Good lord. As I recall, a big part of growing up was spending time and doing things my parents didn’t want me to do. The idea of them tracking me is super creepy, as is tracking one’s spouse for that matter.
“huh, I guess they went to get some boba, we’ll just go get dinner without them”
on the flip side, I would have killed to know where the hell my parents were when they didn’t show up for 30+ minutes after school, pool, or baseball practice.
I don't have kids, so of course my opinion is irrelevant. But I do remember decently well what it was like to be a teenager in the 90s. I was a "good kid" and didn't get up to much that my parents didn't want me to do, but a) I did do some things my parents didn't want me to do, things that they would figure out real-time if they'd been able to track me, and b) despite me doing things they didn't want me to do, everything turned out fine. The idea that I wouldn't have been able to do those things, and the feeling of being trapped and constantly surveilled... that's gross.
And... you mention spouse, too? I would never let my spouse track me 24/7, and would never ask her or expect her to allow me to track her. To me, that would be creepy and an invasion of privacy. I get that some people do this (and know some of them), but I just think it's weird.
She doesn't share her location because she thinks it's creepy and I'm okay with that too.
People are different, and that's okay.
So the kids need to figure out that in order to do this kind of thing they need to attach their watch to some less-cool kid's wrist that stays at school while they do the fun things. At least that less-cool kid hopefully gets some kind of reimbursement for offering that service.
They don’t have to sit at school, and they can wander around, without telling me — but if there is a serious trouble then it’s in everyone’s interest to have a up to date location data.
Are you kidding me? I remember being a teenager in the 90s. I had a great relationship with my parents (not perfect, of course, but who does?), and I absolutely would not have wanted them to have my exact location on-demand. I didn't get up to all that much that they didn't want me to do, but being tracked would mean I would not have done those things, and would have missed out on valuable experiences, because I would have been afraid that they'd randomly check up on me when I was in a place I wasn't supposed to be. (And no, I'm not talking about drinking or drugs or anything like that.)
If they want to do something that they don't want me to know, they can just turn off location sharing, or leave their watch at home.
For me spause tracking was mostly for knowing when to go out of our apartment building to help her carry groceries from the car when she arrives.
Google doesn't need to know who I am to track me, Google cannot lock me up in my room, Google cannot gaslight/manipulate/abuse me based on where I went today
And even in the context of abusive relationships, sometimes the more tools the abuser has, the more secure they feel in their abuse, the less impactful is their abuse on daily lives of the abused. The abusers get worse when they feel like they are loosing control.
If I finally agree to something after being nagged interminably - have I consented, or have I just given in?
At the other end of the spectrum, if someone asks for something which doesn't particularly suit my purposes, but I agree to it as it seems fair enough - is that consent?
One situation seems like it is, the other one probably not. But where is the line? To me, consent seems like a vaguely letter-of-the-law, CYA type of word.
I feel like as a teen I would consent to being tracked by my parents but that doesn't mean it would be a good idea. It all depends on intent and parent-child relationship in the first place (looking back I didn't have a great one :shrug:)
The difference is you can leave your spouse, an option not really realistic for a child.
Isn't that how the vast majority of the net worth of NH readers was generated?
Work for one of the FANGS, a social media platform, in ad tech, in big data (anything with humans) or any company that monetises through a) advertising or b) selling user data.
I am sure there are some people who work in financial services as well but they are probably considered to have lower moral standards.
But kids don't get to consent to this. Their parents decide for them, regardless of what they do or don't want. I don't think kids should be forced to submit to 24/7 tracking, regardless of the intent behind it.
a big part of parenting is making sure your kid actually is at school, or monitoring more closely a child that has done improper things.
Quite sure that is the schools job. At least where I live the schools tend to assume several of the rights and responsibilities that normally fall on the parents.
> or monitoring more closely a child that has done improper things.
Do I want to know what you fucked up in your childhood that you assume your kids need constant monitoring to prevent a repeat?
Yes. The school is responsible for their safety and whereabouts. US K-12 public schools, if the child is missing from school, parents are contacted immediately. Teachers are responsible for attendance. All this is accomplished without device tracking. Federal law explicitly defines the school's responsibilities with regard to privacy rights of children in school. If parents wish to contact their child during school hours, they are asked to call the school, and school personnel will contact the child.
Device use is an enormous problem in schools. Talk to any teacher / admin: they will tell you allowing devices into schools has been a disaster.
The US is definitely the world, and I am definitely in that world, and the people who make that assumption are definitely super smart all around.
whoops, you got me - I live where you live too so your argument is like really super good.
>> or monitoring more closely a child that has done improper things.
>Do I want to know what you fucked up in your childhood that you assume your kids need constant monitoring to prevent a repeat?
Do I want to know what was done to you in your childhood that you uh, whatever that was?
on edit: fixed grammar
Also - when my daughter hacks all of her ex-boyfriend's social media accounts, should I monitor her activities by going and talking to the snooping neighbors?
(but I 100% agree with you, trust is not achieved with panopticon control)
Indeed, it is actually eroded.
I know we're not supposed to assume reading comprehension problems here, so I just have to assume that your dealing with it when they stray does not have any component of monitoring in it? Because I said "or monitoring more closely a child that has done improper things." and everyone seems to think that you shouldn't monitor someone that has done improper things - I really don't get it?
Seems like apathy, oh your kid is sneaking out with other kids to drink, well give them a talking to and then whatever you do, don't monitor them!
Oh your kid got a sugar daddy on Roblox, hmm, well go talk to the neighbors next door, the 1980s neighbor network was the best way to ever keep track of your kids for every kid that didn't grow up in the 1980s.
Half of the commentators here seem to think I'm living in the 80s, and the other half seem to think I'm living in Kansas, but everyone is in agreement on one thing which is that I should definitely behave myself to their model of raising kids in 1980s Kansas.