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Comment by globular-toast | Hacker News Reader

Why do kids need a phone at all? They especially shouldn't need it at school.

>> Guess the kids need a dumb phone. Nokia will rise again.

> Why do kids need a phone at all? They especially shouldn't need it at school.

Part of it is that almost all the infrastructure for "not having a cell phone" has disappeared. At every school I went to as a kid, there was a landline phone or two for kids to call their parents. There were payphones everywhere. I remember biking around as a kid, getting soaked in heavy rainstorms, then biking to whatever school was closest to call my parents to pick me up to take me the rest of the way. I think even the airport (traditionally the pay-phoniest places in the world) now only has one or two payphones left, if any. So a kid with no phone today is probably less able to contact their parents than in the pre-cell phone era.

So a kid needs a call phone of some kind in the modern world, but certainly not a fully-featured unlocked smartphone. I'm thinking ideally that would be a locked down phone that has no web access, no ability to install apps, and can only send and receive texts from numbers on a whitelist (though I actually think it might be fine for the phone make and receive voice calls from any number).

The embarrassing thing is that newer technology should make it easy and cheap to have free phones at schools.

> At every school I went to as a kid, there was a landline phone or two for kids to call their parents.

We didn't even have a dedicated phone for that, although I'm sure I could have used a phone if I had need to. I think I may have did once or twice. I'm sure that's still the case in all schools, especially if they start banning kids brining phones to school.

Lack of payphones is more of a problem, although I would imagine that especially for a child or teenager it wouldn't be too hard to use a phone from a stranger or business or even a random house. But not all personalities would be comfterable with that.

Schools still have phones, plus there’s cable/fiber connections. It’s not a big deal. Kids don’t need phones at school.I would not want to be the staff enforcing this during the first year though lol. It’s going to be a real shit show fighting all those addicted to their phones.

I think it's more an Americanism... I don't think parents elsewhere need to be so vigilant over their kids when they're at school... Of course, kids elsewhere are nowhere near the level of danger generated by a country that sells assault rifles like they're candy.

The total number of children killed by gun violence in school in 2024 is...

Zero.

This is from a source that has a very liberal definition of "school shooting":

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/interactive/school-...

Incorrect.

Update: 17-Year-Old Student Deceased After Shooting at Garfield High School - SPD Blotter, Thu, 06 Jun 2024 - https://spdblotter.seattle.gov/2024/06/06/detectives-are-inv...

I could see it in case of emergencies or unexpected surprises.

Maybe the parent texts "I won't be able to pick you up today because something came up, so take the bus home, and there should be leftovers for dinner in the fridge."

Or maybe the kid texts "There's been a fire at school today, and so they're sending us home early. Can you come pick me up? If not, let's talk over the phone over what to do."

There should be a school-provided phone parents can reach to contact their children and vice versa.

Problem solved without allowing every kid to have their own smartphone.

Well, I wasn't saying those would justify a smart phone, just a relatively dumb phone that can text and call. A school-provided phone could also work, like you said.

It's been a few years since my daughter was in school, but both of those scenarios were easily handled without needing my kid to have a phone at all.

If I needed to let my kid know something, I called the school office and told them. They gave the information to her.

If the school needed to let parents know something, they used an automated mass call/text system to notify us.

This is why parents call the school front office. Or the front office calls the parents. Both of these seem like a reach though.

Before school, kids walking to school? Or even bus riders: Bussing companies absolutely suck about keeping parents in the loop about incidents with the bus transportation. (I've been part of multiple incidents as both a K-12 child riding, AND as a parent)

After school events?

Kids with the autonomy + maturity to change + confirm plan changes after school with their parents or caregivers?

Kids with complicated home situations?

I 100% agree they are a distraction in the classroom and should not be allowed in them. But these laws and these rules should NOT grant the school administrators another black + white so called "zero tolerance" rule to lord over the kids and mindlessly enforce without compassionate understanding of the individual situation.

Was nice to not have to remember to bring a quarter or call my parents collect. "Would you like to accept a collect call from, It'smepickmeupatschool!!!?"

We used to pack quarters in our backpack to make a call at the local gas station on the way home if we had issues.

Now there are no pay phones whatsover. They used to be ubiquitous. Its cell phones.

Our school system has the parents and kids sign a cell phone policy. But the teachers in high school classes allow kids to use their cell phones too.

I’d say they might need one in Europe where they are allowed to walk home from school alone, in case something happens. But in the US where school buses take kids almost door to door,[1] there’s no clear need for phones.

Edit: [1] I am simplifying here and ignoring a lot of geographic variability.

you stow the phone away in a locker when you get to school, take it out when you leave

Lockers are not really secure in my experience w/ kids in high school

improve lockers or don't bring a phone you'd care to lose, not everything has to be perfect

Kids will lock their lockers if phones are being stolen.

It's not kids neglecting to lock their lockers, it's that if it becomes known that hundred to thousand dollar phones are in lockers, they will get opened and stolen.

I think setting clear policy with personal expectations of no phones out in classrooms, with personal repercussions of not following that policy is fine. No need to use bans to make schools any more prison like than they already are.

> I think setting clear policy with personal expectations of no phones out in classrooms, with personal repercussions of not following that policy is fine.

When's the last time you've been in a high school, it's like giving an addict a pile of cocaine and telling them to wait until after work to use it.

Most recently, I have been involved on the board of a high school PTA with constant volunteering for events over the time my own kids went. Before that i also did pta for elementary and middle school. For high school, two kids, four years apart so back to back over eight years - my youngest is just starting college; I feel i have a good amount of experience.

The current generation of kids are very cognizant of healthy phone discipline - moreso than many adults imho.

When you set policy, clear expectations and crisp repercussions treating the kids as equals, you get better results than treating kids like addicts with medical problems or subhumans for that matter. You very much receive the respect you put out; and bans are imho disrespectful of personal responsibility and autonomy.

Where we live (in Southern California), the school buses don't go door-to-door. My daughter's nearest stop is about 1 mile from our home. She could make that walk without a phone, but we appreciate knowing she can contact us if necessary.

FWIW the door-to-door schoolbus service is pretty rare and vastly over-represented in our media. Not trying to be argumentative, but I always think about how fun and convenient that would be when I see it in television or movies. It's mostly a relic of the past.

Emergencies like the too common school shooter situations? Or fire, flooding, or other disasters etc.

But a clear policy of no phones out in the classrooms, but carried on their person would be fine.

If they walk from school to home and decide to go to a friend's house instead of going home directly. That's my case for a dumb phone.

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