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Comment by ivraatiems | Hacker News Reader

A note for engineers looking for jobs, based on this and about a thousand similar posts: If you joined a "remote" company that went remote during the pandemic, no, you didn't.

Look for companies that went full-remote before 2020, or after ~2022. Otherwise, it can't be trusted.

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Companies that went full-remote around 2020-2021 are more likely to try to drag people back into the office, but I wouldn't suggest that you don't interview with those companies.

The best thing you can do is get to the finish line, get the offer sheet, and demand that your position as a full-time remote worker be written into your agreement with the company.

FWIW I know someone who did exactly this with a defense prime, and the crazy fella actually won the battle with HR when they tried to bring everyone back into the office.

Worst case scenario, they say "no," you decline the offer, and you've sent a clear message to management. It might feel like a few hours of wasted time, but we as industry practitioners have the power to make this a normal interaction between a prospective hire and a stubborn corporation.

This might work, but it also guarantees you will be first on the chopping block when layoffs come around. I have seen this happen first-hand multiple times: any employee with a special arrangement that doesn't meet what the executive team desires will be let go at the first chance, even if they are a huge asset to the company.

Not to say you shouldn't try that approach. Just that you'll have less job stability.

Agree 100%, even if you can manage an exception it does not look good to be the odd man out. It's easy to imagine people like this being the initial "easy choices" when layoff discussions happen. Not saying people should just roll over, but if you can manage an exception and see work from home as a requirement, I'd view that as your opportunity to maintain employment while looking for a company that takes remote work seriously

While layoffs can be pretty horrible, getting a severance package (or even just a "severance package" in the style of not being allowed back to work during the WARN Act period), can be a pretty good deal and/or vacation that you've needed.

Yup, and I think the only guarantee for a remote-first workplace is if the whole company ( or at least the whole engineering dept. ) is spread out enough that there is no possible plan for an in-office setup.

Seems like most these types are building niche products (e.g.: tailscale) and not just SaaS or CRUD-with-AI ?

Happened to me (anecdotal but...)

100% of people who told amazon "My contract says fully remote" did not win the argument. With at will employment, companies are free to change their agreement with you at any time and you're just as free to leave.

Most companies in the US are hiring workers at-will. There are no contracts and anyone can terminate employment for any reason. I don't think that would work in the United States for most non-contract roles. It might work for contractors and for people in Europe.

Look up "constructive dismissal". If WFH is in your contract and they try to pull this RTO nonsense, you can quit and it counts as a layoff -- they're on the hook for paying your severance.

I joined a company in late 2020 that had gone remote at the start of the pandemic, and this crossed my mind. The deciding factor for me? The founders had since moved to different locations across the US. That put their money where their mouth was more than anything.

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