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Comment by rr808 | Hacker News Reader

Always when I read this I think they are comparing too very different societies where healthcare is just one factor. Americans are so much less healthy than Australians due to lack of exercise, poor diets, stress, no holidays, guns and crime. Its a miracle that if the US health is nearly as good as Australians it shows how great the US healthcare system really is.

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Part of the Australian national, state, and local health care system is policy to encourage healthy life styles and to discourage, limit, or ban food additives, tobacco, etc.

Back in the 1970s the AU Government was running campaigns such as Life. Be In It: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNjEge3Awl8 (many short segments airing with commercials on TV).

Planning requirements typically require open spaces, walking paths, sporting facilities, etc.

A "healthcare system" needs to be more than simply "immediate care for the injured, sick, and|or dying".

Unfortunately, obesity rates are rising worldwide, including in Australia.

> Ozempic has entered the chat.

This honestly feels like the kind of thing where 20 years from now we'll be more aware of the side effects and people will shake heads about how stupid "we" were today.

If this is going to be an exception, it'd be truly interesting.

There are already a bunch of studies showing that the ozempic causes massive muscle loss and lessens bone density. And before anyone remarks "just do resistance training", I doubt the people that take the easy solution will do it in conjunction.

Do they cause it in excess of normal weight loss in the same time period? I'm asking because regular weight loss that's quick will have both of these effects too.

> Do they cause it in excess of normal weight loss in the same time period?

I think you mean diet and exercise when you say 'normal'. Its not possible to have that much 'normal weight loss' in the 'same period'.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ozempic doesn't cause you to lose weight, instead it controls your appetite. It's not something like DNP, right?

'Normal weight loss' here refers to eating the same amount of calories without taking Ozempic. You should lose weight at the same speed as with Ozempic, because it's the calories that matter when it comes to fat loss.

Weight loss always comes with some muscle loss and bone density loss, because the structure now supports less weight than before, and our bodies dislike to maintain muscle apparatus beyond what is necessary.

Unless Ozempic causes significantly more muscle loss than other ways of losing weight, that news isn't really news.

Conversely, this is also why the strongest powerlifters are huge heavy guys. They aren't necessarily healthy. But they are strong.

Ozempic doesn't cause that, losing weight via diet does. Weight Watchers moms get the same thing.

The only people who don't are people who lose weight through resistance training. Which is a small minority - because we have a HUGE diet culture!

Its a transfer of wealth from the fast food conglomerates to Novo Nordisk. They won't take this lying down. Ozempic resistant foods are coming.

I cannot possibly even imagine how this could be the case, considering just how deadly and miserable obesity is. I don't see how we can hypothetically "solve" obesity and then go back to an obese population because the drug makes you nauseous or something. And that's not even considering the, what I can only assume to be, trillions of dollars of healthcare cost savings over time.

    > Part of the Australian national, state, and local health care system is policy to encourage healthy life styles and to discourage, limit, or ban food additives, tobacco, etc.

Except gambling?

There's a book or two in the backstory of why neither Dentistry nor Mental Health get the same inclusion in traditional health systems :(

Can you complete the assertion or cite what you were going to cite (if it was half done)?

It's complete as it stands.

see: https://theconversation.com/why-isnt-dental-included-in-medi...

, realise that mental health services also had poor inclusion at times and that "gambling" is being implied to fall under mental health services (and hence not addressed).

On a more serious note, gambling in Australia has some serious industry influence that's preventing it being properly addressed - see: (for example) Media Watch -s2024e31- Monday 2024-09-09 They're Addicted

I bet you it wouldnt make much of a difference.

>Its a miracle that if the US health is nearly as good as Australians it shows how great the US healthcare system really is.

Or its a ticking time bomb: 39.6% of Americans are Obese(BMI 30 or higher). Fast forward 15 years and this will probably collapse the country. It certainly will be the No 1 issue in the country bar none. Ozempic may actually give the country a chance of some sort of future.

> it shows how great the US healthcare system really is.

You think paying vastly more for much worse outcomes is a good thing??

Boy do I have a GREAT used car for you!

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