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Comment by mrlongroots | Hacker News Reader

I swore to never buy Samsung after an ordeal with their warranty repair. Some of the data pins on its USB port wore out, so my Android Auto and fast charging became extremely flaky. It was still under warranty so I took it to their authorized repair centres. They did not have a fast charger and showed me that the standard charging was working, and refused to admit a problem. Finally I mailed it to Samsung, and they said that the display needed to be replaced because of some water damage (it worked perfectly fine!) as well.

Finally I got some local electronics repair guy to just solder a new USB port onto the circuit board and that fixed everything. But never buying their phones again.

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I stopped buying anything Samsung for essentially the same reason. I was overseas and my S7 switched off and wouldn't turn back on. I walked into the flagship store and was immediately turned away because I didn't purchase it in that country.

I had a different experience, I bought a S21U overseas. While in UK the screen wouldn't turn on while the phone was on. I went to Samsung KX in London and a day later I had my S21 with a new screen and battery for no cost.

I think it's worth comparing to Apple here. I bought an iPhone from Amazon in UK and the screen developed a defect. Walked into an Apple Store after 19 months, without AppleCare and they gave me a new phone and migrated all the stuff over for me right there and then.

Not sure if they're that good now but I sure hope they are.

The UK has strong consumer warranty laws (extending to several years), and that rather than Apple's kindness of heart could be the reason. Thank the famous European red tape!

It’s probably a mix. I’ve had lots of stuff incl AirPods fixed for free well beyond warranty multiple times (I think because Apple knew they were prone to a defect causing cracking) and an Apple phone case replaced that others would probably say is “normal wear and tear” but legitimately degraded quicker than it should have etc. Apple online chat is also awesome!

Actually when I got my iPhone 13 Pro they said they said keep the receipt for the case in case it falls to bits so they can replace it free. YMMV.

19 months is less than the 24 month minimum warranty for consumers across the EU (which used to include the UK).

There is no such thing anywhere in the EU, it's a very common misconception. What there is is a 24 month(actually 6 years in some cases) seller's responsibility for the product against manufacturing defects and being "not as described"(which can include lack of described performance too). What the law also says is that within the first 6 months(12 in the EU) any defect is automatically presumed to be a manufacturing fault and the seller has to rectify it free of charge. After that time the seller is also responsible, but you as the buyer have to prove that the defect happened because of a manufacturing problem. If your macbook stops working 23 months after purchase the seller doesn't have to fix it unless you can prove that it's because of a manufacturing problem.

For all practical purposes it works like a warranty though.

I just checked my local amazon clone, and for a mac mini the warranty is listed as 24 months for consumers and 12 months for companies.

There is no official Apple presence in Romania so I can't check their official position.

There’s a difference between a guarantee and warranty. You only have a guarantee for the first 12 months. The next 12, you have a warranty. It’s almost Impossible to prove a warranty.

I’m in Europe in a country where it works like this (not sure about the exact numbers). Last time I exercised my consumer rights was when the bottom glass fell off my Samsung smartwatch. I handed it over to the seller literally one day before the end of the 24 month period. There were some remarks about it being almost too late, but I got it repaired for free. I’ve never had a seller dispute my warranty claim at any point of the two years. I’ve never had to prove anything.

Well, I guess you were lucky - legally the seller didn't have to repair it unless you proved that the glass fell off due to a manufacturing defect - just because they don't have to do it doesn't mean they won't(it's less hassle and I guess you left a happy customer not one that will go and write them a bad review).

Where I am I don't have to care about that, it seems.

In some places it is a minimum you describe and in other cases (a percentage of) the expected life of the product. Washing machines have different lifespans than phone for instance. Here we only have the 12 months of proof by seller/manufacturer and then it is the reasonable lifespan of the product.

Apple has a long history of being generous with repairs, nothing to do with the EU. Friend of mine, here in the US, got an entirely new laptop when his failed just out of warranty. Goodwill repair. And because they didn't have the old laptop available as a refurb, he got the current equivalent -- which was actually a pretty substantial upgrade.

It's hit or miss. My wife had keys failing under the butterfly keyboard replacement program, and the Apple Store tried to charge her to fix it. Apparently the technician who examined it "didn't know" about the warranty extension program.

How do you have a major repair program covering every laptop sold in the last 5 years and the technician doesn't know about it?

I’ve had similar incidents happen with Apple and other premium things, nowhere near Europe. It’s market forces that created an upmarket company with stuff like this as part of its identity. Thank goodness for global capitalism.

Same here. I have Apple iPhone 14 Pro Max with AppleCare+ which I broke during a trip to US (I'm in Canada). They were able to swap it with replacement at the Apple store in LA without any hassle. Too bad the SIM Card was also busted though :(

You swore to never buy Samsung. I swore to never buy a pixel again. My gf swore to never buy an apple again.

I'm using a Motorola to type this and I wonder when it'll let me down in unforseen ways.

I've bought nothing but mid-range Nokias and Motorolas for the past 10 years or so and they've been great. Always stock or near stock android and security updates for 3+ years.

I have a habit of doing stupid things with my phones (mostly accidentally submerging them in seawater) and haven't attempted fixing them after that though.

I've been using LineageOS for years, and recently got a Motorola G 5G 2024 as a temporary phone while I addressed some issues with my main phone. I was blown away by the amount of custom bloatware on the thing. It nagged me at least 30 times about various features it wanted to introduce me to. If that's "near stock", then I'm staying away.

That's a shame to hear. Can that be right?

I diverted recently, but I used budget Moto G's for a decade and couldn't have been happier with the stock OS.

Maybe they finally succombed in 2024.

I think it was whenever they stopped giving the Moto G series numbers (G5, G7, etc), and just started making them "Moto G (Year)". Official LineageOS support has gotten worse since then, but I don't know if it's because they can't find maintainers or what.

I’m concerned that you’ll soon run out of otherwise reputable phone manufacturers.

I sport an iPhone, but sometimes I think it’s a shame Microsoft so deeply lost focus on and then abandoned mobile.

>I swore to never buy a pixel again.

The only reason I can think of to buy pixels is to run GrapheneOS. From that perspective, I am somewhat difficult to disappoint.

I mean, it's a phone, and it's not samsung. That's a reason, right? Why not buy a pixel?

The 4xl had a totally faulty battery ribbon. I had to replace the battery yearly, which was semi ok because of cheap Amazon parts. Then eventually the motherboard freaked out and it just died. But I guess at least it lasted 3.5 years.

Just buy an Ulefone or Doogee for $200, shock, water and kid-proof.

If it breaks two years later, well it was just $8/mo.

An update bricked my Ulephone after 3 months. Not going there again.

My next phone will be a Fairphone.

I've had Fairphone 3 for a few years. The camera isn't fancy but I don't care. The original battery died at some point. Replacing it was very easy; no tool needed. Just like it was in the '90s with most phones. The repairability promise is kept, IMO. The only issue I had with this phone is that after some system update the fingerprint sensor was regarded as not meeting some security level and stopped being usable by sensitive apps (banking).

FYI the fingerprint sensor problem has since been fixed and I can now use it again without trouble for banking apps and the like. (Although I'm on a Fairphone 3+) Still holding up fairly well in 2024, even if it's a bit slow at times.

Writing this from my Nothing Phone.

The list of companies I wouldn't trust ever again is just to long. My Xiaomi was literally bricked trough an official update.

I hated my 2021 Edge+ with such a burning fury that I'm typing this on my old OnePlus 9 (with LineageOS, which I couldn't do on the moto). I can't remember all the reasons (there were many), but stability was one of them.

The OnePlus 9 is supposedly the last good phone from them, so I'm thinking of using my wife's Pixel with a re-locked ROM once she upgrades. Pixels, for all their flaws, have historically been the most consistent for me (apart from OnePlus).

I'm on a OnePlus 11 (upgraded from a OnePlus 6T) and it's great. My only issue is that there's a small selection of cases for it, especially if you want one that's magsafe compatible.

Wait, what do you mean magsafe? I have a oneplus 11 5g and I didn't even think this phone had wireless charging.

I purchased an olixar wireless adapter and an olixar sentinel case, they work well but the adapter takes up my USB C so I always have to remove the case, unplug, and put it back on.

Magsafe is used for things other than wireless charging. Tons of accessories that mount to the magsafe "ring"

Soon we will all be making our own phones from raspberries pi or other single board computers and hacked together parts (cell network dongles and whatnot). They will break more often but at least we will only have to ban one component manufacturer at a time.

Although my current phone is an iPhone (a 12 mini) I had used Motorola "Moto G" phones prior to that and never had any issues when them other than Android updates eventually ending despite the phone being physically in working order.

The iPhone was a gift, and I still prefer the Android UX but so far it's had no issues either.

I'll probably go back to Android next time I need a phone; all the iPhones except the SE are too big for my taste. But it's hard to find a small Android phone from a reputable manufacturer as well.

> other than Android updates eventually ending despite the phone being physically in working order.

That is when you put LineageOS [1] on the phone and never look back. A clean Android experience with OTA updates - I still get these on a Samsung SIIIneo from 2014 - so I'd suggest pulling that 'old' phone out of the drawer and giving it a try as you have nothing to loose.

[1] https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/#motorola

Motorola has been a good long-term value for me, but in 2 out of 3 the charging port has gone bad or close to bad eventually. If spending $500 a year on phones didn't morally offend me I'd just buy Apple or Samsung and dispose of them when they go bad.

Tip: use magnetic ports/cables on your USB devices. Moved to these after that happened to me years ago and love them - quick and easy to connect/disconnect, and less worry about tripping over the charge cord flinging the device across the room.

The only disadvantage is I haven't found any that support high amp/watt charging.

There's a good reason they don't support high amp/watt charging.

https://old.reddit.com/r/UsbCHardware/comments/motlhn/magnet...

Wasn't there an issue that with magnetic cables the ground pins aren't the first pins connected / disconnected?

(Edit -- autoexec had the same memory of the same thread as I did)

I'm thankful for the New Jersey division of consumer affairs that sued Samsung for faulty home appliances. I'll never buy Samsung anything except nvme drives.

Their SSDs have suffered from prominent firmware bugs.

I have a Samsung TV that is now more than 15 years old. And it still works ok.

11.5 years for me. Their products are generally solid, but I'm not surprised their service policies are crap. Whose policies aren't consumer-unfriendly crap these days?

Get an iPhone, swallow your pride and just get one.

Anecdotes work both ways. Apple recently locked and forced a reset of Apple ID accounts for no reason.[0] This happened to my elderly mother at an incredibly inconvenient time, making her phone completely unusable, and the phone was set up for her by my elderly father, who had had strokes since then, and couldn't remember the account password, and had lost access to the email address. I spent hours on the phone begging Apple to help, and they could do nothing but direct me toward recovery Web pages that had long, mandatory waiting periods. It took weeks for my mom's phone to no longer be a useless brick, and it very nearly didn't work (they already denied one request without explanation). Even sending them proof of purchase from the mobile carrier, as they demanded, was rejected. All in the name of "protecting" the user.

I provided the link to the Forbes article to multiple representatives, including a senior advisor. None of them admitted to knowing anything about it, even a week later. It was reported on various Apple news sites as well.

So, no, I cannot in good conscience recommend buying an Apple device. Even if you pay for it, it effectively does not belong to you, and Apple may suddenly disable it at any time, for any reason, without warning.

0: https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveywinder/2024/04/28/apple-id...

Morale of the story: Don't use face/fingerprint unlock. Sooner or later you/they will need to use the password anyway.

Wouldn’t face or fingerprint be more likely to be useable when memory issues strike (like they did for the OP)?

The device in question had no locking enabled of any kind. The associated Apple ID account was locked by Apple without warning, and so the phone itself was locked for any use other than emergency calls.

> All in the name of "protecting" the user.

It’s a bit of a bind though isn’t it? If they loosen their rules, someone will exploit it. Where is the balance?

Complying with the user preferences would be a good one.

My elderly dad doesn't use his iPhone for anything sensitive and it is not even password protected. If that phone gets lost I will replace it. He doesn't need his apple ID to be "protected" by Apple this way.

It seems like they still haven’t said what happened. I was in a restaurant at the time and first I knew was my Apple Pay wouldn’t work. Awkward is an understatement… thankfully I just happened to have my wallet on me that time, I don’t always though!

They now have a new way to recover lost passwords, is called “recovery contacts” and allows that contact to recover your mothers phone

AFAICT, this feature requires the recovery contact to also use an Apple device, which does not help us. It seems like another way to try to lock users into using Apple.

Its interesting to me to think that when Steve Jobs was still around, the iPhone was always on the cutting edge of design and tech features. You constantly heard the tech media saying how far ahead Apple was of its competitors in terms of features and camera specs.

Once Jobs passed and Tim Cook took over, everything changed. Now they're years behind other companies in terms of features and specs. It took them years to have wireless charging, even longer to have simple widgets - stuff Android phones had as standard features for years.

I've stayed away from them for the reasons you pointed out and the fact they just seem so far behind, even on features that have become standard on every other manufacturers handsets. Now its painted as "Apple sees what other companies are doing. They sit and wait and let other companies vet features and tech before integrating them into their handsets - its a very smart approach."

Copy and paste on iPhones, anyone?

Pride? It's a just a phone.

Man, the cult-like aspect of Apple is such a turn off...

It’s the opposite :-) the poster said “swallow your pride” … the cult-like aspect of Apple haters is such a turn off

Is English not your first language? "Swallow your pride" means giving up the pride.

> Man, the cult-like aspect of Apple is such a turn off...

It does not sound like this was intentionally ironic, but it works.

> Is English not your first language? "Swallow your pride" means giving up the pride.

To me, it read like GP is criticising as cult-like the very suggestion of pride being the motivation behind buying or not buying a particular phone.

Exactly correct, hence the "it's just a phone". English is my fourth language and I speak/understand it just fine, thanks.

Apple was for a looong time known to not honor Norwegian consumer protection laws. They've gotten better, but they've been worst in class here for a decade. Edit: two decades. Found this article from 2006 about how they refused to repair ipods after a year, even shops selling Apple stuff used to have problems because they had to fix things at a loss themselves https://www.vg.no/forbruker/teknologi/i/8300w/apple-og-forbr...

I actually believe that's why Apple adoption was fairly slow compared to the hype I was reading about in other countries. No official Apple stores, and most electronic chains didn't want to touch them.

Yeah with AppleCare+ both of these people would have walked out with a working phone.

How is paying extra a solution to the problem of having to pay to get their phone fixed? Insurances exists for other brands as well (or through the store you buy from).

AppleCare is just seamless and works well though.

In terms of warranty I’ve walked into Apple stores and had stuff just replaced our fixed in store once they look up the SN

Top consumerism right here: being proud of a purchase.

I don't know who started this, I only remember that one could be proud of an achievement or of making something. Being proud of purchasing something; it just sounds as impossible as drinking space shuttles.

Nobody was talking about "being proud of purchasing something". What you replied to was an allusion to some people being proud of refusing to buy an Apple product.

The phrase "swallow your pride" is literally a call to abandon pride as a motivating factor.

I never mentioned Apple. Sure, proud of _not_ purchasing is another level of this, and then _accusing_ someone of being proud to (not) purchase rounds the circle I guess.

It's amazing.

I never said that you mentioned Apple.

You Android users know what I mean

Apple phones are too large. Not sure what I'll do when my 12 mini reaches eol, I guess an SE but feels like a step back.

Apple does plenty of anti-consumer stuff too. My last Apple product is my ipod nano. I swore off them after they shipped a firmware update specifically closing the loophole that allowed me to manage the song library without itunes. I have a whole separate rant about itunes. I replaced it with a sandisk player for a third of the price. Surprisingly, it worked much more smoothly, had fewer annoyances, and had an FM radio.

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