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Comment by austinkhale | Hacker News Reader

Feels like this is going to become one of those things we look back on in retrospect and regret. We should be full steam ahead on identifying what effects microplastics & phthalates more broadly are having on our health & adjust accordingly. Early indications seem... not great.

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Which indications are those? Honest question. I don't know much about this. Since plastic is one of the most biologically neutral/non-interacting materials I've never been too concerned, though I suppose in certain forms and over certain amounts it could be harmful?

Phthalates are estrogen mimics.

Well, they figured as such about bpa and here we are. They figured as such for a lot of things in the past that turned out to be not what they seemed after sufficient data were collected.

phthalates, like flax seeds and soybeans, are probably endocrine disruptors in humans. they're oils, not solid plastics; you add them to pvc to transform it from a rigid, brittle substance like those white sewer pipes into a flexible, resilient substance like shower curtains, fake leather upholstery from the 01970s, or nasogastric tubes. they evaporate from the plastic over time, so you inhale them and the plastic gets brittle. they also diffuse out of the plastic into whatever it's in contact with, especially oily things

in general any statement that refers to 'plastic' as a single material is wrong. the only thing the diverse materials called 'plastic' have in common is that you can mold them and that at least one of their major ingredients is a synthetic organic material, not even necessarily the majority

i think probably the concern over harm from human phthalate exposure will turn out to be baseless, but it's not implausible

Source on flax seeds and soybeans being endocrine disruptors?

check the sources cited in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytoestrogen#Food_sources

That article also contains the phrase

> As of 2020, there is insufficient clinical evidence to determine that phytoestrogens have effects in humans.

yes, and that's also true of phthalates at normal exposure levels, which is why hospitals still use vinyl tubing; see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrine_disruptor#Phthalates for more detail

also, though i didn't realize this, natural sources of phthalates include coconuts, poppy seeds, grapes, and kidney beans. see https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8310026/ and https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Phthalic-acid#sect...

Humans have been consuming flax and soy-based products for thousands of years.

At this point, the burden of proof is on those claiming that they have hidden harmful effects that have someone escaped thousands of years of human consumption.

yes, although that burden of proof may indeed eventually be met for either phthalates in general or some specific phthalate; as with soybeans, there's strongly suggestive evidence that doesn't yet rise to the level of proof

Someone already commented about pthalates themselves but I'd also like to point out that a big problem with microplastics isn't the microplastics themselves but the fact that they absorb other chemicals which can then be released/absorbed when they get inside your body or even just on your skin:

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/toxic-microplastic...

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2022/02/220216112233.h...

Microplastics are like little buckets for all sorts of toxic compounds and pharmaceuticals (that you probably don't have a prescription for like cancer treatment drugs).

> Feels like this is going to become one of those things we look back on in retrospect and regret.

The entire world would be paralyzed with fear if it were afraid to do anything that it might regret in the future.

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