Transition to ISO 20022 would be a positive improvement, but I don't think it will ever meet the required ROI threshold (globally) for that to happen.
Transition to ISO 20022 would be a positive improvement, but I don't think it will ever meet the required ROI threshold (globally) for that to happen.
Would be curious if anyone else has further insights.
And if you look at how "modern" ISO 8583 is evolving, almost all changes and extensions are already happening in TLV-like subfields (where a new field unexpectedly appearing doesn't make existing parsers explode spectacularly), and the top-level structure is essentially irrelevant.
Of course, it's a significant hurdle to newcomers to get familiar with that outer layer, but I don't get the sense that catering to these is a particular focus by either network. ISO 8583 is also a great moat (one of many in the industry, really) for existing processors, which have no buy-in to switch to a new standard and the networks need to at least somewhat keep happy.
Some of the implementations are reasonably close to contact EMV; others might as well be a completely different stack and technology.
Because no LLM will be able to replace you for quite a while.
It's the lingua franca of european banks and has been for some time. Back in 2018 when I built a piece of financial software I talked ISO 20022 with a swedish bank in Luxembourg.
On many other payment systems, yes, ISO20022 is or is becoming the lingua franca - e.g. FedWire is going to move next year.
https://usa.visa.com/content/dam/VCOM/global/ms/documents/ve...
https://usa.visa.com/content/dam/VCOM/regional/na/us/sites/d...
Mastercard uses data sucking nag screens, but I don't think you actually need to read the papers to get the point:
https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/payments-modern...
https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/report/iso-2002...
In 2018 SWIFT decided to migrate. Do you seriously believe that VISA and Mastercard did not notice this when it happened? Do you think they've been watching India adopt ISO 20022 for years and not acted upon it?
Edit: The reason adoption is fast when the devs finally can get to work is that it's XML, you get schema files and punch your programming button and generate a lot of the necessary code and then do the plumbing and call it a day.
They run their own networks and everybody that wants to connect to them has to speak their protocols (which are completely custom btw; it’s out of the question to just swap out one for the other!)
> get schema files and punch your programming button and generate a lot of the necessary code and then do the plumbing and call it a day
Absolutely not. Parsing ISO 8583 is maybe 5% of the complexity of card processing (and that’s being generous). Sorry, but you seem to have absolutely no understanding of an industry you are making confident statements about.
Sure, there's 3DS and blah blah blah, so what? 8583 is getting replaced and implementing 20022 is a breeze compared to 8583 for the specific reason I mentioned.
I'm sure that Visa and Mastercard are very aware of 20022, but being aware of it isn't the same as having a concrete plan to move - actually moving _everything_ would take a very long time, there are so many card issuers & acquirers out there with old systems plugged into Visa and Mastercard that would have to be replaced.
FYI I actually built a cloud based issuer processor connected to one of them within the last couple of years - that was 8583 and there was no option for it to be 20022. We would 100% have taken it if it were an option.
> you get schema files and punch your programming button and generate a lot of the necessary code and then do the plumbing and call it a day.
I think that's pretty naive in terms of what parts you have to do in order to process card payments. Okay, yes, parsing messages is easier, you still have to deal with HSMs and all the crypto stuff, PCI compliance, all the logic for the various message types, scheme compliance, then the long tail where reality diverges from the spec (basically acquirers will send you any old absolute nonsense and you'll have to somehow figure it out otherwise your customers' card payments get rejected).
Banks and payment card processing (which is what TFA is about) are basically two different worlds. One switching to a new data interchange format has essentially no consequences to the other.
While I could imagine Visa and Mastercard offering an ISO 20022 interface for new integrations, I’m willing to bet on the majority of volume staying on ISO 8583 for this decade and probably well into the next. They most certainly won’t force anyone to migrate either.
ISO 8583 is a massive liability, just an insane amount of technical debt and nasty workarounds that harms interoperability, i.e. profits. This is why both banks and the payment sector communicate so aggressively on this issue.
like https://jpos.org/
dear god will I never forget all of these terrible details