Comment by minkles | Hacker News Reader

Comment by minkles | Hacker News Reader

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I'd like to chip in with another perspective here. I don't think we can. The reason people use terms like Rust activist is because some of the user community is quite frankly unhinged. On numerous occasions across various sites, a helpful Rust user will pop up with an out of context and unwanted discussion fork into rewriting everything in Rust or misapplying it to a problem which is unrelated. When reminded thanks but no thanks this is usually responded to with either "you're one of the ones that doesn't get it" or something much more vicious. I had one on here yesterday. I had on in person at work last week.

This is a real problem because any zealot of this level serves only to discredit the product by association.

I have no opinion on Rust other than I don't have the time to learn it at the moment and it doesn't look like it solves any problems in the domain of things I care about at the moment. I have no opinion past that. I am interested in technical discussion on it in case it overlaps a problem domain I am interested in, which is why I am on this thread :)

Some people are unhinged... it doesn't matter what's the topic. Look around the world, there is a lot of stuff you don't agree with probably.

Some people don't see the Cons, they don't want to see the Cons... be happy for them to be so enthusiastic about a topic they love and ignore the rest of what they say ;)

> The reason people use terms like Rust activist is because some of the user community is quite frankly unhinged.

Every community has them. Every single one. Find me a group of a super niche hobby, say 20 people in total. I can bet my neck I'll still find at least one of them in there who is a zealot. Not sure why people focus on the 0.01% of the Rust users who are fanatics. No they are not on important positions at all, they are some frustrated people who scream on Reddit and sometimes on HN, that's it.

> This is a real problem because any zealot of this level serves only to discredit the product by association.

No it does not. How did you even do this logical leap? Let me give you an example of what you did just say:

At some point somebody somewhere used their laptop to physically assault someone and caused them a head trauma. So surely, laptops are now discredited and you should never use one, correct?

Now replace "laptop" with literally anything else you have ever used.

> I am interested in technical discussion on it in case it overlaps a problem domain I am interested in, which is why I am on this thread :)

99.9% of the discussions where Rust is involved are technical. You should consider how you are picking your discussion threads if that percentage is much lower for you. I have not stumbled upon a Rust zealot on HN in at least 6 months. Last one I saw on Reddit was 3-4 months ago (though admittedly I gave up on Reddit's technical forums because they seem full of very emotional people).

> Every community has them. Every single one. Find me a group of a super niche hobby, say 20 people in total. I can bet my neck I'll still find at least one of them in there who is a zealot.

Out of all the tech communities I've observed or been a part of, I think Linux in general might be the worst for having zealots.

Even if that is factually correct -- a generous assumption but let's have it for a minute -- so what?

> Even if that is factually correct -- a generous assumption

I don't think it's a generous so much as reasonable assumption given the size and impact of the Linux project, and that there were much more anti-ms people in the late 90s and 2000s.

> so what?

I gave my perspective in a context where it seemed relevant. Why so adversarial?

My apologies if I came across adversarial. I just realized that I shortened "what's the relevance to the argument at hand?" to "so what?" as I was in a rush. Sorry again.

No worries, and thanks!

The relevance to the argument at hand, I think, I was just stating an anecdote to show a scale of sorts. I think talking about the level of zealotry is relevant and kind of interesting.

I don't disagree, it's an interesting topic to try and understand what makes people so radical and why are they so adamant in being such.

At the same time, it's very disheartening for me how so many people wouldn't use something just because there are zealots who can't shut up about it. :(

The problem with loud zealotry in a group is that anybody who brushes against it that might be interested sees the zealotry and realizes they'll have to associate with the zealots.

Do you really have to associate with the zealots though? I for one have been an Elixir and Rust advocate for a while but always made it 100% clear, in every discussion, that there are right tools for the job and that sometimes you just need to whip out a quick Python script and be done with the task at hand, for example.

This has mostly worked well for me, and paradoxically only HN is the place where even trying to defend Rust on its actual technical (as in: objective) merits still gets you labeled as a "Rust loonie" or "a zealot" or "Rust evangelist strike force". Even Reddit, that I view as an absolute cesspool, and had accounts banned for asking a question clearly adhering to the template given in the subreddit, has more nuanced discussions on Rust.

I find that quite fascinating, and even though my HN account is fairly non-recent, I still don't associate with the apparently very bone-headed people who jump like hit by a power line when Rust is mentioned.

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