunately.

I'd love to see it made a requirement to be affordable to end users but that is a bridge too far I guess. Most mechanical tools are affordable enough but electrical is still insanely expensive up to the point you are nearly required to buy Chinese copy/bootleg variants.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com