What Guide Books Tell Foreign Visitors to the U.S. | Hacker News Reader

What Guide Books Tell Foreign Visitors to the U.S.

theatlantic.com

168 pointssynacksynack155 comments

I don't mean to generalize, but this is my own experience.

Sincerely, I don't know how the US manages to be the second most touristic country in the world. Travelling to the US can be a nightmare - customs, TSA, metal detectors, body scanners, etc. As a tourist, I've never felt as unwelcomed as when travelling there.

Maybe it's just a cultural thing, but I seriously got the feeling that people who work at airports, subway, or any other place that is by definition essential to tourists are unable to communicate without shouting. The fact that in spite of working at such a place most of them don't even speak a second language may contribute to that - it's like people will understand better what you say if you just say it louder. Not to mention that you are expected to know exactly how everything works, from the local language (which sometimes becomes Spanish) to how much you have to tip, otherwise people will look at you with that "oh, you must be new here" look.

Strangely enough, the common american that you find in the street tends to be relaxed, friendly and always willing to help. People will sometimes start talking to you in a pretty natural and informal way (this wouldn't happen in Europe).

So, tl;dr: services suck but once you are through the trial of idiocy that is getting into the country, you'll most likely have a good time.

This echoes my own experience too, down to the letter. Screw air travel in the US, but people are very friendly, at least in cities I've been.

Hell, the TSA even gave me a free massage!

I moved to eastern Europe for a while and was struck by how cold and aloof people were to each other in day to day life. It took me some time to adjust; I had to tone down how I spoke with people I didn't know. No compliments or talking about the weather or coming weekend. This was easier as I started learning the language as I was naturally more self-conscious and reserved. Paradoxically (or not?) I started to make friends much faster once I started becoming more aloof myself. I have to say, it was a bit of relief not having to worry about small talk on the elevator. I also noticed that I valued my friendships much more.

On that note, the personal space thing is spot on. When speaking to friends and colleagues, they enjoyed getting a foot or so away from my face...when drinking this distance would dramatically decrease.

I definitely noticed this in Switzerland with service staff (not so much with strangers in other situations though). It seemed rude first to not have a waiter/cashier/whoever strike up small talk while serving you, or for a waiter to not check on you part-way through a meal, or speak very formally with you. But once you realize it's their way of being polite, valuing your time and not being intrusive into your private life, it grows on you. I find the North American way annoying now!

True story: first time I'm at San Jose Diridon waiting for the Caltrain to SF, I notice the platform specified in the ticket was closed. I go to the counter, and the guy there tells me to "go through that door, walk to the left, the train should depart from that platform".

I follow his instructions and can't find the platform, so I come back and ask him (very politely) "Hmm, I couldn't find the platform, was it through that door there?". His answer? He looks at me as if I had pissed on his lunch and asks "Sir, are you asking me a question, or questioning my reply?".

WTF? What had I done to piss him off? I'm obviously new to the place, I've asked similar questions in countless train stations/airports/bus stations around the world and never ever has anyone treated me like that. All I told him was "I was asking for confirmation, but thank you, I'll go ask someone else."

Don't judge the US by our government workers, please.

We can't stand them either.

They're victims of circumstance. They would be wonderful people, if only they had normal jobs.

It's the government's fault. It makes them into that.

>Sincerely, I don't know how the US manages to be the second most touristic country in the world. Travelling to the US can be a nightmare - customs, TSA, metal detectors, body scanners, etc. As a tourist, I've never felt as unwelcomed as when travelling there.

That is mostly a small BS business that ends in, like, 15 minutes. Then you are in the US and you can start your travel.

I've visited the US six times, road-tripping for 40 days each time, and visited (more than once) all states but Vermont (just for lack of time, next time).

You can opt for a traditional holiday (i.e pick a place, like NY, Chicago, Miami, L.A, S.F etc) or have excellent road trips, or go explore huge natural parks.

In any case, you will find great city life, places untouched by tourism at all (e.g. I remember Langtry, TX, where the nearest shop was like 50 miles away, or Avalon, MS, where only 2-3 blues buffs a year ever venture), and generally helpful and curious folk (with the occasional idiot).

Everywhere you go with a small drive you can find 99% of anything you want (just walk into the nearest Walmart for example), and you can find places to sleep ranging from $3000 a day hotels to $30 a day motels, with even the latter being just fine compared to shitholes you can get in other countries.

What I want to say is, this TSA/Airport business is an INSIGNIFICANT part of the trip. Act along with the security theater, and it is over in a few minutes.

In contrast, there are countries where you even have to bribe some officials to get in (or to avoid trouble).

>That is mostly a small BS business that ends in, like, 15 minutes. Then you are in the US and you can start your travel.

Uuhhh... I don't think so. I travelled around Europe in the 7 years I lived in two countries there, and I found it very easy to go from country to country (even to Eastern Europe countries like Bulgaria, Croatia and Serbia).

Now, due to my job, I must go the US and man... all the stuff we have to put up. For starters, to get a VISA I have to go to the ASC to give my fingerprints and photo (and I am afraid they'll ask for a surprise anal probe). THEN I have to go to the embassy to convince the officer that I am not going to stay there (who would like to, when they treat you like that?).

In contrast, going to live in Germany was a breeze, no photos, no fingerprints, a very straight and to the point questionnaire (not the huge online form in which I have to specify when was my great-great-great grandmoher in the USA).

Anyway... I have ranted too much. Now I am just hoping that it is worth it and that the visit I must do to the US is so great that I forget all this stuff.

One thing I remember from a long road trip I took in the nineties across the US was, on multiple occasions, being told that I was "brave" or "courageous" when it came up in conversation that I was an atheist (okay - technical agnostic, working atheist if you want to be picky :-)

Everybody was nice. Nobody was mean about it (I got a lot of hassle over being a vegetarian though) but it was felt odd for two reasons.

First that it came up. I'm from the UK and we just don't get onto the topic of religion that much. Especially with complete strangers from other countries that you've just met.

Second the "brave" thing obviously... I've occasionally found some of the more extreme ends of the religious community over here annoying... but never anywhere close to the extent that I would feel stating my (non)religious views would be any kind of brave or courageous thing...

An odd difference.

Actually, I suspect there is a chance that those people were concerned for your immortal soul and therefore regarded your position in the face of impending endless torment as "brave".

But I'm also an atheist and British... and despite growing up in an oppresively religious community I don't really understand these things.

Nah. It was definitely just being open about being non-religious. The reaction came from the religious and the non-religious. It also wasn't a north/south thing (I know you didn't mention that - but it's something that's come up when I've commented on this before).

That sort of usage of "brave" (to compliment while sending mild sarcasm/bemusement/disapproval) sounds distinctly British to me. :)

This reminds me of the episode of top gear where they paint offensive remarks on each others cars and drive across the southern US.

http://www.topgear.com/uk/videos/southern-discomfort

When I asked the guy running the local tourist/visitor-center in some small town in PA what to do out there, his second question (after 'where you from?') was: 'So how are you baptised?' It took me some time to think about an answer. This question was odd to me for a couple of reasons:

1) I have never been asked that question in my whole life.

2) I haven't been baptised.

3) I didn't want to offend him, so after some time I figured it would be more offensive if he caught me lying.

4) It still was uncomfortable because the german stereotype of the religeous american is one of a superficial radical. This stereotype would be tested the moment I'd answer him. Would he drop his friendlliness towards me? Would he treat me differently?

He was strucked by my atheism in third generation. His mood went down. He was honestly concerned for me. I think I ruined his day.

In conclusion: My impression of the religious american (the most religeous one that I've met so far) was a good one. He was open about his believe, believing it consequentially (from what i've saw) and not a bigot (he didn't drop his friendliness).

I am an American, and not an atheist -- but I'm also not a Christian, and that question would have taken me aback too. In fact I'm quite sure I've never been asked that in my life. I would have been tempted to say something sarcastic like, "you really should get out more; there are people in this world who aren't Christians" but really, the guy was just trying to answer your question -- the reality being, I suppose, that everything there was to do in that town was organized by sect.

When I was last in the US (in 99) I was told I was brave for walking to the mall. It was only a few miles, for some reason this concept of walking was somewhat weird to the locals. To be fair, I was in Jacksonville NC, but I found it odd that they found it odd.

In some places in America sidewalks and crosswalks are virtually non-existent, so they may have been concerned for your safety. Walking a few miles (especially in hot, humid places like NC) is a bit unusual here though.

Jacksonville is on the small end of midsized towns in the US, and most cities in this size bracket are not at all walkable. Your couple-mile walk to the mall is obviously totally reasonable once in awhile, but it would be hard to manage day-to-day life in a midsize US city without a car, and the car is integrated into daily life.

The same is true of most suburbs around major cities.

There are many, many Americas.

City folk like to walk. The others not so much. Suburbanites DRIVE to the gym.

We had some visitors from another office, took them to lunch, made it to the crosswalk (200ft), they asked "How far away is this place? We should have just driven."

Yeah, I'm American (from New England) and I've gotten that. I was on my way to a small town in Pennsylvania, and my car broke down part way. It was late, so I had it towed to a garage and found a hotel for the night. In the morning, I decided to walk to the garage (it was a couple of miles). The guys at the garage looked at me like I had two heads for walking that far.

This article reminds me of when I landed a job in the US (at the time I was living in Canada).

As a part of the relocation package I was sent a book "Culture Shock: USA".

Quite an entertaining read. The most memorable quote was "In the US, it is usually typical for a husband to accompany his wife to the hospital when she gives birth".

I take it that's not the case in Canada?

It is normal here in Canada for a husband to accompany his wife to the hospital, and has been at least since I was born in the 80s. I think refurb's point is that it's strange to include that in something you give a Canadian moving to the US.

Well, in that case refurb's comment is as confusing as the statement in the guide book...

That was my point exactly. Canada and the US share 90%+ of their culture, so it was interesting for two reasons:

1. Why send that kind of a book to a Canadian? 2. It's interesting to read what other cultures might find shocking about US culture.

I'm going to guess that was part of their standard "foreigner moving to the US" package?

One of the parts of that book I remember is that you do not talk to other people while at the urinal.

The only possible explanation I can think of is that such a statement would be targeting the non-Anglo Canadian residents, who may be able to live in relative isolation from what we'd consider mainstream North American culture. Even that explanation seems a bit far-fetched, but perhaps there are semi-detached Asian immigrant or First Nations groups. Interesting anecdote.

Yes

I remember reading one of the guides created by an American University to their foreign student

It goes in such excruciating details to things like dating, etc

I suppose this is for the benefit of students from some forgotten city in southeast asia that may think of getting a goat to impress the ladies

Still, it sounds awfully patronizing sometimes.

It might be because the things that you find obvious, simply aren't so obvious all around the world.

Of course, I just found it funny and as I said patronizing.

They gave the guide to me as part of an interculturality course.

Before coming to the USA for the first time I read the following in a guide: "Americans often communicate via inflected grunts and groans, such as "uh-huh" for yes and "uh-uh" for no.

As an American who does this in pretty much every conversation I have, this is a difference I would never have thought of.

Semi-related: Do other countries have fragments of speech used as filler such as "like" and "you know"?

Yes!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filler_%28linguistics%29#Filler...

Absolutely. In Japanese, for example, you'll sometimes hear conversations littered with なんか (nanka) and かしら (kashira).

Do the Japanese really say "desu"?

Yes. For example, if you wanted to tell a stranger "that person is a police officer," the most natural translation is probably "ano hito wa keikan desu." In other contexts, you might replace "desu" with the informal "da" or the ultra-polite "de gozaimasu" (or "de gozaru" if you're a samurai). In practice you wouldn't say it too often. Other grammatical structures (like "-te iru") are more appropriate counterparts to maybe 75% of English sentences involving "to be."

It is nonetheless grammatically possible to contrive every sentence to end in "desu." This is an unusual habit, though. It's a little like beginning every utterance in English with "it seems" or "Simon says."

です？ Wikipedia says: "word used to grammatically link a subject and predicate, often translated into English using the verb "to be". And, yes they do use it. But what is strange about it? Do English really use "to be" (in its various conjugations)?

There's an anime character who ends every sentence with です (as I described above). GP is probably referring to a famous internet meme where that's the only word she knows.

Some context: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/desu

Yup.

Never heard about it. Maybe I should come out from woodwork from time to time.

It means "is", so yes, they do. It's used for predication instead of existence (iru & aru are for existence), but that's probably the more common is in English as well.

If you want filler, it's when people are going え～と while trying to collect their thoughts.

When I did exchange I had one teacher who would say ええと (eeto) every second word.

We sure do. In Danish "ikke?", "ikke også", "du ved" among others. In Bulgarian I hear "бе", "така" and "такова".

In Polish you can hear "co nie", "e[e]", "a[a]", "czy nie", "czyż nie" and some others.

In Quebec's french, we will replace nearly any word by a swear word (criss/osti/tabarnak/caliss), which can be used as a noun, a verb, an adverb, and adjective, etc. Basically, like smurf-talk.

Also there's a one-to-one relationship between english's use of "like" as a filler by our use of "genre". In this case, "genre" means "similar to". So one could say "J'ai genre... mangé une criss de grosse poutine" in the same way an english speaker would say "I have like.. eaten a fucking huge cheese-and-gravy covered bowl of french-fries".

It's really interesting how all of the swear-words you mention are communion-related and how in France's French you'd be hard pressed to find any swearing other than somthing-Dieu that is religious in nature.

It's really telling of how religion has been removed from French culture during the Revolution.

All those swear are in violent reaction against the Catholic Church which was prominent at the beginning of the century. This is before, nowaday, people just use these words by habit and as a cultural identity. I'd say that a vast majority of young Quebecers are agressive atheist.

While the French are secular to the point they don't even need to be aggressive about it. :)

In Northern Somali dialects you can pretty much put "dee" between every other sentence. People do it sometimes to buy time while gathering thoughts. It vaguely means "therefore".

In the South it's "noo", and it vaguely means "why don't you?". Or "allore", from Italian allora.

I'm from Germany and it's absolutely the same here. There is no conversation without a lot of "uh"s, "yep"s, "nope"s, "nahh"s, "huh"s, and the ones that are actual German words but are really just fillers or shorthand for (dis)agreement such as "naja", "nun", "also", "aber", "klar", "schon" and so on. The equivalents of like (="irgendwie", "so", "halt") are used all the time and we have a few such constructs for you know ("schau", "nicht wahr", "es ist doch so, dass...").

I firmly believe all countries do this.

If you haven't read it, check Mark Twain's essay about the German language. You'll find that he agrees with you, especially with the 'also'.

You forgot "oder". The time I was living in Germany I found it very amusing that colleagues always finished some sentences with "or" (e.g., "I think we should add this format, or?") or the equivalent in german "oder" ("Ich glaube das is gut, oder?"

Gets annoying at time: in French, some people drop "tu vois" (you see), "j'veux dire" (I mean), "et tout" (and all that) everywhere. For some people it gets close to an actual speech disorder :)

I don't think we do this in Greek. Come to think of it, it's weird, when I talk in Greek I use no filler, but when I speak English I litter it with "like" and "you know" like a valley girl. At least I don't say "ohmigod"...

'ela, na su po kati....' roughly: 'hey, let me tell you something...' I hear this all the time in Greece.

That's not filler, though, it's just a way of starting a sentence, like "hey". "Na sou po, are you going to eat that?"

Alltså we have typ that in Swedish as well änna.

schjooo (ljudet en norrlänning gör då hen håller med)

No mention of our odd restaurant tipping practices? I thought they are unusual compared to the rest of the world...

What are those odd tipping practices? I'm from Canada (Ontario/Quebec), and the standard is to leave 15% of the bill as tip. Less is considered being extremely rude. In other countries, the tip is included in the bill. In other countries, tipping is rare and made in very specific circumstances.

As an Australian any kind of expected tip is odd.

The justification for this 15% is that government assumes that customers give tip to waitress/er, and thus take taxes off the waitress/er pay-check according to this 15% supposition. So basically, when you don't pay the 15% tip, the waitress/er is paying extra taxes because of you. Unless the service is bad, the normal would thus be to pay the 15% tip, unless its a tip-less kind of job.

Some jobs are identified by governments as being tip-supported. Thus, the minimal wage for these jobs is lower than the normal minimum-wage, assumed that the real revenue comes from tip (which is actually true). To get their taxes share, they use the waitress/er sales to compute how much is due in taxes. Basically, governments have destroyed the whole purpose of tipping, which is to recognize good service. However, they make it cheaper for restaurant owner to hire new employees (the minimum wages is lower).

Not quite. Servers report tip amounts to their employer and that information goes to their W-2. Because they get tips, servers can be paid less than minimum wage. But even so, if their tips and wages combined aren't enough to get them up to minimum wage, the employer must pay them the difference.

I found this post from a cocktail waitress actually pretty informative on the subject of tipping:

http://cocktaildoll.com/tippingtips.htm

Specifically:

"Each casino and the IRS have an agreement as to how much to allocate each cocktail waitress, and whether to allocate her by the hour or per drink. The agreement is different with every casino, and within each casino, the allocation amount is different for each cocktail waitress depending on her shift and station. I will use the following as an example, and please keep in mind...this is just an example, a hypothetical, a not-for-real made-up FYI.

"Let's say I am allocated 25¢ per drink. If I bring out a hundred drinks that day, the IRS assumes I made $25.00, and that amount is added on to my paycheck as income. Whatever income bracket I fall into at the end of the year determines how much in taxes I will have to pay, or have paid. How does the IRS know how many drinks I take out? Because each time I get an order from the bartender, he swipes my ID badge, or enters my employee number, and he records whatever drinks I take out on the computer. By the way, whether it's a bottled water or a Long Island or a glass of champagne, they are each counted as one drink.

"If I am allocated by the hour, it works the same way, except now it doesn't matter if I take out one drink or a hundred in that hour, I will be allocated the same amount. (The bartender still records my drinks for the casino's records.) Obviously it would be to my advantage financially to take out more drinks. Let's say I get allocated $10.00 an hour and it's really slow, or I'm a lazy-ass and just stand around; if I serve just one drink that hour and I get stiffed, I'm still going to be taxed on $10.00 even though I haven't made it.

"Did I mention that the above is just an example, to be used for reference only? Please do not quote a quarter a drink or $10.00 an hour as fact or an absolute for all cocktail waitresses! I do not know how much each cocktail waitress is allocated, and it is also not my own personal allocation. It is just a clarification.

"Another thing: the IRS agreement is already in place with each casino, but each girl has the option of signing it or not. This is a very private matter, so while I don't know for a fact, I'm going to say that 99% of all cocktail waitresses do sign it. If a waitress does not sign the agreement, she is required to report her own tips."

As an Eastern European, I concur. Here (Bulgaria), it's common to round up (only to the degree of 1 leva (0.50 euro)) for taxis and restaurants. This is "normal". If you tip higher, for example if you round up from 47 leva to 50, it's mostly regarded as a "tip", which means the server will be delighted. Anything more than that, is mostly regarded as unwise and unnecessary. Most of Eastern Europe (with the exception of notable tourist destinations like Greece and Turkey) is quite the same.

I disagree about Greece, people don't generally tip more than 2-3 euros in restaurants, and usually just round up to the euro for deliveries, if that.

Also: Hey neighbour!

Hey there :) Well, my observations are mostly from some seaside resorts, where I've seen more tipping. From what you say, the "normal" areas are just like in Bulgaria in this aspect.

In most of Europe a tip is far more discretionary and often smaller. Eg In the uk I would not tip at all if the service was poor/average and perhaps 10% for good service. I would think of it as being much more performance related and far more discretionary in Europe.

I wouldn't feel bad about not leaving a tip and whilst a waiter/waitress might be disappointed they be overly wouldn't insulted.

In the US I've seen much wider range of people expecting a tip. Eg in the uk you might sometimes round up a taxi fair, but I've had a new York cab driver get positively aggressive (initially refusing to give us our bags) when we didn't tip after he his inability to find a major hotel had added $30 extra on the meter.

Here in Israel it's similar, although ten percent are considered okay.

After one year here it still annoys the hell out of me. In Germany you only give a tip if you consider it appropriate. Your service costs exactly what the bill lists, not more. Especially in crappy places a 'forced' tip feels bad and wasted.

If the place is crappy don't leave a tip. That's the whole point.

I fail to understand your answer. Maybe you've got a good point, but the current reply is too short. I fail to see what you mean.

The 'whole point' was a discussion about mandatory tips. If you don't tip here it's not rare for the service guy/girl to get quite mad and insulting. You HAVE to tip, forced by social norms and by demanding workers.

Tipping practices are pretty common in a lot of countries. In India, for example, it's expected that you tip a wide variety of people for a lot of small services. I find American tipping practices somewhat middle-of-the-road.

ummm, those are not tips in India, they're "Government official motivation banknotes".

I think the restaurant tipping is the least strange, because at least in Europe you usually tip at restaurants if the service or food is really good, but you don't have to like you do in the US.

What gets me every time is all the other places where you are expected to tip, and where I have absolutely no idea of how much I'm expected to tip or that I'm supposed to tip in the first place. Pizza delivery? What? Cab drivers? Seriously? The omelet chef in a hotel's breakfast restaurant? Are you kidding me?!?

The weirdest one yet was when me and some friends were leaving the US, we got to the airport, and passed some sort of exterior baggage drop. We went to that, but there was a guy there in an airport uniform who took our bags and put them on the conveyer belt when we tried to do it ourselves. So we said "thanks" and walked away.

And he got so angry at us for not tipping him. So confusing.

I used to obsess about tipping as well: I kept forgetting the special customs of countries, and usually ended up giving way more than what was expected or nothing at all (by mistake, mostly). It's worth noting that in some countries the tipping process also varies regionally or even from restaurant to restaurant.

Now that I'm older and more callous I have simplified the process. I look at the receipt to check if there is a tip already included. If it is, we're done. Sure, I had discussions with waiters who insisted this is the bare minimum and I have to give something extra on top of that but now I simply leave and never go to that place again. If the tip isn't on the receipt, they get 10-20% depending on the quality of service. So far, this works well in every country.

I believe foreigners get a lot of abuse and are sometimes scammed by obnoxious staff who like to take advantage of the cultural insecurities of visitors. In my opinion, a good strategy is to always be friendly, but don't let yourself get bullied.

Those guys are "porters" and essentially make their money from tips. I always just drag my gear inside.

> Pizza delivery? What? Cab drivers? Seriously? The omelet chef in a hotel's breakfast restaurant? Are you kidding me?!?

I'm a native, but don't think it's so obvious for us either. One time I got a stern talking to by my barber. I now tip every time I get a haircut.

I used to work installing audio and video equipment as a kid and got tipped all the time.

If somebody renders any kind of service, tips are frequently expected.

Well, in Brazil 10 percent is already included in the check, it's "optional" but everybody accepts it. Usually that's not related to good or bad service, it's the common practice. And this money doesn't go to the server but to the 'proprietor'.

That's especially interesting to me, as it's generally considered bad form in the US to tip the proprietor, and even worse form for the proprietor to accept the tip if offered.

French tipping practices : you tip only if the service is exceptionally good or if you are a regular and want to ingratiate the staff to yourself. Staff members get a salary and don't have to depend on alms.

By the way, tips all go into a common tip jar and get shared among the whole staff at the end of the day or week (depending upon the place).

"food, which they praise for its quality and variety (and portion size) in a tone of near-disbelief"

huh, really? Whenever I get back from traveling I feel the opposite.

Sure in places like NY you can get any kind of food. But in my mono-cultural hometown there is little besides hamburgers or pizza.

And "Chinese".

Yes, but visitors that buy guidebooks do not go to your mono-cultural hometown. They go to New York!

Even in my (relatively) small-medium town in New Hampshire[1] there's an amazing variety of high quality restaurants. A lot of people abroad in their own similiar-sized towns don't get to ever try authentic Mexican, or Cajun, or American comfort, or sushi, or Greek, etc, all of which are available here.

For most tourists, especially tourists from small towns going to NYC or Boston or SF, America is a cultural delight of food.

[1] http://www.yelp.com/c/nashua-nh/restaurants

Exactly. I like to think about all the cuisines I've had here in the bay area this week. Must be like 3 or 4 different cuisines from all countries. And they were all good.

An aside: As a Greek, I tend to stay away from "Greek" restaurants abroad, because it's almost never Greek food. For example, people here generally eat lamb only once or twice a year, and I didn't know what hummus is until I had it in London (in one such "Greek" restaurant, no less).

I think it's more about the stereotype that is expected of the restaurant rather than actually being authentic. For example, Greek gyros is almost always pork, never lamb. If you get lamb gyros, it's middle-eastern.

Lamb gyros is usually called döner kebab (the turkish name for gyros) in Europe, while pork gyros usually is called gyros.

No cuisine survives importation to another country, really, but authenticity can be overrated.

I remember growing in Taiwan and having "pizza" there - it doesn't really resemble the pizza you might find in Italy, nor the Americanized version. For one thing, pizza was high-class, eaten at a sit-down place with cloth napkins, forks, and knives... and toppings featured things like lobster and crab.

The reverse is true too - there is no such thing as "chicken balls", that crazy east-coast invention that claims to be Chinese, nor General Tso's chicken either. In fact, mostly everything you find in an American Chinese restaurant would never be found at the dinner table in China. But if you think that's crazy, wait till you try Chinese-Indian food. Hoo boy.

But that's the great thing about the new global society - we can remix, borrow, replace to our heart's content. I had Peking duck tacos a couple of weeks ago, it was delicious. And there's this food truck near here that has an amazing (Korean-style) roast pork Chinese bao that's garnished with Japanese pickled radishes with some Mexican flavor thrown in to boot. Sublime.

Food is, in the future, extremely unlikely to stick to its geographic and ethnic roots, and what an amazing change that is.

> pizza was high-class, eaten at a sit-down place with cloth napkins, forks, and knives

There are many nice restaurants in Italy that are just like this.

>For example, people here generally eat lamb only once or twice a year

Well, as a Greek, I beg to differ. We eat lamb more than "once a year" (you probably refer to easter, but forget the mighty paidakia). Plus, this cow meat we mostly eat now is a recent development.

The traditional meat until 4-5 decades ago was lamb and goat (mostly because Greek domestic cows where too skinny and the grass unfit to support them. Post 1981 they were replaced with foreign cow breeds plus tons of imports).

As for hummus: "Greek" restaurants abroad are often mixed Greek/Middle-Eastern, and some are run by Lebanese and use the "Greek" just to attract some additional customers.

A funny aside: the traditional american "diner" (the chrome plated, hamburger joint etc) was more often than not, a Greek business. Greeks pwned the diner business in the US in the '40 to '80s. If you check a series like "Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives", a disproportionate percentage of iconic food joints are still in Greek hands, including the majority of NY hot dog stands. I have travelled extensively in the US (only missed Vermont), and I chanced upon several, such as:

• Lou Mitchels, the Chicago diner at the start point of Route 66. • Nick's, in Albq., NM at the crossing of Route 66 (old route) and Route 66 (later bypass) (!), • Leopold's, considered the best ice cream in Savannah, GA (and featured in top-10 US lists)• Ariston, on Route 66, IL, suggested by every guide, • Mike's Chilly Parlor, in Seattle, etc. nom nom nom nom...

Hmm, true, I forgot about paidakia... The rest of your comment is spot on, I think, thanks.

You should be thankful. Some people never discover the wonders of delicious, delicious hummus.

It also depends on what food you're used to. I'm from the UK and did the whole cross-country US road trip thang when I was in my twenties. I remember it was the little odd differences in supermarkets and restaurants that freaked me out.

For example - at the time (early nineties) almost no Indian food anywhere. In the UK even small villages often have an Indian take out. On the flip side - in the US you have texmex everywhere. It's still fairly rare over here (and of a.... erm.... different level of quality :-)

Bread was another one. At even small rural shops you had soughdough, rye, bagels, etc. In the UK you get white bread and brown bread ;-)

And the portion sizes... wow... so different. I remember going out with a family chatting away snacking away and suddenly realising that I was now "full" on the "free stuff you eat before your meal"...

> And the portion sizes... wow...

Yes, Umberto Eco wrote an interesting article on the cultural significance of "more" to Americans. This is quite obvious in restaurant portion sizes among other.

I love Eco's fiction but am now just getting into reading his essays. Which is the one you're referencing?

I'll have to dig the book out to find. It must me in one of the article compilations such as "How to travel with a salmon" or "Travels in Hyperreality".

> In the UK even small villages often have an Indian take out.

Amazing how a minor thing like running India as a colony for 400+ years can have that effect!

Similarly, I imagine that Tex-Mex is a bit more common here than in Wales...

Amazing how a minor thing like running India as a colony for 400+ years can have that effect!

Indeed :-)

(Really it was about 200 years-ish of "running" India. It's usually dated from 1757 and the East India Company's victory at the Battle of Plassey.)

Not only large cities - but rural areas too. The reputation for shitty food really happens in the vast stretches of suburbia that straddle the awkward territory between city and country.

The US has, overall, amazing food. In large cities there is not only immense diversity (after all, the US is more diverse than most Western nations), but also a culture of experimentation at all price ranges. It's possible to eat amazingly in most major cities for anywhere between $5 and $500.

In the country and small towns there is a tremendous variation across the nation. The food of the Northwest vs. the food of the Southwest vs. the food of the South vs. the Northeast.

It's only when you get into strip-mall-landia where things start appearing incredibly boring and monocultural, and just plain not good.

> It's only when you get into strip-mall-landia where things start appearing incredibly boring and monocultural

A famous economist / foodie has written an entire book about how you've got it EXACTLY backwards:

http://www.amazon.com/An-Economist-Gets-Lunch-Everyday/dp/05...

The best food, he asserts, is in strip malls. You just have to know a few tricks to find it.

Great book. Go read it.

No, Cowen says the best ethnic food is in strip malls, and they're in strip malls ringing large cities. It by no means follows that the best food overall resides in strip malls. The comparison is to other ethnic restaurants, particularly Asian, and not to restaurants in general.

And of course, Cowen includes a section on exactly how hard it is, and how creative he had to be, to get decent Chinese food in rural Virginia.

It is obviously not true that the best food overall can be found in exurban and rural strip malls.

I've eaten in 48 states, including tons of malls. If that is what the book is saying, it is bullshit. Not to mention that in most malls you only find the same generic franchised BS.

In addition to the wide variety of foreign cuisine available in many parts of the U.S., there are many different "native" cuisines in different regions of the country. I'm inevitably going to leave out a lot, especially from the places I haven't been to, but here are some exampes. New York has got its pizza (both the Neapolitan and Sicilian styles, neither of which is very similar to the pizza found in Naples or Siciliy), bagels, half sour pickles, and certain cold cuts. Chicago has Italian beef and deep dish pizza. Wisconsin has its cheeses and bratwurst ("brats"). Philadelphia has cheese steak and hot pretzels like no others. Lousisiana has the Creole and Cajun cuisines. There's Tex-Mex and other southwestern cuisine. Lots of places along the east coast have their own very distinct variety of clam chowder, etc. I never realized how much I would miss food from various American cuisines until I lived in China for five months.

> Of the many pieces of advice proffered, four of the most common are: [...] don't drink and drive (they take it seriously here!)

That is absolutely not my impression of America. Americans I have met have a shockingly casual attitude to drink driving. I've also seen it been portrayed in a positive light on American TV (e.g. fictional protagonist regaling a tale).

In Ireland drink driving is still fairly pervasive amongst my parent's generation and in rural areas. But with younger people drink driving is totally taboo thanks to strict laws and a lot of education. Our media would never broadcast anything that was positive of drink driving in any way.

Irish also and absolutely agree, none of my peer group would even consider driving after drinking in Ireland, but in my experience it's much more common and accepted in the US - you can even see thi in action in US television / films.

"you can even see thi in action in US television / films."

So Ireland is just like "Darby O'Gill and the Little People", then? :-)

In virtually all U.S. states, driving while intoxicated will result in a stiff fine, the loss of driving privileges for a very long time, and quite likely some jail time to boot.

This has changed dramatically over the last 20-30 years.

I'm also Irish and I think the original comment is pretty valid - The point is you would never see a "normal" character in an irish/uk made production drink-driving, it is just a complete taboo. However, a massive amount of American produced shows have the protagonists driving home from the bar, and it is just accepted, which I always find quite jarring. If it was part of the character's image to be a law breaker/troubled/etc, that would be one thing, but "Sideways", the newest American Pie movie and "Dan in Real Life" spring to mind as 3 films I have seen lately which have examples of this casual drink driving. Clearly they aren't documentaries :-) but the American Pie movie in particular is pretty mainstream, so it was really surprising. I think it is reasonable to assume that the US attitude to drink-driving is quite a way behind Ireland.

And on your point on Darby O'Gill - That was an American film depicting Ireland, which was obviously full of stereotypes. The films and tv shows we are talking about are an American view of America, which you would assume should be a little more accurate in terms of attitudes/culture...

Agreed on all points, and just to emphasise: my primary experience of this is in person in the US in a variety of cities with groups in their 20s / 30s. In my experience this just doesn't happen in Ireland anymore and it would be very surprising to see this sort of behavior show up in a movie / tv here except in the context of highlighting the 'wrongness' of the action.

In the interest of saving visitors to the US some trouble, be assured that the police here take it quite seriously.

Whatever you see on TV or even however you see people behave, if the police pull you over, you will definitely suffer serious consequences. There will not be any tolerance.

People do it, yes, because they think they'll get away with it. But if they don't there's hefty fines and/or jail time awaiting them.

That's aside from the risk of crashing, which should be enough for anyone.

I've lived in Australia, UK and now California. Drink driving is much more accepted here. In Australia I regularly encountered random breath tests (police stopping and breath testing dozens of drivers at a time) and have been pulled over by a police car purely so I could be breathalised (I was completely sober).

I feel it's much more commonplace and acceptable in the US to drive alone to a bar, drink, and then drive home. Cities are much smaller in Australia and the UK so catching a taxi, public transport or walking is feasible.

We have a pesky 4th Amendment in our Constitution that broadly (but not completely) prevents the police from pulling over cars without cause.

So, it is true that if you're a "steady" drunk driver, you're perhaps more likely to get away with driving drunk here than in Oz.

If you get pulled over though, you're likely to be arrested. Getting arrested in the US (as opposed to getting cited) is very unpleasant.

Cause is pretty easy to come by, though. Speeding is the most likely, but there's also the old standby of "weaving".

I worked in a bar for a few years, which oddly enough involved driving home at the well-known bar closing time for the city. And that late at night I pretty much ignored speed limits. I got pulled over quite a lot, and every time as soon as they realized I wasn't drinking, they let me go with no penalty. They were quite obviously trolling for DUIs.

Good for them, I say. At any rate, obviously, if you're speeding (which I, too, do all the time) it's tough to complain about being pulled over.

I often drive home from work very late at night and I've been pulled over and followed for doing absolutely nothing wrong. I think one said my license plate was dirty. They let me go and told me to have a nice night when it was clear that I wasn't doing anything wrong, though.

The point is, the police are (usually) required to have cause to stop motor vehicle drivers, and if they arrest you for DUI after stopping you for no reason, you have grounds to challenge the arrest.

Obviously, "grounds to challenge" is no guarantee that you'll be acquitted or have charges dismissed, and obviously the police can and do manufacture reasons to pull drivers over, but the requirement to have cause creates a disincentive to do that routinely.

Which, my point was, was one reason one might experience stricter detection of DUI's in another country.

Oh, I agree with all that. I'm just saying that you can be stopped for no reason even in the USA. I believe they call these pretext stops.

That said, I didn't give him a hard time so the cop remained very friendly the whole time and I didn't have any trouble after getting stopped.

> Americans I have met have a shockingly casual attitude to drink driving.

Were these Americans cops? Their opinion is the only one that counts. Getting caught with a DUI = jail, mandatory suspended license for 3 - 12 months, thousands of dollars in fines. And unlike in other countries, slipping the cop some money will = more jail and probably a beating. That's for natives. A foreigner? LMAO!

Haha something tells me other countries which have very negative attitudes to drink driving are not the type of places that you go around bribing police :-)

And I'm not sure what you are suggesting with the comment about getting a beating from cops, and it being much worse for foreigners? Are you defending the US as a tourist destination or attacking it? :-)

It's interesting to read about things that are just ingrained from birth and you don't really think about them. When you see them written down they sound kinda bizarre!

Surprisingly, most of the descriptions apply also to Japan. Except you need to replace forks with chopsticks, cowboys with ninjas.

It's funny you should mention Japan. If you have ever actually visited it, I cannot think of any large culture that could be more different from Anglo and especially North American culture...

The article mentions fact.check.org, however, it looks like the correct site is factcheck.org.

Article also fails to mention that using something like factcheck.org will typically get you branded a liberal.

Reality has a well-known liberal bias.

Well according to TV viewing habits conservatives tip the scales for reality.

http://www.realityblurred.com/realitytv/archives/related_new...

Liberal isn't a dirty word, it's not something you're branded with.

It is in some circles.

Not intelligent ones.

In a large (but shrinking, year by year) part of the country, it most definitely is.

Those aren't places most people want to go, though.

Neither is "socialist" but that isn't stopping anyone...

According to who?

It is to the sort of people who might perform such branding.

In denmark liberale are considered to be right wing...

At some point in the early 20th century they flipped it over here. A "rebrand" of sorts.

That's not what he meant - he meant (I think) that a US liberal is still considered right wing in Denmark, i.e. that the Danish 'liberals' are US 'pinko commies' and US right-wingers are in Denmark either 'capitalist oppressors' or 'crazy religious extremist', or both, depending on context.

This is true for Sweden as well.

Interesting read.

Are there any good wikis or Internet Communities - guiding Visitors to learn new cultures, behaviors, ethics in different places?

It's nice to see a comparison chart on - cost of living, labor costs, a basic meal, hotel rooms(Comparison charts should be - City vs Another-city and Country Level comparisons)

And I would definitely pay $$ for such a service.

Wiki-Travel? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikitravel

"Don't drink the water and don't breathe the air."

And if you must put on sunglasses you found on the street, do not stare at the skull headed people, point at the signs saying 'breed', or shut down the big weird radio transmitter thingy.

I suspect you know what to do when you run out of bubblegum then?

In case anyone missed it, this is a reference to the oft-brilliant Tom Lehrer :

"Pollution" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mvYec6AnCU

If you're talking about water just lying around, maybe so, but US water standards are if anything ridiculously stringent compared to much of the rest of the world [1]. Read that page carefully, and observe that while the US standards may appear at times to permit things somewhat higher than other standards, the US (along with Europe) strongly enforce them, so it's not that comparable.

As for the air, it is generally clean in the US. Sort this chart by "above or below world average": [2] Also note the line about the US being very well sampled, so if there's an error it's not there.

It isn't 1965 anymore.

[1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drinking_water_quality_standard...

[2]: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/datablog/2011/sep/26/g...

Well, it depends on where you're from. Your link shows that US water standards are lax compared to European standards. But more than water, I'd be concerned about the amount of hormones and antibiotics in meat.

And then subsequently introduced into our water supply..

Interesting to see that according to your source, European standards are 3 to 5 times more strict than the US. Depending on your definition of "rest of the world", maybe you meant water in the US is higher quality than India? Probably true.

It's perfectly safe to drink the water out of virtually any tap in America. If you do much traveling, you'll find this is very untrue of the rest of the world (not just India).

Even in Europe water quality varies between "great" and "I wouldn't drink that" on a country-by-country basis, and sometimes on a city-by-city basis. Remember that "Europe" isn't a country and there aren't any such things as "European standards". Even to the extent that there is an European Union which sets standards for a portion of the subcontinent, enforcement and adherence varies widely. In Germany the tap water will be above American standards everywhere. In Italy, for instance, ask a local before drinking.

> It's perfectly safe to drink the water out of virtually any tap in America. [...]

> Remember that Europe isn't a country

Is America a country?

Yes, it's the country also known as the States or more formally the United States of America: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/America#Proper_noun

Indeed we are!

"In Italy, for instance, ask a local before drinking."

Maybe in some very out of the way spots - but I've been to Italy a lot for work and pleasure and I've never heard that advice before. Some times tap water tastes vary because of local geology or water source, but that applies everywhere.

"It's perfectly safe to drink the water out of virtually any tap in America."

Safe may be, but on many occasions with a strong chlorine smell, something that stops me each time from drinking from such taps, even if they're perfectly safe.

"Read that page carefully, and observe that while the US standards may appear at times to permit things somewhat higher than other standards, the US (along with Europe) strongly enforce them"

In other words, Europe is the only other jurisdiction that even has actual standards, as opposed to "guidelines".

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