Chase will soon share their customers' credit card with digital wallet Paze | Hacker News Reader

Chase will soon share their customers' credit card with digital wallet Paze

chase.com

52 pointsguiambros28 comments

Paze is operated by a company called Early Warning Services, which is owned entirely by a collective of banks including Chase. They also run Zelle and a bunch of other infrastructure.

Calling it a startup is a bit misleading.

You're right, I wasn't aware Early Warning also owned Zelle (although not sure if it makes it better or worse). I checked Crunchbase [1] before posting, and it sounded like an independent startup, with <50 employees.

Whatever the case, as a Chase customer, it's upsetting that they're creating a digital wallet and loading my credit cards in a third party service without any consent nor easy way to opt-out. You need to message their customer service, and hope they are even aware of wth "Paze" is.

@Dang, I fixed the title to be more accurate; I think this was the reason for the flag. Original title was "Chase will soon share their customers' credit card information with startup Paze"

[1] https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/paze-848f

Everyone dogs on the EU but you know this would have to be opt-in there.

It’s by Early Warning Services, LLC (EWS) who makes Zelle too. Not a startup at this point

> EWS was founded in 1990 and is co-owned by seven of the largest banks in the United States, including Bank of America, Capital One, JPMorgan Chase, PNC Bank, Truist, U.S. Bank, and Wells Fargo.

They should change the name of EWS to something that consumers can grok, EWS sounds like it predicts severe weather, not makes apps that integrate with antiquated banking websites.

Early Warning Services already has your detailed bank history. This does have some benefits, like fraud prevention. Request a copy at https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information

15. Changes to this Privacy Notice

From time to time, we may update this Privacy Notice. You agree that we may notify you about material changes in the way we treat Personal Information by placing a notice on the Website. You should check the Website frequently for updates.

Ugh, It's apparent that this is owned by the banks as there is no way in hell they would just opt in credit cards and debit cards to some random startup. I just don't like this idea that they can just push your information without you being able to opt out easily. Should've been opt in rather than opt out any way.

Thanks for sharing. Looks like I'll be calling customer service in the morning. Wonder if they'll even know what Paze is.

> Chase will load your eligible Chase credit and debit cards to your Paze wallet on your behalf and then notify you when they are ready for use with participating online businesses. If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet.

Paze is not really a "startup": it's a product from the same company as Zelle. The company (Early Warning (earlywarning.com)) is "bank owned" and has been around for decades and is involved in fraud prevention for Chase (and others): Early Warning almost certainly already have much more than your credit card information.

https://simpleoptout.com/#Chase to start.

If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase 1 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet.

Once they automatically add you can opt out through Paze 2. The chase link had no Paze information. I tried sending a message through my logged in account. There is no easy opt out option or button. These automatic opt-in things are bs but you can always use cash and linked gift cards I guess.

1. https://www.chase.com/digital/customer-service

2.https://www.paze.com/faq

Message while logged in works. Got a reply.

Fun fact: the only credit cards in America that do not share credit card data with 3rd parties are:

1/ Apple Card 2/ Local Credit Union Cards

Apple doesn’t even have access to your transaction history as it is sired E2E encrypted in iCloud or on your local device. Goldman Sachs has access but they do not share it by the terms of their contract with Apple and privacy agreement.

Credit unions rely entirely on third parties for their infrastructure. FIS, Fiserv.

Doubt Goldman Sachs can’t see it either - would make dispute handling and fraud prevention near impossible.

I happen to know dispute handling was challenging for GS to implement for the Apple Cards.

Regardless of who handles the underlying payment rails (FIS, Fiserve, GS) it is the agreement that the payment processor has with the issuing bank that determines the ability to re-sell tx data to 3rd parties.

Apple and Credit Unions have specifically put in place guardrails to protect their customer’s data. All other CC issuers optimize for the extra revenue at the expense of their user’s privacy.

I'm beginning to think that paying by cash or having an anonymous digital payment method is critical. Also, how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash. I am seeing this even for government run services, hospitals, etc.

> how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash

Because the requirement to take cash is only for payment of debt. Debt means you've received something before paying for it, so all they have to do is not put you in that situation. For example: If they serve your food before you pay, then you are in debt, and you can pay that debt in cash regardless of their preferences. But if they withhold serving your food until you pay, then at no point are you in debt, and they can refuse to deal with you.

So, this seems like an alternative to things like Apple Pay and Google Wallet. What's the benefit of the banks? Bigger cut of the transaction fees somehow?

I must admit, I use Apple Pay whereever possible, I'll even temporarilly switch my browser to Safari if I see a merchant accepts Apple Pay, just because its so much easier than any other payment method.

I do it because Apple is one of the most opaque payment vendors. I don't want a direct relationship with so many companies having my payment information.

I still use cash. Its not hard or inconvenient.

Oh, I've been looking for awhile, but every one is out of stock of that new device that allows you to insert your cash bills into a website. Where did you find one that had it in stock?

Ya monthly bills are done online. But most of my day to day expenses, eating out, shopping is mostly cash. It helps there are multiple ATMs around I guess.

Took me several reads to realize Paze is a homophone for "pays". I guess all the good names are taken.

great, how do we opt out

https://www.chase.com/digital/digital-payments/paze

Contact Chase through the Secure Message Center or by calling 1-800-935-9935 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use.

If your eligible credit or debit cards are already in Paze, you can remove your eligible Chase credit and debit cards at Chase Online℠ or in the Chase Mobile® app. You can also opt out of Paze through mywallet.paze.com, Opens overlay.

Pay for stuff with cash.

I used to care about this. But I feel like at this point PI at least about US citizens has been stolen or sold so many times, so unless you made some serious changes, does it really matter at this point?

This seems like it would be square within CFPB complaint territory.

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