Phoenix Is Facing a Hurricane Katrina of Heat
bloomberg.com
bloomberg.com
You can’t live “normally” when it’s over 115, with a low of 93 at 5 am. There’s tons of unofficial lifestyle rules to survive well. For example before you drive you “cool down your car” by turning on the air conditioning and washing the car by running the hose all over it (even though that water is also hot lol). Cooling off your car that’s been sitting in the hot sun with water allows the air to actually work.
Tons of stuff like that. You need to drink cold water with electrolytes and I find everyone’s diet changes. People eat less, and eat spicier Mexican food and salt.
It’s a real special environment. I personally believe the June July August and first half of Sept heat challenges are worth the desert beauty of the rest of the year.
It is comically true how we tend to live in AC bubbles. On one hand, I completely understand. When the heat is so heavy that you can walk outside for 15 seconds, come back inside, and only then start sweating... I can't fault people for avoiding it as much as possible.
Growing up, I'd always shivver during the summer and sweat during winter. Places like schools and stores will blast their AC constantly so the entire building is the opposite of the temperature outside. Often I'll wear layers to get around it, putting on up to three shirts when going indoors for a longer period of time.
When I worked in construction for a year I learned how to safely work in 110°F heat. After that, I tried really hard to not adapt back to the colder weather, which is kind of hard when where I'm working requires me to bundle up during the summer as if it's winter because they keep it as cold as they can.
I love the state too.
I wonder what event in the near future will make the Google searchs for "wet bulb temperature" sky-rocket...
This seems anathema to a location that is under threat of not enough water. If a city is willing to slow down construction because they don't have to water to support the growth, I can't imagine this is an accepted practice that you are actually promoting.
Yes, you will splash some water on your car to make it tolerable to drive.
Also after a week or two over 115, 110 feels absolutely "cool" to us here in Phoenix. We really do say "Hey, today the high is only 110! Fall is coming!".
You remind me of the neighbor's teenage kid I once saw cleaning cut grass from the drive way with a garden hose sprayer. I still remember his dad realizing his failure in raising a kid with common sense and explaining what a waste in water it was, how expensive it was, and just illogical of a decision it was. I feel I've now become that dad.
I’m sure many think it’s illogical to try to live on Phoenix. That’s alright, it’s our choice.
I upgraded to the retractable ones that attach to the either side of the windshield. They were never put in the trunk ever again
Architecture is just catching up to optimizing for shade. It’s really a shame. Parking lots are now being covered by solar panels, which is a great use of space.
OTOH, it's 93F and 63% humidity in Austin on June 1, 2024. It was 105-110F in 2023 for 4 months last summer. While tacos are the city's official food, but it's harder to find good authentic Mexican or Tex-Mex that isn't gourmet or hipsterized. Near San Anton has some fantastic authentic Mexican and Tex-Mex restaurants.
Yep. Heat is a great way to go on a "diet".
I keep a gallon bottle of water in the fridge premixed with sugar-free electrolyte powder. Cheaper than buying colored water and less calories.
In a place like Phoenix that would/could mean the world shutting down 2PM-5PM instead of 2AM-5AM. 2AM should be when everybody is going out after dinner.
Covid only made this worse with the loss of 24h shopping, and 11PM cutoffs.
I can imagine this will become a real issue once water becomes more scarce...
""In Arizona’s Maricopa County, home to the capital of Phoenix, nearly 2,000 people have died of heat-related deaths in the past five years. Built in a desert with limited water supplies and expanding rapidly, Phoenix, once called “the world’s least-sustainable city,”""
Then why is there demand? Why do humans want to live in a desolate desert without water? It isn't logical. Maybe allergies are better for a few people. That doesn't explain why companies would commit. Why would semiconductor companies build plants here.
That might make sense, doesn't Phoenix also have a pretty high percentage of overweight unhealthy people? Just sitting inside with air conditioning. It fits that method of thinking.
I assume the people living in Phoenix are humans, yes. Seems likely they're using the one and only logic available to humans.
The point was it is not logical, 'human logic' is fallacious. It only appears logical if it justifies what you want.
Technically, being self interested isn't wrong. But it isn't Logic.
Logic
""Logic studies arguments, which consist of a set of premises together with a conclusion. An example is the argument from the premises "it's Sunday" and "if it's Sunday then I don't have to work" to the conclusion "I don't have to work".[1] Premises and conclusions express propositions or claims that can be true or false.""
Self Interest
"First, psychological egoism is a theory about the nature of human motives.
Psychological egoism suggests that all behaviors are motivated by self-interest. In other words, it suggests that every action or behavior or decision of every person is motivated by self interest. It also suggests that every action must be motivated by self interest. The doctrine of selfish motivation is simply a natural law of psychology. Just as it is a natural law of physics that bodies tend to move toward one another in proportion to their masses and at velocities inversely proportionate to their distances from one another, it is a natural law that all motivations are, ultimately, selfish."
Of course, we are getting into definitions of words. And technically, I do agree, people can do what they want, there is no right or wrong. I just don't think it is logical.
Premise: "I want warm weather and cheap housing."
Premise: "People should move to the places that offer what they want."
Premise: "Phoenix offers warm weather and cheap housing."
Conclusion: "I should move to Phoenix."
"
Ah, the age-old debate of logic versus self-interest. Sure, logic is about connecting the dots with premises and conclusions, but let's not kid ourselves—most of our decisions are driven by what we want.
So, if someone wants warm weather and cheap housing, and Phoenix fits the bill, then it's a no-brainer.
1. *Premise:* "I want warm weather and cheap housing."
2. *Premise:* "Phoenix offers warm weather and cheap housing."
3. *Conclusion:* "I should move to Phoenix."
Boom. Logical and self-interested. Just because it's driven by personal desire doesn't make it illogical. It's logic with a dash of "I know what I like." So yeah, moving to Phoenix makes perfect sense if that's what floats your boat.
"
You can make any premises you want to satisfy your goals. So just do what you want. Don't need to kid yourself that it was logical.
Guess I was going down the road that an environmentally-sane economy would need 'logic', it would be more 'logical', that it would be more correct versus the current system that seems 'illogical'. Thus we could use logic to argue for change.
This argument is showing that all sides could use 'logic' to reach their own desired conclusion, so logic is not really the method of change.
The whole problem of "You can't use logic to dissuade someone who didn't use logic to reach their viewpoint in the first place".
This argument has demonstrated that 'logic' can be more flexible when used by humans. Having a better environment for he future isn't necessarily better just by using 'logic'. Thus we can't use logic to argue for better policy. Thus, as you said, we need to fall back on different methods to 'threaten policymakers to change policy'.
I think there is only missing variables. The logic changes based on adding new/updated premises.
Like others in this thread have mentioned, Phoenix actually does have water, that it is the Alfalfa agriculture business that is using 70% of the water (i'm taking their numbers).
So, if we add in this new information like "it is really the agriculture business", then the question that logic leads to is more "can we modify that business" or "does Alfalfa really needed to be grown in this area, can it be moved".
So the logic for the humans becomes more like
1. A lot of people want to live here because of the sunny weather.
2. The water supply is now over-extended
3. The main users of water is the Alfalfa industry, not the new humans moving to the area.
4. Given the humans are the government (democracy), and they choose to live here, can they work towards changing the industry in such a way to accommodate both?
Of course, farmers have rights too. And we get into government authority, who is the 'arbiter' in conflicts. Especially out west where different states might dam up rivers and starve downstream states, then it goes to Federal Gov. But what if we dam up water going to Mexico, then it is inter-Nation conflict, and then what the UN or war. And then we start to get to point about, how really, humans are going to fight over resources and the planet is doomed.
People have been building along the Sonoran rivers for thousands of years and they'll probably continue for thousands more.
There's water there to support civilization, Phoenix just grew too big.
Even if you meant c. posadasii (one of the two fungal spores that causes it; c. immitis is the other that is restricted to California) that isn't unique to Arizona but is found in Mexico and South America as well.
> Built in a desert with limited water supplies and expanding rapidly, Phoenix, once called “the world’s least-sustainable city,”
My response is that if you aren't prepared for the A/C to go out during the summer or for your car to break down, then you're living on the edge. It's easy to put yourself in a bad spot.
I think we're okay, so I challenge the notion that were not, but it's something we need pushback on to keep us sharp. There are problems everywhere and it's key that we focus on ours.
I had a chance to move to the SW area a long time ago, I said no thank you, I do not mind the snow. If the heat there hit me, I would probably end up in the ICU.
Now where I am, it does not get that cold in the winter. I think this past winter, the ave temp was about 35 -40 F (2-5C). Decades ago it was common to have a few days with a high of around -10F (-23C). I do not even remember the last time we had temps below 0 (-17C).
And yet, people and companies are still moving to that area. Will be fun times in that area in say 10 years. Glad half the people in the US is doing all they can to increase C02. If you are young and live below the Mason Dixon Line, time to think about moving north.
Make that all of the people, even you.
> Meanwhile, drugs and alcohol were involved in 65% of Phoenix’s heat deaths, merging two public health scourges into one. Among the drugs most commonly contributing to heat deaths were methamphetamines and fentanyl.
Imagine thinking the only reason people opt to live in Arizona over California were lack of housing supply. Not one iota to do with flag colors.
It’s sad to see retirees burning their retirement savings to move to Florida, only to return to civilization when their health fails, or dying early for lack of care.
I can't tell if this is sincere or PhD-level trolling. Bravo.