Next step in the Chrome OS journey | Hacker News Reader

Next step in the Chrome OS journey

googleblog.blogspot.com

60 pointscleverjake49 comments

The Google Chromebook is an interesting product to watch. I've been using them since the Cr-48 days. In fact, two Chromebook laptops were in service in our household until just a few weeks ago when the Samsung Chromebook broke (although I hope to repair it soon).

These laptops sit next to our couch in a stack as a set of floater laptops we use for random surfing. If any of us are just looking for a quick bite of information, we generally pull out the Chromebook rather than walking over to the Macbook that sits on our kitchen counter. The Chromebook is also great for our son to use when building LEGO from PDF instructions.

Browsing is far better on the Chromebook than it is on any Android or Apple device I've used, hands down. I find the browsing experience to be frustrating on an iPad or my Galaxy 10", while the Chromebook experience is flawless. The device is basically ready-to-use for browsing as soon as you lift the lid, in contrast to the fair amount of time it takes to get logged into the Macbook (especially if another user has a few applications open in their session).

The hardware itself in the early models was slightly underpowered, but that doesn't really seem to matter much unless you're playing a particularly intensive Flash video or HTML5 game. Scrolling is fairly slow on complex sites like Google+ as well. For what we use it for, the hardware is pretty decent. The touchpads have also been hit-and-miss in the early models.

What makes these devices a hard sell is the price point. The cheapest Chromebook experience you can get today is the Acer (@ $300). Considering the fact that you are buying a piece of hardware that effectively does less than a laptop, I would find it hard to justify spending that amount if I were looking at hardware today. Even though I prefer to use the Chromebook when surfing over the tablets or the full laptop, I feel like the cost is just too much for a single-purpose device like this.

For Chromebooks to really take off in the home market, I think that a device with the equivalent power to the Samsung Chromebook 5 needs to be on the market at a $199 price point. I could see myself buying them at that price. I don't see the Chromebox being popular in households ever - I believe that we'll see the decline of the non-portable computer going forward at home. Alternatively, if we saw some sort of Android hybrid integration with the Chromebook, I think that this could radically change the equation and add significant perceived value to the device.

Now, if I were running a business where a large subset of employees could get by with just web access, I would definitely consider rolling these out. The Chromebox looks like it could be a real game changer for business.

> Browsing is far better on the Chromebook than it is on any Android or Apple device I've used, hands down. The device is basically ready-to-use for browsing as soon as you lift the lid, in contrast to the fair amount of time it takes to get logged into the Macbook (especially if another user has a few applications open in their session).

FWIW, this is not a property of the ChromeBook, but a property of how you choose to use it (which may in turn be a property of its relative cost if anything). My 11" MacBook Air runs two apps (Chrome and iTerm) and I do not leave it locked or logged out. At worst I have to apple-tab to Chrome from iTerm once I open it before I can use it to browse.

Apologies, that was a typo on my part - I should have said "iOS device" rather than "Apple device", indicating that the browsing experience was as good as on a desktop.

Interesting... I was looking at the word "Macbook".

I originally thought that chrome OS was a ridiculous idea , but the more I think about the more I see this as being what more traditional desktop/laptop systems will look like in a few years time.

The key here I think is an operating system UI built on the understanding that modern applications have both client and server components that are equally important and need to blend together seamlessly.

For example , about 50% of the applications I use are on the web/internet yet my browser is just an application like any other on my launch bar.

What seems to be needed is a retail channel that can explain what/why and why of Chrome book? Something like Samsungs Galaxy S3 Popups stores. Google's staff at the Chrome OS booths in Aiports did a great job of this but you couldn't purchase a Chromebook there.

I don't understand what crosses a company's mind when they make a booth where they explain a product but don't allow you to buy it. Nintendo took over a good part of the third (?) floor of the mall here in SF last Christmas where you could play the new 3DS and a bunch of their latest titles (all released). I asked to purchase one and they then proceeded to think out loud about the closest gamestop where I "might" find it -- because this booth was for demos only, not for actually buying anything.

It's because you need to secure business license to sell.

Nintendo can't secure a business license?

If some no-name iPhone case stand can secure this at the mall, then surely Nintendo can too? Why go through the outrageous cost of setting up an elaborate "Nintendo Winter World" or whatever they called it -- and stop just short of being able to make any actual sales?

The real problem is Nintendo's retail partners will get upset.

At that point just setting up a kiosk can either lead to "we just won't do sales" or spirals into "lets get our partners involved too" which gives you a kiosk designed by committee.

So what? This is like a burger company giving out free samples on the street and then telling people that there are three stores they can go to in the area, but they're not sure if any of them have anything in stock.

Getting that business license is a small cost compared to getting customers engaged and then pushing them away.

There is such a thing in London, a store within a store that is presumably a trial setup. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/google/8800002/Worlds-...

Is Chrome OS a stepping stone from Android as a 'stretched-out' OS, or more in the way of Android trying transitioning bigger screen formats, such as: http://www.motorola.com/Consumers/US-EN/Consumer-Product-and... I know they're obvious differences, but I'm focusing in the similarities...does anyone see my point? Would love to know other's opinions.

I don't know, but why Google and Asus don't release a Transformer that dual boots Android and Chrome OS is beyond me. Yes, Flash already has ARM ports working anyway.

They are working on an arm port for an unnamed device but it seems like it's still under heavy development. One reason you likely won't see something like the transformer running chromeos is their upstream first policy, which suggests that they won't ship chrome on devices that don't have their driver base included in the base linux kernel. There are exceptions, but I get the feeling they aren't interested in core drivers like graphics being one of them.

Ugh. That makes an unfortunate amount of sense, I hadn't even thought through the embedded device drivers problem. Extremely frustrating across devices and OSes. :[

To hazard a guess: the higher-ups at Google think (know?) that the future lies in the open web. Android is a stopgap to compete in the current mobile environment, but I'm hoping ChromeOS displaces Android entirely in the next 3-5 years. WebOS started down that path, and Mozilla is really doing it right with B2G. I think Google realizes the same.

This transition can't happen suddenly. Google may also be waiting for the rest of the mom-and-pop web to catch up with the capabilities of native apps (via WebRTC, WebGL, etc) without having to depend so much on extensions, NaCl plugins and the like. At that point, ChromeOS will "just work" for rich applications alongside the rest of the web, which neatly sidesteps any fragmentation issues.

I dunno about the Chromebox. I can't see many of my friends setting up a monitor, mouse and keyboard for a computer that only runs Chrome OS.

It's interesting, though.

I can see it being perfect for my parents who use Facebook, email, and write documents.

Also, I could be great for schools for the same reason or for some office workers that just need email and Google Docs.

I think this fits with that other item on Hacker News today about targeting the right user. In this case, for a non power user, this has great potential.

I think both Chromebooks and Chromeboxes make sense for libraries, too. They don't need people to install who knows what on their PC's (although there are some tools to prevent that), and this should be a lot safer.

Friends, no. Workplace IT, yes.

More interesting if it gets integrated with GoogleTV, or (less likely) a TiVo.

What's really curious is that in a way it's up against Raspberry Pi, but literally an order of magnitude more expensive. Obviously it's more powerful, but . . .

They really need to get the cost of the Chrome devices way down from where they are.

The Raspberry Pi is pretty neat but good luck using it as a general purpose HTML5-display box. Way too slow for that.

I agree that the cost of Chrome devices needs to be lower, but they need to be priced closer to midrange Android tablets (~250-300$) than Raspberry Pis.

It does have an h264 chip which might make HTML5 video usable.

RPi is good for video, but I think he meant overall browsing performance. RPi will be pretty slow at that.

Yes, I think aiming for RPi equivalence would be extreme!

That said, it would be curious to see what kind of processor ends up being optimal for HTML5 content. It's not completely inconceivable that architectures will end up being tuned for JS execution.

Chromebox/book is at the opposite end of the spectrum from Raspberry PI though in terms of who it's targeting and the problem it's solving.

I'd love if my SaaS clients would use a Chromebox so that I only have to worry about keeping the app running. If you use a computer just for a web app, having the overhead of having to properly keep Windows running and updated is quite taxing (regardless of the issue, it's your fault if they can't log in to the inventory system).

ARM versions for half the price, please (preferably based on the latest Cortex A15 CPU and Mali GPU).

The cheapest option is $350 (a Cedar Trail board, the $450 one says "Intel Core" which probably means Sandy Bridge). What makes you think you can build an ARM board (with a core that doesn't even exist in the market yet!) for $175, much less sell it for that? The only device in the market that even comes close is the Kindle, and that's heavily subsidized by content revenue.

I meant half the price compared to the latest Chromebook from Samsung which is $450. They need at least a few models in the $200-$250 range, even if they have to make them "lower-end". But I think Cortex A15 will be a great match for that, unless they totally messed up the cross-platform optimization, and ChromeOS will be slower on ARM than on a similar-performance x86 chip. Plus, you'll get at least double the battery life - which is kind of necessary for a Web-only/mobility device.

OK, where are you going to find a $225 non-subsidized ARM box? Same logic applies. I see nothing even close to that range. A tablet or smartphone with these specs is going to run you $500+.

And you need to check (or better, run) a few benchmarks before making pronouncements like that. Per-clock, SNB beats the A9 in my OMAP4 phone by about 2x on stuff that fits in the L1 cache, and a bunch more on things that spill out (the phone SoC has absolutely nothing like the L3 cache on SNB).

There are $250 Windows-based netbooks, where you actually have to pay a pretty big license cost..so..

I think it's very doable. I just don't think the manufacturers want to go that low because they want to exploit the early adopter market, and/or because Google was not ready with support for ARM.

http://www.genesi-usa.com/products/smartbook $200.

It's not very good when you're running Ubuntu, but then again even my nice i7 laptop can really suck under Linux sometimes. ChromeOS might help.

Cortex A15 SoCs (specifically the Exynos 5 line, which includes ARM Mali GPUs) production didn't start until Q2, and I would assume they won't be ready until at least midway through Q3, so there's no way Google could use them in their Chrome OS devices.

There are some code leaks of Google specifically supporting Exynos 5250, but I don't know whether that's for a Chromebook or an Android tablet.

The CPU on the Chromebox is listed as 1.9 GHz Celeron B840. Can this play 1080p MKV? If so, this could my WD Live, Patriot Box Office, etc. Add a BT mouse/keyboard and I'm set.

Will it ever be distributed like a linux distro?

You can download Chromium OS builds [1]. There are a few differences compared to ChromeOS [2].

[1] http://chromeos.hexxeh.net/ [2] http://www.chromium.org/chromium-os/chromium-os-faq#TOC-What...

Wonder how the box would work as a set-top (goodbye Google TV?)

Can a Chromebook / box run webGL?

It's probably using a very old/low-end integrated graphics chip from Intel, so it might run WebGL, but probably not the most advanced demos.

It seems to use Intel HD 3000 [1] and runs WebGL surprisingly well [2][3] (actually better than Macbook Pro with the same GPU [4]).

[1] http://www.chromestory.com/2012/05/samsung-chromebox-price/

[2] http://twitter.com/Tojiro/status/207604697073324032

[3] http://twitter.com/Tojiro/status/207607126716198914

[4] http://twitter.com/thespite/status/207618510443134977

Where are the ARM based Chrome books ?

Maybe they're trying to focus on a single architecture...so NOW they're worried about avoiding fragmentation, jeez.

What a nonsensical FUDish comment.

Why would there be any fragmentation? You're running the web on it...the web is architecture agnostic. This is why it never really made sense for me why they went with Intel and x86, when they could've started from day one on ARM. They are not bound by legacy software on a specific architecture, like Windows is with x86.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com