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> I'm really surprised the iPad Pro isn't the thing people want: a tablet-computer.

Because people also want a faster horse, not a car.

The iPad has been developing its own identity and language as a product category. Yes, it takes a while to iterate on the features. But Apple clearly sees the iPad as a chance to develop a language for how to interact with a tabula rasa. The easy thing would be to just slap a desktop OS on it. How do we get any better as a species if we do that? The iPad does need something, yes. It does not need a desktop OS.

Do any better as a species? Jesus fucking christ get a grip.

> How do we get any better as a species if we do that?

By providing people what they want and incentivizing businesses to create something superior to it so that the demand for the prior solution goes away?

If the new solution isn't competitive with the old one then we arguably aren't improving as a species anyways.

Could you steel man what the iPad identity is supposed to be?

It feels like mixing idioms of a production (desktop) and a consumption device (mobile) and flailing at both. Not targeting a unique niche.

How is mobile a “consumption” device?

At least the way Apple treats it, mobile operating systems are where user capabilities go to die.

You know all the professional software, on your desktop? Avid Pro Tools, Ableton Live, Adobe Premiere, Blender, that stuff? It doesn't run on iPad; not just because the developers are stingy and don't want to make a native version, but because the iPad is fundamentally limited in what it's software can provide relative to Mac. On top of that, you cannot distribute software yourself which relegates you exclusively to using Apple's provided runtime and storefront. It's an insular system that prevents new and exciting features or experiences from getting made without Apple's express approval and profit.

Or look at games. The iPad should be giving the Steam Deck a run for it's money; you've got a great GPU, strong single-core CPU performance and a big punchy display up front. Instead of playing Fallout: New Vegas (like any respectable person should be able to do in 2024), you're replaying Monument Valley and Angry Birds HD for the billionth time. Or maybe you just get frustrated trying to set up Delta or UTM and go watch House of Cards in resigned frustration.

The Mac is headed the same way, but at least there's a core audience of vocal whistleblowers pushing back against pointless software limitations. Apple is desperate to crush any methods of content creation or consumption that does not directly benefit them. To that end they have avoided adding professional features to their mobile devices to reinforce the content consumption loop and artificially inflate demand for the Mac.

I agree that a lot of this is true while disagreeing that it renders mobile a consumption platform. It’s outstanding for many productive tasks that “real” computers are either much worse at or no good for at all. Being in a tiny long-battery-life package with tons of sensors and radios opens up a lot of possibilities, many of which are in fact realized by the platform, even if it’s not a very good platform for writing custom programs on the same device. It’s especially great when you need the real world and computing to interact, “in the field” as it were.

I’d further agree that mobile’s used for far more consumption (or, presenting [multi-]media) than PCs! But I think that has more to do with PCs being a lot worse at those tasks than mobile devices (generally speaking), than mobile only being good for that.

I think there’s only a little overlap between the productive tasks real computers are helpful for, and what mobile’s good for, and that mobile also happens to be better for presenting media in most cases.

> The Mac is headed the same way

I’ve been reading this stated as fact since like 2012 (I became a Mac user—in addition to Linux and Windows, which I still use for some things, especially Linux, in 2010 or 2011). I’ve seen no sign of it.

> To that end they have avoided adding professional features to their mobile devices to reinforce the content consumption loop and artificially inflate demand for the Mac.

I do believe that’s some of it, but I also think a lot of the features certain types of professional want them to add are absent for the good reason that few people want them and they’d likely harm ux or security. Not all such features! But probably some.

> Instead of playing Fallout: New Vegas (like any respectable person should be able to do in 2024)

Well that’s just true, yes.

> Or maybe you just get frustrated trying to set up Delta

It’s one of the easiest emulators-with-game-library I’ve ever set up :-) At least they do allow emulators now. Emulating a whole Nintendo DS is lighter on battery and faster to resume than nearly all the native iOS games in the App Store, which is just an absurd situation. Better overall game library, too.

Well we may have to agree to disagree. I abandoned Apple's ecosystem (Mac included) because the axe fell and my apps broke. First it was the OpenGL depreciations, which were annoying but manageable. Then 32-bit libraries quit loading and more than half of the Mac apps I paid for stopped working. Apple's advice to me was to pester the developers, and the developer's advice to me was to pound sand.

> It’s especially great when you need the real world and computing to interact, “in the field” as it were.

I agree in a certain respect. Parallel to this statement though, I also see another two things as true:

- Anything an iPad can do, a Mac can do better.

- Many things a Mac can do, an iPad can't at all.

Adding software functionality to the iPad would not detract from the few areas it excels in today. It is absolutely and entirely undeniable that the iPad's software capabilities pale in comparison to what the hardware can do. Apple has no reason not to give people what they want; except for the fact that it might stop people from buying Macs. Therefore they create an artificial (and entirely unnecessary) segmentation scheme that drives more people away than it attracts.

The apologism for Apple's blatantly anti-consumer practice is baffling. Do we just... pretend like Apple doesn't break things on a constant basis for the express purpose of pushing proprietary shitware? Should we smile and pretend like nobody misses OpenGL or wants Vulkan support? They're the largest company in the world by now, I should hope they've learned how to share their damn toys.

You know all the professional software, on your desktop?

My daughter has access to a computer with many of those programs if she wants to use them. I've showed them to her and what you can do with them, and offered to help her learn if she wants. She still does all her video, graphics and image editing on her phone or an iPad, because she genuinely prefers it. In her mind the only purpose of a desktop computer is gaming.

The Problem is though, iPadOS is basically iOS, there isn't much difference. So it's basically a phone with a bigger screen.

I prefer desktop, if only for one reason- no app store lock-in. iPadOS will always be second fiddle until the app gatekeeping comes down.

It is not yet a glofiried ssh machine, so that is an 80% no when it comes to work hardware for me. But give me a docking station with my homemade keyboard, fancy monitor, mike, and headphones, and let me use the GNU toolchain locally to get a decent terminal and Emacs and I would be a happy camper. The macbooks managed to hit those points, but the iPad feels totally disconnected from this type of glorified terminal mentality… unfortunately.

> It is not yet a glofiried ssh machine

I'm saying that my macbook air is a glorified ssh machine and word processing machine.

But clearly it would be better to walk around with a tablet (with detachable keyboard) as a glorified ssh and word processing/slide making machine than a macbook.

I want to be able to do some minimal work, walk around with my device and pull up slides (that I can fucking markup with my pencil -- not a glorified pointer), pull up docs, and etc because even though I'm mostly living in the cli I still have to show and communicate my work with others.

Fully agreed.

> why don't I have a device that I can basically run MacOS on and have a detachable keyboard

I think the answer is market cannibalization. Apple would much rather sell you both an iPad and a MacBook Pro rather than just an iPad.

They should just unlock the iPad's virtualization capabilities. That would let power users run a desktop OS without them really needing to support it.

Also I don't particularly care how any of the touch stuff works in a hypothetical desktop mode as long as I can hook it up to external display with KB+mouse.

They can hide the option in Accessibility settings for those who speak CLI.

haha imagine the manufactured outrage when "developer tools access" or "CLI access" is hidden under _Accessibility_

(It's a pretty clever idea though)

this … vftools is great on a mac … or even just support the mac Docker app

> "Why did it take so long for the fucking iPad to have a natively supported app to markup PDFs. And why is it still terrible? Isn't that one of the most common use cases? I swear, tablet makers don't seem to actually understand how people use tablets"

Because this is how Apple nudges/forces people to spend money on a 3th-party app for a $xx/month subscription (of which even Apple gets 30%), obviously...

If they made a Mini Pro, I'd be lining up for one. I want a sleek, high end 8" or less tablet that is top tier. I guess the last one that matched that spec was the Nvidia Shield, and sadly nobody else made one as insanely brilliant as that tablet.

because the form factor of a laptop is better for typing. detachable key boards are awkward to carry and set up.

also lots of computer tasks require very precise clicks that mice do better with. touchscreens really need another interface and the keyboard only solves some of the issues. a solution here is to carry a stylus..

but if you’re walking around with a ipad, a key board, and a stylus, the laptop is simpler

> because the form factor of a laptop is better for typing. detachable key boards are awkward to carry and set up.

I think you miss the setup. The keyboard is for being on the go. If I'm at a desk, I'm using my mechanical keyboard, not my shitty laptop one. Yeah, macs are better than most, but a laptop keyboard is still a laptop keyboard.