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Comment by nemo1618 | Hacker News Reader

I was very annoyed when Google recently announced they were deprecating Timeline for Web: https://support.google.com/maps/answer/14169818?visit_id=638...

They frame it positively, of course ("now your data lives on your device!") but AFAICT it's all downside. I can't browse my location history on a nice big screen, and (very annoyingly) the app does not let you view your aggregate history over the span of a month or year -- only a single day. Plus, if you lose your phone, you lose all that precious data, unless you configure the app to automatically sync your history to Google's cloud...wait what? Wasn't not doing that the whole point? Just baffling.

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Agree with you. I get the intention (a lot of people do find it troubling that all their location data is sent to Google, and appreciate this change), but I don't really care about that for my data, I just want to have everything available so I can analyze it!

Then grab it from your device and analyse it. Why should everyone suffer just because you want to be sloppy with your personal data.

I mean, the choice would be nice. Allow people to turn on online sync, keep the data offline, or disable the location recording altogether.

> grab it from your device and analyse it

By what means?

If I had to guess, I'd say they meant they'd prefer a solution where all the location data is stored exclusively on-device, with means to export it to another machine so you can analyze it. I understand the rationale.

Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait? You've unfortunately been doing it repeatedly. It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and taking the intended spirit of the site more to heart, we'd be grateful.

A couple of years ago they redesigned the mobile experience for timeline and since then it’s become so unresponsive it’s basically unusable.

I don't know why they needed to kill the web interface if they still let you 'backup' your location history to the cloud.

The timeline backup is encrypted clientside before upload.

Meaning no casual FBI or police warrant is gonna vacuum it up (at least not from Google, they’ll just go to the cell providers / towers instead as siblings have pointed out).

Obviously yes NSA and CIA and various other nation state attackers will just get it directly off your phone or evil maid you or surveil you in any number of other more traditional ways.

Someone mentioned geofence warrants, i.e. cops/feds asking "Hey Google, tell us which accounts had devices found in these time-space coordinates!", I guess they'd be asking mobile providers to do more logging as an alternative.

A Google account is probably more useful than a SIM card, which might be anonymous or have exchanged hands from the registered buyers, if you as a cop can ask Google to hand over the emails or IPs used by this account, you can find the person's identity and address (if using home IPs subpoena-able by asking the ISP).

I wonder if it's not just American police, imagine this question being asked by Russian FSB, or the "good guys" in the form of the Israeli authorities.

The cell providers actually do erase this data. I tried to subpoena it for a murder suspect to help show he wasn't at the scene, but he left it too late, and Verizon said that they delete their data after 5 years. I don't know the timescales of the other networks.

Not to say that the NSA don't have it all backed up -- I'm sure they do -- but for warrant (i.e. legal process purposes) it probably has a shorter timespan than the Timeline data stuck on Google's infra.

I’m immensely annoyed by it as well. I frequently used that feature to figure out useful, local information.

Consider for a moment that the FBI and CIA can access and search all of the location histories for everyone in one central location without a warrant.

Perhaps Google recognizes what an existential threat to a free society that is.

That is scary. However, being able to see my own data is more important to me in this case.

At least CIA can do this already via cell tower logs.

They can already do this via the cellular phone networks, which need your location to provide the service. Yes, they could discard that data once it was no longer needed, but that is subject to subpoena and preservation orders, so it's not that far to a location history DB anyways.

Mobile network location history is a lot more coarse than what Google can provide. Things like interference and reflections limit the precision most cellular networks can provide even when actively probing for a phone's location. With mmWave things are a lot more precise, but reflection can happen even in mmWave configurations.

I don't think Googs knows what free is. They have replaced that word with "ad supported". If TLAs want access to that data, they can just pay for it like everyone else. Gives a whole new meaning to "targeted" ads

I don't think this is true -- can you explain it? At least for those on US soil, since SCOTUS ruled on Carpenter v. United States, I believe you would need a warrant.

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