Elon Musk's Conversations with Vladimir Putin | Hacker News Reader

Elon Musk's Conversations with Vladimir Putin

wsj.com

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Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason. [1]

To "adhere" means to support or be loyal to. In this context, it refers to someone aligning themselves with the enemies of the U.S., either by joining them or providing help and resources, such as intelligence, weapons, or logistical support.

[1] https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?edition=prelim&path=%2Fp...

Sounds like Trump would match this description too with his relationship with Putin, how he sent Covid machines to him instead of the American people, how he's promised to withdraw all support to Ukraine and cripple NATO.

Essentially he wants to give Putin everything he asks for.

He’s very protected because less than 2/3 of the Senate voted to convict his impeachable offenses. The reality of Presidential treason depends on his/her reputation among our betters in the Senate.

Hypothetically speaking, would supporting an entity that attacked an US Navy ship, directly resulting in death of US navy servicemen, constitute as such?

Treason requires allegiance to the United States. Seditious conspiracy is more often used. For example, Jan 6 revolutionaries might have denounced the United States thinking that it would get them off a treason charge, only to discover that denunciation is a conspiracy to commit sedition.

"...Following the Russian invasion of Ukraine, Musk floated a controversial proposal on Twitter in October 2022, arguing that Ukraine should permanently cede occupied territories (e.g. Crimea) to Russia, and that Ukraine should drop its bid to join NATO..." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Views_of_Elon_Musk

"Russia’s Putin praises Elon Musk as an ‘outstanding person’ and ‘talented businessman’" - https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/12/russias-vladimir-putin-prais...

But more importantly, Elon Musk ordered Starlink to be turned off during Ukraine offensive: https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/sep/07/elon-musk...

At least Peter Thiel smartened up...

"Billionaire FBI informant Peter Thiel dished about two Kremlin invites to private Putin meetings" - https://www.businessinsider.nl/billionaire-fbi-informant-pet...

Retracted in linked article.

That puts this story in a new light.

"In October 2023, Musk shared a meme to his millions of followers" that according to leaked documents obtained by a number of European media outlets "was put together by none other than the Social Design Agency" -- a Moscow-based group accused by the U.S. of orchestrating a "persistent foreign malign influence campaign" on behalf of the Kremlin.

https://futurism.com/the-byte/elon-musk-shared-putin-propaga...

I think the most obvious thing has been the volume of Russian propaganda bots that flooded Twitter since Elon acquired it.

We're talking about accounts posing as US citizens, for example, spreading disinformation.

It was like a backdoor was opened for this sort of thing to flow unchecked.

Musk financing the purchase of Twitter using Russian oligarchs is an even bigger proof.

Yeah, and Russia "mysteriously" getting more and more "illegal" StarLink terminals / access... Can't Musk cut off their service (since they're sanctioned and supposedly "illegally" using the service / equipment)?

> shared a meme

You can stop reading here

Why would you stop reading there? Because the content in question is an image with text instead of a video or a short article?

https://archive.is/CsaUx

Treason season started early.

Under US law, "treason" means either 1) trying to overthrow the government or 2) providing "aid and comfort" to enemies in war. The last time I checked, the US has not declared war with Russia.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason_laws_in_the_United_Sta...

I think the Logan act is probably more apt? It came up a year ago when this was originally reported https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-08-21/musk-told...

We're well on our way towards war, but also I did add the word early.

War or not, he is aiding and comforting hostile nations.

Allegedly.

Are you actually unaware he is getting contracts from DOD?

No one said anything about US law specifically (which wouldn't apply to Musk anyway in this regard), or any kind of law.

One can also read it as: "moral treason", betrayal, etc. Not for talking with the guy, per se. But at the moment, if anyone is talking with Putin, it should be for one purpose only: to end the war -- and with that explicit framework in mind. Not business as usual of any kind.

And we shouldn't be expected to believe that they talked about “space as well as current and future technologies" in any case.

On the contrary, in this very comment section posters have already called for Musk to be put on trial and possibly executed for treason. That doesn't sound very metaphorical...

I see one such comment, but either way: I meant of course "no one" not posting the type of comment you'd be likely to ignore anyway.

Musk is speaking to people who facilitated attacks on U.S. warships. He should not have a security clearance if this is true. If that means him giving up control at SpaceX, so be it.

There is a reason treason is both prominent is US law: it's in the constitution, and it is hard to convict because the definition is very narrow and requires specific evidence. The men at the center of our revolution were labelled traitors by the British.

Though Elon is the kind of overachiever to possibly surmount a high bar, FARA might be a better bet.

Has anyone litigated whether a war needs to be declared to be a war? Not treating war as a technicality is one reason judges exist.

It’s irrational to demand that. Treason can obviously preclude war. In practice, seditious conspiracy charges are far more common. There was a slave revolt in the 1800s after which charges of treason didn’t stick because resisting slavery is not war against the nation.

Many treason cases do not depend on Congress declaring war:

Slave rebellions

Puerto-Rican separatists

American citizens implicated in terrorism

The Congress has never even come close to declaring war in any of these circumstances.

Speed running being Henry Ford any %.

"Putin has no common topics to discuss with Scholz now — Kremlin"

https://tass.com/politics/1850993

That was the answer when the German chancellor was thinking about talking to Putin.

So it seems Musk has common topics to talk about with Putin.

Non-paywalled link

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/elon-musk-s-secret...

The correct title is Elon Musk's Secret Conversations With Vladimir Putin.

Omitting the word "Secret" makes it seem like the conversations were innocuous. Keep in mind that Musk has a security clearance that allows him access to certain classified information. If he is having secret conversations with Putin while possessing classified information that's a problem.

Looks like Putin, at 72, still enjoys working with high profile agents personally. What a dedication to the craft.

>At one point, Putin asked the billionaire to avoid activating his Starlink satellite internet service over Taiwan as a favor to Chinese leader Xi Jinping, said two people briefed on the request.

uh.

holy s--t!

What the actual F?

The word for this is treason. Arrest him, strip him of his assets, revoke his citizenship, and put him on trial with the death penalty on the table.

Would be the happiest day of my life.

Being allegedly asked a question is treason?

And watch the value of those assets the US gov currently prizes become little more than nothing.

We call this treason, ok sure. Cant say, I am confused by the word treason these days. You cannot deny the oligarchy thats present, When citizens united is being so aggressively embraced by the big corps, is that not treason?

Disclaimer: Compleete neutral. Only alliance is with a MOSFET

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