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Comment by _xnmw | Hacker News Reader

I would summarize it as: you realize you can actually do whatever you want, live where you want, and construct your life however you want as long as you make something other people want.

Another way running a business changes the way I think is the value of time and the ROI on temporary things. Most non-business people would hesitate, for example, to buy proper furnishings for their house or upgrade their tools/workspace if they only plan to stay somewhere temporarily for a few months, but I would do it because of how much more enjoyable and productive those few months will be if I had proper facilities, which may have a far greater ROI than simply saving money for a few months.

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> which may have a far greater ROI than simply saving money for a few months

My business experience taught me the opposite of this, and I've carried it over to my personal life. What I do in both my personal and business money management is to identify the two or three key things that are critical to success and go high-end on those, then do everything else as cheaply as I possibly can.

Thank you for this comment

> as long as you make something other people want.

I would remove that qualifier.

I have plenty of friends living in the wild in Yukon and Alaska who live very happily on <$20k a year.

One friend was bummed she had to work for 8 weeks at a mining camp as a cook. That is the most she has ever worked in her life, and she's in her 50s.

I would argue that living in the wild in the Yukon is hard work. Isn't 8 weeks the most your friend was employed, rather?

> a far greater ROI

sometimes this is self-deluding. You perhaps didnt need those luxury furnishings, when a barebones one would've done the same job. It's an excuse that some people use to justify their splurge.

I think the line between "luxury" and "proper" is the debatable point.

And yes, no doubt some people use that as an excuse to over spend. But that doesn't mean people don't take it to the extreme in the other direction as well.

It really does come down to the numbers. If I can spend $X to take in $5x over the month, you should do that.

> If I can spend $X to take in $5x over the month, you should do that.

indeed, but the point was that the $5x is not known in advance, and in fact, might even be an emphemeral figure.

Buying the right chair and desk for your height is not a luxury, but buying something expensive, when a cheaper version, which would've done the same job, is available, is to me the definition of luxury.

To be fair, whether or not the cheaper version would do the same job is also not known in advance. There's also the fuzzy edges of what it means to "do the same job". All chairs ostensibly "do the same job" of providing you somewhere to sit. But there's variance there.

Just like all turing complete programming languages do "the same job" at some level. But we'd all be more productive in your choice of high level language over any processor-specific assembler.

Then it becomes a matter of asking when does it transition between appropriate and luxury. Which grain of sand makes the pile?

I’m in my late forties and have been battling a terrible back problem for the last 16 months. Sadly, it was caused by my own decision to stick to barebones instead of upgrading decades earlier. The 16 months have been extremely expensive, to a point that I would have had a 1200% ROI even if I had splurged.

I know that one person’s bad luck doesn’t cancel out good rules for financial management. And I agreed completely with you up until 16 months ago. But in retrospect, I would have made different choices.

Alright, you've convinced me to buy the adjustable sitting-standing desk. Thanks hluska.

Thanks for writing and I’m glad you made that choice. Best of health!

Very much worth it. Just be mindful of your wiring setup, I have a mercifully only slightly wonky 4090 connector from having too much fun with my adjustable desk when I got it.

I found adjustable too fiddly. Instead got a quality standing desk and tall chair. No fiddling… sit or stand, good for back.

Used Herman Miller chairs are around $400, the same price point as fancy gamer chairs.

It isn't even splurging, just spending some time looking through Craigslist or Facebook Marketplace.

Everyone reading this: Take care of your back!

Tried Herman Miller. To me it was very uncomfortable and I could feel the mesh and lining. Went for another type of chair that is marketed as ergonomic. It is polyster and has all the support you need, especially for tall people. It's not very soft but extremely good for your back.

Which HM? The Aeron is overhyped, and I hated it whereas I really enjoy the Embody.

Yeah I believe it was the Aeron. Mesh stuff, felt cheap even though the chair was clearly seen as "premium" by most consumer.

From the photos, the Embody looks a LOT better.

'Fancy' gamer chairs are anything but.

They are generally poorly made, have terrible ergonomics, but absolutely excel at being plastered with logos and advertisements.

Especially now, there's warehouses full of them. If you're comfortable bargaining you can even get them cheaper since demand isn't that high. Delivery might be a reach, but they'll often do it for $20-$40 if they have a delivery near you.

I got an office chair that supposedly was $1000USD new.. it was many years used, but I really liked that chair. It had steel construction, swivel and almost no "rocker" tilt, wide base seat almost flat but with a seat cover that was just right.. it was square box'y basically .. shorter answer, do not use a cheap chair really.

I think the difference between “luxury” and not is a red herring here. The real wisdom is to spend enough to get really serviceable versions of the things you use everyday. That doesn’t mean “luxury”, per se. but it does mean if you e.g. spend 6+ a day in a chair at your home (or work) , make sure it’s a good fit for you.

Get a decent mattress and pillows. Replace your pot from college with the handle that falls off. Paint the room you hate the color of. The ROI on such things is huge.

This is way off topic, but ska is my oldest nickname. Hluska is my last name and it’s just a shortened version. It was even one of my usernames back in the day. Ska is such an enduring nickname that anyone who knows me well in person could logically conclude that I’m talking to myself now.

I agree with you (and clearly like your username), but writing to ska is quite amusing.

Thanks for commenting and I hope you have an excellent day! :)

Nice to meet another "ska". It's derived from my name also, and I've used it as a login and more for ages. Usually when people comment on it they assume I'm a big fan of the music style :)

I don’t know extent of your injuries, but weight exercises fixed back pain for me. You can’t seat in the good posture if there are no muscles to hold it.

This was also my initial reaction: don't buy an expensive chair; buy a squat rack, barbell, and plates. ROI is extremely high. Squats and deadlifts will do much more for your posture and long term back health than sitting in a different chair and still never using your back.

My wife used to wear a wrist brace for years until she started benching. Now she never gets pain. Lifting is also one of the safest sports there is. Highly recommend it for health, especially among the nerdy crowd who may not be inclined to try it; building muscle doesn't reduce nerd cred.

I'd say self-deluding that you're being financially "smart" by ruining your body hunched over a folding chair and $20 ikea table for 12 hours a day is a far more common problem, especially on HN.

Let's hope your customers don't have that same "anything but the cheapest option is luxury" mindset.

It sounds like OP's ROI calculator and yours are different.

Would you think that saving ~5K on property sale taxes in 2 years is not worth it if not saving and selling now would upgrade their tools/workspace?

Or you could do all those things by doing something that people pay you to stop. I think is kind of language is dangerous any American adult knows this isn’t really true because most people have choices because they have money and money gets you more money. This is free speech.

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