You are probably sitting down for too long
bbc.com
bbc.com
> Since 2010, researchers have been keen to point out that sedentary behaviour is distinct from a lack of physical activity. You can get sufficient exercise per day, and still sit for too long.
They could have delved into this a little more! The link is to a 2021 review (not 2010). Did they somehow RCT people into exercise vs no-exercise groups, or is this observational? Is it really just that our "active" guidelines are too low (30 minutes a day) and sort of assume a baseline active job during the other hours? (E.g., maybe guidelines should call for 2-3 hours of activity a day, some of which can be covered by non-sedentary jobs.)
Anyway, just trying to figure out what to take away from this as an office worker who gets 1.5-2 hours of exercise a day.
And how would exercise compensate for sitting too much? That doesn’t make sense on the face of it. Exercise primarily builds strength and cardiovascular conditioning. It doesn’t (on the face of it) compensate for sitting at least eight hours a weekday if you’re an office worker[1] in addition to sedentary hobbies.
Again from my naive perspective: sitting shortens the hip flexor which in turn can lead to anterior pelvic tilt which in turn can compress the lower back/spine both while sitting and while walking around (active). That’s just one example of a biomechanical conditioning that doesn’t just get fixed by exercise, or at least not without directed exercise (try to notice sometime how many people have an S-arched back as opposed to a more neutral (slight sway) lower back).
[1] Shout out to managers who get the opportunity to “walk and talk”.
Regardless of everything I have read about sitting down being terrible for you, I just can't seem to get into a routine of standing up. Once I sit down for an engagement / lunch / etc., I just simply don't make it back up that day. I have become terribly lazy, I guess.
Life causes death. Choose your method.
I don't have one and don't use the one I have in the office, but still.
The hard truth is that we are made to move and to move on purpose but that’s not what the society wants us to do. Standing desks and all are just hacks, not the panacea.
This is at odds with the article, which states:
> Since 2010, researchers have been keen to point out that sedentary behaviour is distinct from a lack of physical activity. You can get sufficient exercise per day, and still sit for too long.
1. Sitting is the optimal position for getting work done like on a computer while almost not engaging any muscles beneath your shoulders (bad)
2. It tends to shorten the hip flexors which ultimately can affect your lower back
3. Any sedentary but still somewhat active position tends to be viewed as better, such as standing or squatting. There are tribes in Africa that are very sedentary but don’t sit on chairs—they squat instead
Source: Move Your DNA (book)
The problem for me is that, while I do have and use standing desks, I won’t use them for more than thirty minutes at a time. Often thirty minutes a day only (on a good day). So for me I just haven’t found a lot of good alternatives to either replace sitting or minimize it. I have seriously tried to stand on my knees at the office but eh it’s kind of painful and distracting and you get derisive attention.
EDIT: Oh shoot, I guess this proves that I don’t use it enough: I totally forgot that I also have a walking treadmill. Oh man it’s actually quite nice, and I am able to walk faster than I imagined while getting work done (there’s a limit to it mostly determined by resisting natural arm sway, you know while working on the computer). Yeah you can move while both programming and playing video games.
Okay I recently did some volunteer work where I had to stand on my feet and be ready. Nothing happened but I needed to be ready. Classic sedentary standing. But it was fun. A lot of fidgeting, some mild moving in place. While my co-workers complained about lower-back pain and fatigue I think I was mostly fine.
So last Friday I challenged myself to stand for the entire workday, or at least never sit down. And it was quite fine. I only got pretty distracted by the discomfort towards the last two hours. When I got home I was tired. But by the end of the day (after a longer work) I felt quite good.
Today I guess I stood at my desk for at least two hours and thirty minutes.
This might work out!
I mean, yeah, you maybe are exchanging cardiovascular issues for articulation issues. That’s something, I guess.
While I imagine you could adapt the same to a sitting posture, you're a lot less likely to be working against your whole body weight. This observation probably applies to (some of) those "standing desk" people, too.
The results have been almost instantaneous - back feels stronger, I'm not as stiff overall - general mobility and flexibility is better.
Took a week or so to get used to. Initially I wanted to get up and go find a couch a lot. Now I can sit for hours, but like you mentioned - with the small movements - it's never totally sedentary.
You wouldn't expect an hour of doing something else, however vigorous or dynamic, to really overcome the consequences of such a contrived routine.
If you want care about this stuff (it's fair not to; you'll still live as long as your peers if you don't), you do just need to figure out how to make frequent, non-repetitive movement part of your day.
Unless it turns out to be a constant focal point (such as on a book) after all, this is the same fallacy as the person I was responding to: sure, many unnatural things are bad for us because we are indeed not selected for ("made") to cope with it, but that's not the cause of why it's bad for us. At best, it can be a rule of thumb where no further information is available (like to answer "is this chemical only occurring on Ganymede edible?", you can use the rule to say "doubt it", but not to dismiss the idea of a study being useful by saying like the person above "who expects it to be healthy? It's such a bizarre thing to do")
(I'm American, and curious if British have similar/differing expressions.)
For "sit" we have a wide variety:
* plain "sit" - a variety of meanings, most intransitive. Notably means "relax" unlike the other forms. Note that it can be followed by a preposition with the same spelling as the particles below (e.g. "sit down the hall")
* "sit down" - physical movement, also used for meetings. When transitive, the DO always goes before the particle.
* "sit up" - physical movement (from "slouching" or "lying down"), always intransitive. A following "with" is sometimes analyzed as another particle but could just be a preposition.
* "sit in" - protest, temporarily attend. Always(?) intransitive (if followed by an object it is the object of preposition "in", not particle "in"); often followed by an "on", "for", or "with" prepositional phrase (though those are sometimes analyzed as additional particles instead)
* "sit off" - not putting full effort in sports. Always transitive, with the DO always after the particle. I'm not familiar with this personally.
* "sit out" - not participate. When transitive, the DO goes before the particle if short (by default, no more than determiner + object), but after if long. So, usually "sit the game out" with "sit out the whole game", but it is possible to stretch the definition of "short" slightly.
Plus some others that are sometimes analyzed as adverbial particles but can also be analyzed as normal adverbs or prepositions:
* "sit around"/"sit about" - idle. Usually intransitive, so can also be analyzed as a normal adverb, but can also be transitive (usually followed by "the house") which would make it a preposition ... Related, I utterly reject the abomination that analyzes words as prepositions when they don't have an object.
* "sit back" - relax or recline. Intransitive, so can also be analyzed as a normal adverb.
* "sit [idly] by" - refrain from intervening. Intransitive, so can also be analyzed as a normal adverb.
* "sit for" - babysit or model for. Transitive. I strongly dispute this analysis since the preposition interpretation provides all the meaning already ... especially given the similarity to "hold office for" which I haven't seen analyzed this way.
* "sit on" - delay, restrain, take no action. Transitive and the DO follows, so "on" can also be analyzed as a preposition.
* "sit over" - make room (intransitive), be left of and thus play cards after (transitive), burden (transitive)
* "sit under" - be right of and thus play cards before (transitive), learn from a religious teacher (transitive)
* "sit through" - remain through something unpleasant. Transitive and the DO follows, so maybe "through" is just a preposition.
* "sit with" - harmonize, reflect. Transitive and the DO follows, so maybe "with" is just a preposition
The real problem is that when you regularly put your body into any specific position for a long time, you really need to stretch the opposite position to make sure your muscles stay flexible instead of locking up.
I spend a lot of time sitting at work and home. So I make sure I always inverse the stiffing muscles by stretching the inverse position. Just stretching 5 min a day (and going for a 30+ minute walk) fixed the problems I previously had.