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Comment by gedy | Hacker News Reader

If you ever have a chance, talk to Vietnamese immigrants that you work with, and hear their stories of escape. Nearly everyone I've spoken to has a book or movie-worthy tale to tell.

Many went through tough times after the war was over and left years later.

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That applies equally to most people having been through war and becoming refugees. I know a couple of people who fled from Afghanistan, and that wasn't exactly a cakewalk. Like "my brother was forced to enroll in the talibans and got killed, so they ordered my father to provide another fighter, so he decided to make me escape to Iran instead at age 13, from where I walked / hitchhiked to Sweden in 2 years"

was the taliban going to follow into all of the EU countries in between Iran and Sweden?

The Sympathizer/The Committed though fictional have many details that match the stories of different people I know, with the taking off from Saigon airfield while under attack from NVA to others escaping on a boat with only the hope of being picked up by friendlies of some stripe and avoiding pirates or others who could only escape in any case with some of their immediate family and had to get the rest reunited years later. Not a few of the ones old enough to remember the details though are getting scarce simply because of age (some of the people I know were too young to remember anything and had to rely on their parents memories).

I worked with a Vietnamese lady for many years. She refused to ever talk about her escape. She would simply only say, "I was very young. It was bad. I don't like to remember it."

My grandmother said the same thing about the end of the Second World War as a young German and wouldn’t elaborate.

The brain has this nice thing of removing traumatizing memories so that it can move on. Asking people about these things is not a good idea. Just let them recount the tales if they want.

Yup: many settled in southern coastal states and endured vicious racism aimed at keeping them from shrimping.

Many are still here in Louisiana and Texas. But in Louisiana and New Orleans the population is shrinking.

From 2.3% in 2010 to 1.8% in 2020 of Louisiana’s population.

I remember seeing women on the sides of the highway in one part of town gathering plants to eat, there's plenty of edible stuff out there, and my parents telling me they were refugees. Must have been in '74/'75 and I was a wee lad. In a Southern state. My parents were PhDs from Berkley and UCLA who got positions in the south so it was a weird time and place. For everyone.

There's no doubt that racism played a role, but a lot of the bitterness was more related to the fact that a huge influx of people, some of them very desperate, arrived and worked in the shrimping industry for low wages and in terrible conditions. This cut the rest of of the labor market off at the knees.

Suddenly a lot of people who had had the job for years, and had maybe been doing it for generations as a family trade, either lost their job or were unable to carry it out profitably.

the 'luxury' apt building I live in has lots of Ukrainians and Russians (amongst the tech, influencers and onlyfans merchants, the only stateside people that can seemingly afford this location)

the men have really harrowing stories of escaping their respective countries since they weren't allowed to leave, being draftable

and its all very current and ongoing

the 'luxury' apt building I live in has lots of Ukrainians and Russians… the men have really harrowing stories of escaping their respective countries since they weren't allowed to leave, being draftable

My next-door neighbor is one of them.

We were on nodding terms in the hallway for about six months after he moved in, then one day I saw him at the trash chute wearing a "Fuck Putin" shirt, and I asked him about it. He started to tell me his story, and then suddenly stopped, saying he didn't want to talk about it anymore.

Based on the start of the story, I can understand him not wanting to finish it.

Were they Russian or Ukrainian? My casual understanding is that the draft is much more significant in Ukraine, although it's hard to find details of it and the penalties for dodgers.

Russians could leave way easier than Ukrainians, though.

I can confirm friends coming in/out of Russia without much change. All IT workers are exempted from mobilization. People after 30 yo are safe from draft. Yonger are supposed to be draftable but I know someone who is 2x yo and went to visit Russia, fly in and out with no issues. The only difference is airplane tickets more expensive now.

Meanwhile men in Ukraine can be mobilized on the street and good luck leaving the country

As unfair as that is, Russians can still rely on basically volunteers who an average choose to be there, Ukrainians do not. I've heard many horror stories from there. About men who are basically hiding in cellars so that the recruteers won't pull them off the streets.

Fucked situation all around. I want to blame Russians as the only ones responsible for that, I guess. (As in they started this. Not saying Ukraine is crystal clear with many issues they have with the army, but still I can't blame them.)

I'm Pole, so it's more personal for me. Knowing if I was born a bit more to the East, I'd be awaiting my death (and in agony).

as a Russian, 100% Moscow started this, no need to pick words carefully. "Ukraine invited attack by doing something Russia didn't like" is ridiculous.

And as a Pole you of course know that Putin's "there are our people there we want to liberate" is the same logic Russia used to invade Poland before. Twice

sorry, I was unclear - I wanted to refer to the fact that Ukrainian army might be a little heavyhanded on things like draft - for understandable reasons - not to the war itself

that is only and purely on Russia and I cannot argue otherwise in good faith

Ukraine was invaded and is defending its sovereignty against a nuclear power.

Yes. But "harrowing stories" by escaping russians are by my estimation as a russian are 88% bullshit.

> All IT workers are exempted from mobilization.

This isn't entirely true. A friend of mine (who works in IT) got drafted. In 3 days he ended up getting a pregnancy certificate faked, so he and his girlfriend could get legally married quickly (for immigration options elsewhere) - and fled the country.

The draft is unequal, they are concerned about their IT worker shortage. The majority of drafting is happening in impoverished areas of the country, and ethnic minorities. Often people think they'll just be doing a driving job or something, and end up in combat. But nobody is truly safe. Your friend is taking a large gamble by visiting.

Don't conflate things.

mobilization is not the same as mandatory draft. draft it still applies to all including IT workers just like before the war. But you are "not home" to get the povestka you are fine. Also almost everyone seems to have some sort of exemption via employment or whatever. No one snatches people on the streets or when exiting the country like in Ukraine

I don't think I heard of anyone drafted to war but I know many russians knowingly went to war to make money on contract basis (which is also not the same as mandatory draft).

Now if mobilization happens they would be more aggressive but as I say IT workers are officially exempt from it.

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