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Comment by pjmlp | Hacker News Reader

They are not alone, apparently Ford is closing down EV factories due to lack of sales.

Get the prices down, and people will buy EVs.

>Get the prices down, and people will buy EVs.

That sounds good and all, but how would you expect to get the prices down without loosing money and while still employing western workers at western standards of living? Prices don't come down magically just because you want them to.

EVs also have the range/public charging issue buyers are fleeing from, not just the price alone. Once you exhausted the market of buyers who can install chargers at home, the rest is impossible to cater to when public charging infrastructure is so shitty and expensive compared to those who have it at home or tanking at gas stations.

The government needs first to invest in cheap and plentiful public EV charging infrastructure if they wish to entice non-home-owners to switch from their ICEs. But when public chargers charge you through the nose for electricity (and loitering time!), they have shitty and buggy UX, or are broken half the time, why would you ever get an EV in favor of an ICE?

The consequence being, that whatever deadlines goverments set for full EV transition will be ignored, or dropped, when the large majority of population keeps driving ICE.

It is, because the deadline for the EV switch in the EU was arbitrarily set on idealist wishful thinking that sounded good on paper, and not on calculated pragmatism based on economic potential, working class purchasing power, local automotive industry capabilities, public EV infrastructure investment and development, potential world conflicts and economic/trade issues, etc.

It's easy for politicians to say "we want an amazing outcome in 15 years where everything is green" and for voters to agree with that, the issue comes when the rubber hits the road, especially as the politicians who made the original promise won't be in power anymore by then.

I would also wish to look like Chris Hemsworth from Thor in 5 years time, but when I actually look into my genetics, diet and exercise regimen, that aint gonna happe without some very radical and mostly uncomfortable life changes that deep down I know I won't be able to do. I'm not gonna suddenly wake up with the six pack while I keep my existing lifestyle. Similarly, the EU is not gonna wake up to an EV future in 10 years while doing everything like before.

EU politicians and EU voters wants idealist outcomes (cheap green energy, EVs everywhere, welfare state, affordable housing, good paying jobs with social benefits) without putting in the radical (and maybe even unrealistic) changes needed to achieve those goals: energy independence on the cheap, manufacturing independence, investing in research, innovation and start-ups, investing in defense independence, investing in public housing and infrastructure, etc

> how would you expect to get the prices down

Get rid off dealerships.

Tesla managed to do exactly that, why not Ford? They also started from nothing, built out a massive super charger network to support their cars, as a startup basically.

Which will hardly happen with the tariffs

So Chinese advantage with EVs + tariffs in USA and EU can cause that China will get stuck with massive overcapacity for BEV manufacturing and thus bankruptcies. I wonder if China little bit overplayed their hand in those massive exports.

> I wonder if China little bit overplayed their hand in those massive exports.

For each export there is an import. The EU elite might be the ones overplaying their hand thinking that their voters care if a car is german or chinese.

I want a BYD.

The voters care about if they can afford a car for their daily needs, they much care less about what powers them.

Chinese import of EU goods compared to exports to EU are pretty small. That's why you see Chinese targeting luxury products as an answer for BEV tariffs which is more for effect than effective.

Do you want a BYD because of supposed cheapness/high value for money, or does the car/brand offer something else you want that other brands do not offer?

I'm genuinely curious. I do think pricing being equal, people will probably still opt for more well known European/Japanese/Korean brands. It takes a generation or two for a new car brand to really penetrate a market, people are sometimes really really weird when it comes to their perception of and loyalty towards car brands.

It is the price point only. A little bit sticking it to the man maybe, too.

Also I believe there is no spyware in those cars, compared to fancy brands. But that might change on short notice.

Why would there be less spyware on the cheaper brands?

No internet? Many cars got their own cell phone connection nowadays.

China still has a humongous "market of last resort": the internal masses, which can be leveraged with public money (i.e. the state could pay poor people to buy cars). This can keep manufacturers alive until the trade war cools down.

That humungous internal market is also pretty poor to afford BEVs in a price tag which would have been sold in EU or USA, same like rest of the planet. Furthermore rest of the planet (expect few developed islands) have additional issues with non-existent infrastructure to support BEV.

>That humungous internal market is also pretty poor to afford BEVs in a price tag which would have been sold in EU or USA

The US consumer has on average more purchasing power than the EU consumer, but BEH prices are roughly the same on both sides.

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