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Comment by attendant3446 | Hacker News Reader

I have the opposite experience. Apple is incredibly difficult and expensive to repair. But I have been pleasantly surprised by the longevity and repairability of ThinkPads. I like those Apple M processors, but I know where I'm spending my money.

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Yes, MacBooks are generally more expensive to repair, but they also tend to not need repairs. It’s quite normal to hear from people who are using their 7+ year old MacBook without any issues and are still perfectly happy with it. I myself still use my 2018 MacBook Pro as my main device.

When considering longevity, I will agree that Thinkpads are probably the only device that can compete with MacBooks. But there are trade-offs.

MacBooks are going to be lighter, better battery life, and have better displays. Not to mention MacOS, which is my preferred OS.

Thinkpads usually have great Linux support and swappable hardware for those who like to tinker with their devices. They also tend to be more durable, but this adds more weight.

I still use a 2014 macbook air as my home server. It was my daily driver for 7 years. No complaints, still works perfectly. Haven't been careful with it either.

> MacBooks are going to be lighter

Not going let Macs have this one, my X1 carbon is considerably lighter than a MBA.

But generally agreeing. My last X1C lasted 8 years and still works perfectly, I just wanted an upgrade. My new one is even lighter than my old one. I opt for the FHD w/o touch screen and the second best processor to balance battery life and performance. Definitely not getting 18hrs battery life but 8-10 isn't something to laugh at.

I admit I was assuming they would be heavier, I didn't consider the X1 Carbon. When I think of Thinkpads I still picture the traditional IBM-style Thinkpad. A quick look at the specs shows the 14" X1 Carbon at 2.42lbs, 13" MacBook Air at 2.7 lbs, and a 14" Thinkpad E series at 3.17 lbs.

The 12-inch macbook was probably the best computer I've ever used in my life. I don't think anyone has come close to its weight. Apparently it weighs in at 2.03 pounds.

Sadly, I don't think we'll ever get a computer that good from apple (or anyone) again.

MacBooks are some of the heaviest laptps on the market.

The Air is the "light" one at 2.7 lbs 13" and 3.3 lbs for the 15"

For reference, there are several 13" laptops on the market that are around 2 - 2.5 lbs and 15"+ that are less than 3 lbs

Do any of those lighter laptops match the battery life and performance of the MacBook Air, while also being completely silent? I suppose I should have been more specific and stated I don't believe there are any laptops that can match the MacBook in all categories while being lighter.

>MacBooks are going to be lighter

That sounds like an Apple sound bite, and it is wrong, compared to pretty much any MacBook competitor out there...

I haven't gotten a new Thinkpad since the 25th anniversary one but that was the last I bought while using a few as daily drivers for a decade since 2008.

The ultimate issue was that the batteries degraded on them on incredibly fast. I don't know if that's been fixed, but the ease of replacing (at least one of) the batteries was more than canceled out by the short life compared to a Mac.

It's also hard to beat the global network of on-site warranty service. One colleague had their broken TP keyboard replaced over an hour right next to us and got a fresh battery replacement >2y in.

Another one managed to sort out their dead TP motherboard while remoting from a small town in SEA.

All covered under warranty, no questions asked.

Please mention the trackpad. Apple’s ones are hard to beat.

Indeed. However once you need the repair it's so daunting. Now factor in non-developed nations (prices are usually same or more there as well for both parts and service) and it's just insane. I had a 7-8 year old macbook air that I had bought for ~60K INR and I had to replace its SSD. Just because it was do be done for an Apple device even the outside repairperson charged ~16K (Apple "authorised" service centre quoted 28K + taxes with a straight face). That outside repair was way too costly in late 2022 for a 128GB SSD. Same goes for their other devices.

So what's to be done? Buy their insanely costly "limited" extended warranty for "2 more" years? And let's say we do that, then? I am sure there is an argument for that.

I am typing this from a M1 MacBook Pro and if it dies I am really not sure whether I will even be able to get it repaired without "feeling" fleeced, or might as well move back to the normal laptop + Linux world and know that a laptop repair will never be a "minor bankruptcy" event ;-)

No, "but Apple devices last long" doesn't cut it. So do non-Apple devices, yes they do. And if they need repair you don't at all fret w/ or w/o warranty.

I am not sure how many here on HN will be able to connect with this but that hanging Damocles' sword is not a nice thing to have around when you use a costly Apple device.

Making it easy and cheap/affordable for their devices to be repaired should not be an option left for OEMs.

Yes, modern macs are stupidly hard to repair. But I am never using any Lenovo product again since the whole rootkit incident.

How about Purism and System76?

So the choice is now mediocre and high quality?

Mediocre hardware and high-quality software or vice versa.

Agreed, hard to repair (which is a problem), but my experience is owning one for 8 years, and another for 4 years now (with hopes to keep it another 6), which never once needed a repair.

The only Mac hardware failure I’ve experienced in over 25 years of ownership (My first Mac was black and had a G3 in it and ran OS 8), I’ve experienced a grand total of one hardware failure, and that was 15+ years ago.

Oh you know what, I realized I wans't accurate. The 8-year MacBook I had _did_ have a failure at one point. They replaced the entire keyboard/trackpad for me for free when it did.

I agree on modern Mac's being difficult to repair. I also will say that back a decade or two ago, it was likely you'd need to repair your computer after four years. Now, a four year old Macbook Air still feels brand new to me.

I found the thinkpads were too easily warped.

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