'The big problem is water': UK ebike owners plagued by failing motors
theguardian.com
theguardian.com
Your point is correct - some better gear would help.
not selling it full-fendered is just an insult to your customer.
YMMV
It's worth it to invest in good guards to keep the mud off your bike!
You still might need additional mudflaps on the front to keep the spray off the bottom bracket and rear for others rig is with you.
- a bent frame out of the box - a recall due to defective brakes - lights not secured properly - loose fender after less than 100km - a derailleur that refuses to allow use of all gears- no matter how adjusted it is unable to use either the lowest or highest
Apples and oranges. One doesn’t swap for the other. It’s not an industry conspiracy.
If Shimano/Sram cared about building top-shelf commuter drivetrains (Shimano has Alfine) they could easily purchase Gates or build a competing company.
But for some reason, every bike in a bike shop, including the most casual upright bike, has a finicky derailleur.
So instead we’re doomed to a life of misaligned derailleurs and bent derailleur hangers.
When it was working, it was a thing of beauty.
The only problem is, is that this kind of guard typically is quite susceptible to damage if the bike falls or when you hit something.
Otherwise it is in many ways superior to a belt. Belts are inherently inefficient compared to chains.
>The first thing to go on my bike is the deraileur though, they keep a year or so even if taken care of
>I do buy the cheapest ones I can find for around 10-15 euro
Single speed and 3s chains last 5000km easily while 12/13s won’t last much more than 1000km.
in some number of years, 3x parts will become less available and less common on cheap bikes.
We have lots of bikes and have gone through even more (bought & sold). The most reliable drivetrain on any of them just turned 20 (2004 model). It was the highest end Shimano XT-R at the time. It is easy to align, always stays in alignment, all in all takes very little attention and always shifts perfectly.
The bikes with cheaper drivetrains are a lot fuzzier and take more frequent attention and even when freshly aligned don't quite shift as nicely.
The absolute worst is the cheapest one (a department store bike my partner insisted on buying as an exercise bike). It simply can't be aligned well no matter how many hours spent. When I get it to a good-enough state, it's misaligned after a few weeks. The amount of time wasted on that thing would easily buy at least an Ultegra set to replace it.
A derailleur can cost $10, but it won’t be nearly as durable. Buying a high quality one is gonna cost in the same neighborhood as $100.
Where a geared bike with a derailleur will need you to put the bike in the smallest gear, and untangle the chain from the cassette. Replacing the wheel back in requires the chain to be properly laced around the cassette and can require dexterity.
Unfortunately derailleurs are necessary to ensure chain tension when the bicycle frame isn’t designed the allow for manual chain tensioning (vertical dropouts).
Also, run tubeless and flats will feel like a thing of the past.
The geyser of glue makes a hell of a mess too. I went back to inner tubes.
I guess it all depends on what you are used to do. I had soooo many flats last year when the spikes started eating through my one year old schwalbe wintertires. 220 spikes makes 220 holes. Had to give up on fixing the holes and change innertube until I could get new tires. Not schwalbe this time. Don't think tubeless would do any difference here though, see enough people get flats with those too and as someone else stated, the glue can get pretty messy.
Having a properly packed underseat bag is essential to any long ride.
Also I have never run tubeless at 25mm. Most folks I see running tubeless have 28mm at the smallest.
Switching is probably a bit of an unecessary faff. But if you want a drivetrain that can be ignored or neglected and never complain, an internal gear is really great.
For a commuter bike it also allows you to fully cover the chain and chainring if you want.
Looking at jensonusa, the cheapest rear derailleur is a Shimano Altus 7/8 speed for $22.
The set of my experience is { Shimano: [ $various_derailleurs, Nexus 3, Nexus 7, Alfine 11 ] , Rohloff: [14 speed], Other: [rear-hub e-bike] }
$various_derailleurs -- fussy to maintain, cheap to replace but costly over 10 years
Nexus 3 -- rubbish
Nexus 7 -- not bad for modest bicycling
Alfine 11 -- zero maintenance, excellent performance, cheaper over 10 years than $various_derailleurs
Rohloff -- low maintenance, expensive, built to last, and 14 speeds! But heavy and 10% efficiency loss.
e-bike -- reliable, fast and fun, but zero exercise and in the range of a Rohloff for cost
In short, I think an e-bike in 2024 is brilliant for single-mode commuting. The technology is reliable and performant... but heavy.
An Alfine 11 or Rohloff is bliss for multi-modal commuting (assuming 16" or 20" wheels).
The Nexus 7 proved reliable; the Alfine 11 a good value for durability and range of speeds; the Rohloff is brilliant but yes, those 14 speeds are expensive.
The choice depends on the rider's needs. I'd rather ride an IGH bicycle for the reliability and value over 10 years of riding. I'm not sure that an indifferent/infrequent bicycle user (the sort who lets things rust and never checks tire pressure) would care.
For the purpose of long commutes it's possible to buy an entire e-bike in 2024 for less than the price of a Rohloff hub alone.
The Alfine 11 and the Rohloff are brilliant. The Rohloff is a joy to use on all types of terrain. Instant shifts without fuss.
I disagree on the last point, I can turn the motor up or down, or all the way off, based on how much of a workout I want to get.
Also the only reason I'm willing to bike around my hilly city (Seattle) is because I have an ebike.
To put it another way, across 3 or 4 blocks I have around a 100 meter incline on the way to a park.
Can experienced bicyclists who are in good shape pull that off? With a kid on the back of their bike? Sure. But an ebike lets me turn turn the motor on for that part, and turn it off when I'm not doing something as difficult.
Also, for the low end the price is prohibitive: there is a firm (Priority) selling relatively cheap, casual belt driven bikes in NYC, which, I figure is quite flat, but the gear ratios on the cheap ones are not good enough for someplace hilly. And for the high end the weight is insane. One does not need to be a "weight weenie" to feel a ~2Kg hub spinning with the wheel.
The cost difference alone is extreme enough to explain why you don’t see internal gear hub bikes everywhere. Even if you did have them on the showroom floor, those casual bike riders wouldn’t be buying them much due to the price.
You’re also underestimating the reliability of a modern derailleur system. As long as you’re not buying the absolute cheapest, no-name system, they’re actually quite reliable. The technology has come a long way.
I consider 3 speeds to be the sweet spot for capturing the advantages of an IGH without an exponential increase in cost. In technical terms, a 3x only needs a single planetary unit, and shifting is simplistic.
But it's going to be a tough sell in the US. Derailleur systems have actually improved a lot since I've been riding bikes (50+ years). Indexed shifting really works. Even low-end Shimano systems last a long time with minimal maintenance. There are maybe a dozen bikes among my family members, and derailleur problems are quite rare.
When it comes to efficiency, internal gear hubs sadly aren't yet in the range of a rear derailleur.
https://fahrradzukunft.de/17/wirkungsgradmessungen-an-nabens...
A dirty rear derailleur of course also reduces the drive train's efficiency by a lot - which can be solved by cleaning the chain every other month.
When moving towards belt drives, you need a very stiff frame which can be opened/split in the back to fit the belt. These frames are more expensive to produce which will furthermore increase the overall bike's price.
Ideally, we all train our legs to be able to handle a single speed setup ;-)
SRAM has a famous video where they lay the bike sideways and jump on the derailleur while shifting, without it bending. Admittedly that model is out of price range for most riders.
Ideally you should give the chain a quick rinse and brush of to prevent grime from accumulating. Sure, the internal gears are a bit easier in that regard, because you don't need to get into the cassette. Otherwise from a reliability standpoint they should take equal beating. The cleaning frequency depends a lot on the oil you use also, wet lube will accumulate more grime than dry.
I presume you don’t mean the Bauke Mollema one?
Derailleur's just seem to be far cheaper, I suspect because most of their parts can be made from stamped steel, whereas most parts of an internal gearbox must be CNC machined and face hardened.
And by sheer coincidence, the popularity of bicycles and internal hubs coincides with having extremely flat terrain.
They also have the benefit they can change gear while stationary (very handy for traffic lights etc)
Historical (ie. 1960's) internal hubs only had 3 gears, so what you say might have led to market dominance.
Internal hubs work great, but have a bit more loss, tend to weigh more, and when they start going sideways tend to go really wrong. But for the commuter-y / daily use like what you mention they tend to last and be more weather resistant.
Because of all of this they haven't found a place in much hobby/fitness mountain or road biking, but are really great for less hilly utilitarian needs.
However, many suggest that because hub gears usually have an enclosed chain, whereas derailleurs rarely have an enclosed chain, that 2% is usually eclipsed by chain losses as the chain gets dirty/rusty/worn far faster on derailleurs.
It is dirty after rain, but they still just leave it at that.
decent bikes derailleur hangers.
they’re simple and they work reliably enough. why do we need something more complicated?
building a touring bike for remote areas? reliability wins, internal transmission and belt drive sounds smart.
otherwise, your money is better spent on nicer brakes, lighter weight wheels, nice hubs, etc.
https://theconversation.com/air-pollution-from-brake-dust-ma...
The biggest problem for tire companies is keeping the truth quiet about how we are on of the largest polluters.
Friends will sometimes give me crap for not riding in poor weather, but whether it's mountain bike, road, or gravel, riding in wet/muddy conditions just result in so much work.
The bike itself gets really dirty, it gets into EVERYTHING. Wear on brake pads and drivetrain are accelerated. Stuff doesn't work right. Post-ride it requires so much cleanup that it can take just as long as the ride did.
Sure, I'll get caught out sometimes, but I really don't like starting out in poor conditions because it's just so much work to get things back to right and can potentially cost quite a bit. I'll usually just skip riding these days.
Any city bike worth its salt will have a chain case and long inverted U-shaped fenders that will redirect dirty spray away from you.
You won’t get off completely clean but maybe 99% clean?
Maybe OP just has really cheap bikes.
If it's been wet enough for the surface to get soft and sloppy, once this flings up on a bike it dries hard. This material requires a solid soaking on the bike to get it to soften before it can be cleaned off, and it also is highly corrosive to metal due to the salt content. (Unless it's had time to soak in water runs off of it.) So it takes a fair bit of time and effort, and it's pretty much required that, you get it off of all metal parts including chain, cassette, rotors, bolts, etc. Depending on the ride I've also had to pull the fork because enough has flung up into the lower headset bearing that it'll be problematic if left alone.
By design it doesn't just rinse off, so time and a lot of water and a brush with soap (typically dish soap) and a rag is needed to get it clean and back to a sane state. And sometimes disassembly.
We have a lot of very sandy soil around here as well, so if it's really wet the dirt absolutely tears up brake pads.
(That's a worst case.)
A particularly pointed example is the Iceman Cometh Challenge bike race. It's 2-3 hours for most people, but after the bad-conditions years it was common for folks to be replacing brake pads, jockey wheels, and aluminum chainrings. Plus the added suspension seal wear because for most of the event the seals were working hard clearing gunk from the stanchions.
EDIT: Or Barry-Roubaix, a gravel race in Southwest Michigan (US) that's on similar roads. Typically a 2 hour race for the most popular distance, but on some of the wet years it absolutely trashed bikes due to all the abrasive muck being thrown around.
OTOH, Riese & Müller $15k USD e-bikes aren't IPX anything because the Bosch components aren't. If you get it wet, just kiss that money goodbye. Absolutely bonkers.
https://www.polycase.com/techtalk/waterproof-electronic-encl...
That said even ip66 is supposed to be resistant to 'jets' of water, like ~hose pressure.
Also, fwiw, I've never seen these used on prebuilt ebike components.
https://www.r-m.de/en-us/service/faq/
Yes. You can use the system in the rain without any concerns. It is protected against rain and splashes, but not against riding through rivers when the motor is submerged in water.
Equivalent of about IPX54. To me, this means it's not really waterproof (IPX?7) should it fall a puddle when it rains. Never spray it with a garden hose or pressure washer while washing. And, it's really a gamble to take it in the rain. Plus, like cell phones, they tend to lose IPX protection when repaired because of customary sloppy repair jobs that fail to restore gaskets.
One example among many:
The lighter and slower bit may sound glib, but it makes a huge difference to what it feels like to ride them and to have them ridden around you.
Exercise and silence.
Talked to another dealer who gave me the same story.
What's false about it? Pros tend to ride wheels with loud hubs. It's kind of a known thing.
One can fail to appreciate the additional breaking forces and shifts in balance a loaded trailer introduces to the bicycle.
Where the trailer attaches should be as close to the center of gravity of the bike & rider as possible so the trailer's resultant forces have the least leverage.
The trailer hitch should be rotationaly neutral which is a gentler way of saying if the trailer flips over it should not take the bike down with it.
If the trailer has its own breaks they should slightly and lightly lead the bikes rear break.
Being careful helps, I never wrecked, but do see how the addition of electrical assist does up the concern as it could result in more mass moving fast.
Bigger isn't always better.
Jesus I wouldn't park a $15k bike anywhere...
https://cyclingindustry.news/bicycle-theft-surpasses-2-milli...
Who even owns a 15k bike? 0.0001 % of the population?
When did bikes get that expensive? I bought a "brand name bike" just like 6 years ago for $900 and thought I was going way out of a normal budget.
At a quick glance for road bikes: * Canyon starts at $1899 * Specialized starts at $1200 * Trek starts at $999
If you want a more upright hybrid, they can be found at lower prices.
> I bought a "brand name bike" just like 6 years ago for $900 and thought I was going way out of a normal budget.
I'm curious what you got for $900. I doubt the current iteration of that $900 bike is now being sold for many thousands.
That means you should compare them to cars: I bought a cargo e-bike for just under $3k when I needed to take my son and all of his stuff to daycare near my office ~6 miles away. I certainly used to bike that distance before but the weather, workday timing, etc. meant I never did it more than 3 days a week before, but the speed & cargo capacity of the e-bike made it my preferred option every day.
The other people who didn’t live within walking distance all drove, so their trips took longer door to door (congestion around the school alone was 20 minutes) and my expensive e-bike was the equivalent of a couple months of what they spent on SUV payments, parking, gas, and insurance. Plus my son _loved_ going on the bike every day (it helped that we went by the train yard) while most of his classmates protested going in the car because they’re so isolated with nothing to see.
For mechanical bikes, they've always been (relatively) expensive. Here's one for $16k: https://www.cannondale.com/en-us/bikes/road/race/supersix-ev...
Just because you're doing less work, doesn't mean you're doing no work. An ebike can provide mobility for people who aren't in perfect shape. Ebikes can also allow you to use your bike for more errands, like getting groceries that people would otherwise not do on a regular bike.
It's a stupid amount of money for what it is.
KTM makes an 18 kW e-motorcycle for $12k USD.
https://www.ktm.com/en-us/models/e-ride/freeride/2023-ktm-fr...
I’m just checking their website. If you buy a “Culture Touring” e-bike from Riese & Müller you pay about €4K.
That is still a lot of money. But not nearly as much as $15K.
Also, it appears a subset of Americans have way, way too much money and are begging to be relieved of this burden.
mid-drives are great, the gear advantage rocks; the bosch units suck but unfortunately they had so much industry sway that a lot of ebike frames are coming out built around the unit -- which is absolutely unlike any other unit out there aside from vague similarities to the bafang units in the same range -- so it forces replacement with the same garbage, or a total re-engineer of the gear train; a big pain.
one thing to be said about the bosch unit : it looks sleek and it integrates well. This is likely a lot of the reason behind the mass adoption, aside from Bosch's presence itself.
The article says that you can’t get spares, any service requires sending to the factory for repair?
Still love the thing, though.
I'm not hot waxing it, though it's tempting, but I do wipe it down and apply T-9 much more regularly now. We'll see -- I'm 400 miles into the new chain and cassette...
Since then, I switched to hot waxing my chains and have now gone a year with the same chain reading as almost new. (Actually use 2 chains but both are barely worn)
There’s a great site called zero friction cycling that details all of this. The key that they opened my eyes to was looking at the total cost of riding including the cassette.
Also, most people online report over 2k miles on a cassette. Pittsburgh's hills and more force are apparently good for some extra wear.
(Also, a 250W motor is fairly small by e-bike standards. They generally start at 250 and go up from there; 750W is not uncommon.)
I'm going to be very annoyed if that turns out to not be the case....
If there’s a problem here I think it must be the frame design or the way they’re installed and not an across the board problem with Bosch components.
aren't they also directly behind the front wheel?
fenders, fenders, fenders.
something unsexy with a flap / mudguard.
As far as I can tell, the mid-drives became dominant just 'cause people wanted to have something the looked more "seamless".
I have rear drive ebike (Avanton Pace 300 v1) and I'm very happy with it (it was also cheap as a show room model). It's responsive and I can pedal up any hill to about a 25% grade. The controller is still mid-frame and the battery inset into the down tube. Thinking about it, my ideal ebike would be a heavy duty frame with all the components just bolting on (plus could use power tool batteries).
Now if that is worth the complexity/cost is a fair debate but there are mechanical advantages to mid-drive motors.
[1] https://forums.electricbikereview.com/threads/ebike-motor-po...
But the EU/UK 250 W cap is so low that it seems unlikely torque characteristics would enter the picture significantly unless you're going very slowly. I think most of the mainstream EU ebike motors are capped this way (vs designed to have a natural peak output of 250W).
Though perhaps you're saying these motors are so over-rated that even close to stall torque, their reduced power output is still 250W? That would be an efficiency loss but not a power loss since they're not allowed to deliver full power at higher speeds.
> Torque (at the wheel) does matter as well as power.
If you are getting 250 W of power at the wheel (in other units, 250 Joules per second, or 250 Newton-meters), that's what you are getting, no torque about it.
>> the EU/UK 250 W cap is so low that it seems unlikely torque characteristics would enter the picture significantly unless you're going very slowly
> Though perhaps you're saying these motors are so over-rated that even close to stall torque, their reduced power output is still 250W?
Yes, I was saying something close to that ("very slowly").
IOW the overprovisioning of the motor combined with the power cap makes the motor work much more like a "always 250 W" power source than a "250 W peak output modified by torque" power source.
My bafang motor has seen a lot of issues in the ~1.5 years I had it. The bike shop (also) claimed rain and mud where a problem and they considered the ~1000 km per month I rode it 'misuse'.
I had a good run with electric bikes up until that time (~10 years with a front-hub motor and after that the Bafang) but to be honest I'm kinda glad it died because I've been riding a decent non-electric bike ever since and monthly visits to the bike shop became yearly visits instead.
* In fairness, Kaabo e-scooters aren't designed, they're thrown together and spaghetti wire is rammed in every crevice without a sensible circuit or terminal diagram.
For two of the years she hauled him to school everyday, in all weather, and did all of her shopping and errands with the bike. About 100km every weekday. I'll have to look at the odometer sometime and see what it's at.
I believe it has a Bafang motor and I think we paid about C$2200 as it was in clearance.
Average 35+kph and they are under 3h per day. It doesn’t seem that unlikely especially if it’s more like 90km than 100.
And multiple batteries per day.
I suppose it’s possible if someone’s entire day revolved around e-biking everywhere most of the day and they live in an area that’s relatively flat and there’s not a lot of stop and go and the trips fit into the charge of a single battery and so on.
I like biking a lot, but spending hours and hours on an ebike doing errands every day and hoping nothing breaks when you’re far from home is not my idea of a good time.
That's not necessarily true. My battery is rated for 45 miles, and I get every bit of it. I typically only do about 15-20 miles daily, but I have a weekly ride that is a little over 30 miles which after that the battery still shows 2 of 5 bars remaining. It all depends on how much output you're getting from your meat motor.
So far I've done 40 miles in a day several times simply commuting and running errands, and it goes fairly quick with a top speed of ~25mph if I'm in a rush. Point being, people shouldn't be so quick to make assumptions about other people's use cases. I used to commute 30 miles per day to work on a touring bike, plus extra for errands and activities. Yes, it is a lot of time riding, but often it felt like recreation especially since much of my commute was scenic on a dedicated bike trail through natural areas.
We had just moved to Canada from a country without a reciprocal drivers license exchange - no matter as she never had one. Where we had moved from, drivers licenses are largely considered optional and although I taught her to drive and she had been riding motorcycles since age 12 or so, driving in North America is way different. We moved just before covid hit. Driving lessons and license testing were difficult / near impossible to get - and with very long wait times. So it was her only form of transportation for quite a long time.
She was doing cleaning at various businesses around the area as well, so again she would take the bike to those locations every day with her little cargo trailer and cleaning supplies. She'd come home after dropping our son off at school, charge the bike, eat a snack, change trailers and head back out, then repeat when it was time to pick him up.
She quite easily spent 3-4 hours on the bike everyday. Just getting to school and back for our son was about 45 minutes one way. He wasn't in the closest school because of things the further school offered (nature school), another 30 minutes each way to the local shopping centre, and then wherever she needed to go for work.
We went through a lot of tires and brake pads, but other than general maintenance the bike held up great and is still going strong.
She has a good job and nice little car now, so the bike is seeing a lot less use this year.
She is as tough as nails. :)
LandCruiser 'Mudcrab' driven 7km under water across Darwin Harbour
A rag-tag team of engineers, commercial divers and rev-heads have successfully driven a waterproof electric vehicle 7 kilometres under water across Darwin Harbour, in a stunt they claim has broken two world records.
Further to that, it generally feels as though the UK is a country massively in decline and this transcends down to the quality of goods which we pass as acceptable.
The bar of quality seems to have exponentially lowered over the past decade and the effects of such are now rearing their head in our day to day life.
It feels that people in UK have been ground down to a point of ‘ah well, it’s all f*cked and always will be now’ and, as such, people accept things like a £5k bicycle failing multiple times within 2 years.
It’s the same for train travel. It is an honor system because there is no way to check if that really was your exit or not.
But the Netherlands has a country-wide system (unlike Britain) so it has this compromise of tapping out.
To a large extent it is a self-fulfilling prophecy. People expect decline so it happens. It has been happening for a long time - back to the 1960s or so when the UK became the only only country ever (still true) to have a space launch capability and lose it.
That said, IMO the causes of this are widespread across the west. It is evident in the US, and the drift away from competitive free markets, the rise of culture war politics, short termism is business and politics, naivety about the rest of the world (disastrously reflected in foreign policy - Russia being the obvious example) and so on seem to be spreading.
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here. Especially the naivety about the rest of the world. As someone whom travels to India regularly (my family are there) I have to say, people have no clue about the rate of change happening over there.
In an extremely short space of time (I want to say at most a couple years) I’ve seen what used to be an all day journey from Delhi to Meerut be cut down to a couple hour bus trip through the building of the Delhi - Meerut expressway.
I’ve seen the Delhi metro continue to expand its reach and new expressways begging building (in our home city of Batala a new motorway was recently started to take us to Delhi directly)
Meanwhile the M25 continues to be a massive pothole with indefinite road works that never seem to complete
The west (admittedly this not only a flaw of the west) tends to think its cultural norms, identities and values are human universals.
There is also a tendency to think that the golden age of peace and prosperity the west enjoyed after the end of the cold war is the rather than the exception - it even lead to silly ideas like "the end of history".
And yes overall everything in the NL seems better quality
Bosch is also widely used in the Netherlands.
And, for example, the Cube bicycle as depicted in the article, is clearly not designed to be used in rainy weather. Who knows what else shortcuts they took?
That is not true.
It is about class of bikes, not brands. Sure there are brands such as Gazelle who focus pretty much on those characteristics only but there are other brands doing the same all over the world alongside more racy models.
> And, for example, the Cube bicycle as depicted in the article, is clearly not designed to be used in rainy weather
The bike depicted is a mountain bike, so no it hasn't be designed with fender in mind but that doesn't mean Cube or any other non-dutch brand doesn't produce city/trekking/touring bikes.
Having said that, I would expect a mountain bike to be built to survive wet and muddy conditions.
One factor may be that in most of the UK biking is done on the road mixed with cars which may have more oil, sooth or other things in the water that gets on the bike, compared to dedicated bike lanes in the Netherlands. A lot of those lanes here aren't just a part of the same road, they're a few meters away from the road.
Another factor may be that there is more of a longer term bike culture, so more people know about simple bike maintenance (spray the chain etc) or have a bike shop around the corner.
I've had pretty much my entire electric drive system replaced under warranty with my first electric bike (admittedly I rode a _lot_ of km with that one.) Then on the second it's been in the shop at least once a month for ~1.5 years. Sure it was all covered by warranty but the amount of hassle did make me reconsider and go back to a regular bike.
This apparently affects Bosch motors. Bosch is a reputable company. Maybe they screwed up on these motors but I don't see how bikes used in the Netherlands, if they're using the same Bosch motors, wouldn't be affected. Especially seen the shitty all year weather we're all "enjoying" in our countries (UK / .nl / .be / .lu etc.). It's been, what, 8 months of rain nearly every day now?
> Comparison:
> United Kingdom: Average wind speeds range from 13 to 19 km/h (8 to 12 mph). > Netherlands: Average wind speeds range from 15 to 20 km/h (9 to 12 mph).
Searching "Europe wins speed map" suggests it's close, with the UK slightly higher.
The speed in a typical city might be higher in the Netherlands, as large cities in Britain have a more varied setting. I don't know.
From the article.
> The problem appears to mainly affect those riding mountain bikes in all weathers, particularly in Wales and the UK’s other wettest areas, because they are not sealed properly against water ingress.
This used of "latest" implies Bosch's engineers initially assumed dust and splash water aren't a thing, so by the sound of it they design indoor bike motors for people who hoover very regularly.
It's the second part that worries me more, though: "most" (= not all) error codes disappear on research, i.e. you have to regularly reboot your e-bike, like a 1998 Windows PC? Sorry, I never want to reboot an appliance, because real bikes never required that in the past, so it has been shown it is possible.
I never want an e-bike, and I don't like throwing away engines because of the environmental damage. Don't people bike because they want to get fit? If not, get a proper motorbike.
People bike because they want to get around. Also, a bicycle is a lot less bulky and more quiet than a motorbike and it doesn't require a license.
In my city people bike because they want to get from A to B.
E-bikes are great for that! They enable reasonable fast biking without breaking into sweat (good for commuting) and in hilly areas.
First they enabled senior citizens to bike fast and longer. Then came the mountain e-bikes and made it cool. Than the city hipsters. Then family mum and dad zipping their children around:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQhzEnWCgHA&t=168s
> If not, get a proper motorbike.
Motorbikes are loud and heavy and more expensive. You need a helmet and have to use the road instead of bike lanes. You need a driving license.
A [mountain] bike motor doesn't just need to resist ingress, it needs to do so after hundreds of hours of violent shaking while its external bearings are under heavy load. It should also tolerate a certain amount of direct impact.
I can certainly imagine this being tricky to achieve for a few hundred $!
> Don't people bike because they want to get fit?
No. I personally ride a _non-motorized_ bike for the health benefits, but I ride a _bike_ as a means of transport. I want as many people as possible to do this, it's better for everyone if people cycle. E-bikes are a fantastic way to expand the pool of potential cyclists.
"Bikes are for sporty people" is a symptom of a car-centric environment. In a healthy city, bikes are an option for everyone who has full mobility.
Speaking of things which are (evidently) "tricky to achieve"...
Biking is just as diverse.
Riding an ebike is still a moderate workout especially if you are putting on the miles, hauling stuff, have hills, etc. And on most bikes you can set your engine assist in real time, so it's easy to adjust to the level of workout you are in the mood for. Which is a massive game changer for me as someone with health problems including fatigue and leg pain that doesn't own a vehicle.
I like the freedom of the ebike vs a motorcycle for city commuting, it's much quieter, I can ride on greenways and bike trails away from traffic fumes and the majority of impatient/distracted drivers. It is far lighter than a motorbike and I already have the tools and skills for basic maintenance. It is cheaper to maintain and operate. But more than anything else I have an ethical problem with the combustion engine. I drew a line in the sand long ago that I will never own nor make regular use of a gas-powered vehicle and in 20 years I still haven't crossed it.
Shame about the company but a former mechanic from the London shop has started his own repair business so hopefully I'll be riding mine for a few more years to come.
There are labs that test equipment and verify the claimed ratings. It should be simple for the bike or motor manufacturers to upgrade their seals by one IP step. Most suppliers provide a significant range of IP coverage in their catalogs. The price difference is probably small.
The only issue is that any maintenance on the motors has to respect the seals - understand how to disassemble and reassemble without compromising the join.
Such a design is fundamentally incompatible with being fully water sealed.
BLDC motor design also has a conundrum - most of the heat is made in the motor coils, and they can be designed to get up to about 250C, which makes them easy to cool.
However, they are wrapped round thermally conductive steel touching thermally sensitive neodymium magnets which have to stay below ~60C for full performance.
So it isn't simply a matter of getting rid of heat - it's a game of preventing heat transfer.
The engineering challenges make sense. Hopefully it is something that is being actively R&D'd.
A kettle sits on top of a flame... which is combustion.
Axles should not be getting hot. You want to get your car checked.
Brakes are intentionally designed to cause as much friction as possible, the opposite of an electric rotor.
could be luck of courser
Meanwhile my 20 year old koga miyata bike (which I also used for 10 years for my commute in all kinds of weather) has no sign of rust anywhere.
The guy that sometimes services my BMW goes on frequent unprompted rants about how the modern bikes corrode so much more easily, etc etc etc. Not once has he looked into why.
At the time, the perception was that mountain bikes were just more rugged and comfortable to ride. There was a not inconsequential amount of marketing hype about the condition of roads, and the roads in some areas were in fact pretty crappy. Just due to market timing, MTB's were also where most people first experienced indexed shifting, which did improve the ease of riding a bike.
In the case of e-bikes, there's a tendency to get "more bike than you really need" because the marginal cost is acceptable and the motor takes care of the added weight. And from a pragmatic standpoint, the difference may also be mostly aesthetic.
Ebikes are a bit ahead of EVs in certain aspects. They had a quick boom, a lot of new brands came up with different models and designs but now most of them are going bankrupt because the sales are slowing down. The main reason is not people don't buy ebikes anymore, but they already bought one! What I find stupid is there are only 3-4 companies producing motors or electronics for ebikes. These parts, as the article points out, are not sourced to customers for repairs. This has to change for more sustainability.
It's true about parts, I'd hope that, given how simple ebikes are, there would be a tendency to use easily-replaceable, off-the-shelf components, but I guess companies do want to design custom parts, as that's where they provide value.
I started with a $900 Segway Ninebot MAX G2 (1×1000W) a couple weeks ago, but it didn't have enough power for my needs. Even in sport mode, it would stall on some pretty slight inclines. So I picked up an $1800 Maxfun 10 PRO (2×1500W), just a couple days ago, actually.
I do like the added speed and hill climbing ability, but the compromise in features and build quality is astonishing. The Ninebot is so, so much better. If only the motor were three or four times more powerful...
As for it getting stolen, with a scooter (as opposed to a bike or motorcycle) I've so far had a 100% success rate just bringing it with me through the door. Serious. Nobody bats an eye at me bringing my scooter into the pharmacy, any number of fast food places, grocery stores, etc. Not super easy or likely for someone to steal the scooter from right next to me.
YMMV with that, depending on how friendly your area is to PEVs, but everyone here seems cool with it. It's honestly great. Not only that, but I can store it inside my house when it's not being used, to charge it, work on it, and protect it from the weather.
The Ninebot can only be locked with an app over Bluetooth, while the Maxfun can be locked with an NFC key (I far prefer this). But you can also of course use a normal bike lock as well if you ever have to let it out of your sight.
Anyway, I love the scooter. It's had some issues but it mostly came down to me popping the tire on the first day by making it eat a curb (oops). Somehow, the scooter managed not to care whatsoever. No trip, no fall, no damage to the frame or suspension, only the inner tube which was easy to replace once I got back home. Good as new now.
If you do ever get an electric scooter, it will probably take an hour or two to learn proper weight transfer, but it's extremely easy.
Note: if you get an electric scooter, it's extremely important to check your local laws first. Electric bikes usually have laws that are fairly self-consistent and useful, because they are essentially the poster child for PEVs. Electric scooters, however, often have laws that are unnecessarily restricting or even entirely contradictory, because all of the work that has been put into electric bike laws has entirely overlooked the existence of electric scooters, leaving them in often very precarious positions. Any laws that have exceptions for electric bikes will most likely not have any exception for electric scooters. For example, in my local area electric bikes are allowed on sidewalks in parks and electric scooters are not, despite the scooter being far smaller and less obnoxious than any bike.
I'm glad to see that e-bikes have become so good, though. My use case is very niche, because I live right at one end of a bike lane that spans the entire city, so going to any of the busy areas is just biking next to the sea, on a level road, for max half an hour, which isn't really hard enough to warrant an e-bike...
Our use cases are definitely different. If you want a replacement for the motorcycle to carry another passenger, you probably won't be able to use a scooter. You could grab something like the XPedition Cargo eBike which can carry a passenger. It's got a 750W motor and weighs only about 70lbs when unloaded. It's only $1400 and there is a one-year warranty on the motor. However, they do not sell replacement motors even if you have money, so expect the bike to last only the one year. (In my experience, regardless of industry, the length of the warranty is usually a relatively accurate indicator of how long the product actually lasts in practice.)
Another proof that conspiracy theories aren't exclusive to the right, try some of Occam's razor.
There’s really a lot to criticize about the current state of electric. Flimsy range numbers, build quality from most manufacturers, reliability issues, charging time, hidden costs around outfitting your house, no real solution to the drivetrain having a severely limited shelf life.
I definitely think electric is the future, and I’m glad for it, but they are _not there_ from a “replace ICE wholesale” standpoint. They need more of their kinks worked out. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t continue to work on them or adopt them for their limited efficacy. Most people don’t need all of the benefits ICE cars offer and for them, electric right now is ideal.
> Damp problems affect around six per cent of homes in London with serious condensation being the most common form.
> Damp and mould were responsible for almost a third (28 per cent) of category one hazards in London councils, more than twice the proportion seen across England as a whole.
More: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/damp-and-mould-un...
Downvoters, feel free to explain your position. Being in a place where the air is constantly ~100% water is a con for human health - sorry.
London will barely momentarily touch below 50% humidity in the next 10 days.