Nintendo blitzes GitHub with over 8k emulator-related DMCA takedowns
engadget.com
engadget.com
Radicle gives a decentralised Git network that is much more immune to any legal action.
This makes it much more difficult for Nintendo to take such action. Because it is a civil dispute, not a criminal one, the trick is to make it more costly for Nintendo to abuse the legal system (it is unlikely the legal system abuse will be fixed in long term, or ever). When DMCA and such laws were designed, it is unlikely the lawmakers intended it to be abused like this. There is no penalty for Nintendo to do as many takedown notes they want, whileas there is a headache for anyone involved in these projects to defend themselves.
But it doesn’t have to be this way. For something like source control, must we have anonymity? You wouldn’t require all that much PII to deter most bad actors, I would have thought. Maybe the PII bits can be stored in a different system that provides cryptographically signed assertions. You remain anonymous, but can assert your identity is stored in X. Law enforcement have the power to recover the PII if there is a warrant. Like some of the proposals for asserted qualifications in Europe and such.
The same happens to media sharing via bittorrent in germany right now. Having some site which gets closed instead seems to be preferable to me.
Of course copyright infringement is different from whatever emulators are doing but I imagine the effect might be the same
I guess they could just send people threatening letters - but even getting the ISPs to play along would be an uphill battle.
Germany is a special case as it's particularly bureaucratic and dominated by establishment interests. And even then it's only commonplace for Bittorrent because GEMA, etc. pushed to make that possible.
The article mentions that emulators “illegally circumvent Nintendo’s technological protection measures and run illegal copies of Switch games.”. But which law makes it illegal to circumvent such systems? And what about Wii-only emulators? Surely they have nothing to do with the safety systems of the Switch.
DMCA section 1201
No person shall circumvent a technological measure that effectively controls access to a work protected under this title.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/1201
Can the emulators remove the circumvention code to avoid the DMCA takedown?
The issue is when you bypass encryption keys and systems.
You get a few exemptions for research for security reasons, but it does require it to be on "a lawfully acquired device or machine on which the computer program operates solely". So an emulator doesn't fit the bill at all.
Video games are mentioned: you're allowed to circumvent DRM for games that no longer have their online servers running.
Any modern game console has some form of decryption, which can be argued to prevent access.
This is when we run into the chicken/egg problem because you can't write emulation without violating 1201. It is also in part the argumentation Nintendo used in the yuzu case.
A NES clone without a CIC will play games fine.
Not very effective, is it?
I assume this means something else in lawyer speak.
i.e. you cannot put a piece of paper in the box with the words "this is a technical protection mechanism" and claim it is.
But it doesn't mean that what you do has to be infailable, or meet some arbitrary level of doing it's job well, no.
Disclaimer: I have talked to lawyers. Our company makes industrial IoT loggers and during my career I have only been given appropriate documentation twice by manufacturers. Most of the systems have been reverse engineered through packet capture.
[1] https://vidstromlabs.com/blog/the-legal-boundaries-of-revers...
Even with documentation you still get garbadge. I've had to decompile a HSM firmware to figure out what the actual input of functions was since the manufacturer kept claiming the documentation was correct. It wasn't even close. Only after I provided the solution to my own support ticket they changed the documentation (why bother paying for full support...).
I've gotten a bit of empathy for the poor front support guy since he'd have to keep complaining to the developers which kept saying "no it's fine as documented".
> DMCA section 1201
...which is an unambiguous observation that DMCA section 1201 is in conflict with the 1st amendment.
It does not.
So like how DVDs are encrypted, all Switch games are encrypted. Except with good AES encryption and proper key sizes. This started with games in the Wii/PS3 generation, so emulators for systems before that would be fine.
Also I've now learned that wikipedia has a URL shortener. Because Hacker News eats the period at the end of the wikipedia article title.
That didn't get tested in court, but I suspect it would have succeeded (this is not legal advice).
How useful would the emulator without the key be? I guess you could still write and play (and share) your own software. Is that what people call "homebrew" in the Nintendo Switch context?
Can’t distribute games or other copyrighted software with them, though. Of course that’s still highly likely to get you in trouble. And with the same caveat as anything legal in the US: it’s as legal as your ability to weather a series of failing lawsuits against you.
Seems like emulation is only fine if they make money out of it.
And then emulation isn't stealing anyways.
Or it’s just different corporate policies at different times being applied inconsistently.
Having a cryptographically signed (by authors, not by GitHub) and fully open source git hosting network would be a boom for FOSS security in general.
(Not as a rhetorical question; I don’t quite understand your vision, so I’m hoping you’ll clarify the usage.)
Git in itself is designed to be distributed.
I'd assume that op wants a torrent that can be pushed/pulled from.
The problem is it could be very expensive. Think NFT but the metadata is the source code of the emulator. You're not removing that from the blockchain, ever. It also needs to be a popular blockchain, like ETH, BTC, SOL or whatever people still use today.
There are "coins" where your stake is disk space but if it's not a widespread thing it just dies off (conway GoL style)
The Bitcoin whitepaper [0] is a very accesible read, but the revolutionary ideas are not immediately obvious.
Broadly speaking, it's inevitable that some jurisdiction will decide to observe the unclothed emperor here and create a legal framework without the yoke of all of this "intellectual property". Obviously, it will thrive, and everyone will flock to use services there.
What then?
Often discussed here.
However, many Hacker News commenters love to bash it because it is associated with cryptocurrencies.
Given how most emulators can allow playing pirated games, the others might be next.
The Yuzu devs settled, and among the allegations in Nintendo’s filing was that they, the developers themselves, engaged in piracy.
Second, the DMCA has nothing in it that explicitly targets emulators. Now what some hardware makers have done is include some kind of cryptography and called it an anti-circumvention method, but that is a later phenomenon and the earlier attempts at this didn’t amount to much in most cases.
Third, the Yuzu Devs brought the wrath of Nintendo of America down upon them through means other than merely writing an emulator, in particular they were likely engaged in actual piracy. They probably knew they were cooked and chose to settle rather than go to trial.
So again, FUD. There’s been a lot of it everywhere on this specific topic, so quit spreading it around like so much manure to nurture Nintendo of America’s basic stance towards emulation. They can have their opinion, but it doesn’t overrule judicial precedent.
Adhering to these fraudulent DMCA requests endangers all of OSS.
The whole "technical protection measures" clause is in my view the most atrocious part of the DMCA, more so than the actual copyright stuff - because this communicates that the state is not just ok with vendors using their devices against their own users but actively endorses and encourages it.
This is basically the legal basis for Doctorow's "war on general computation".
The US one is actually pretty toothless compared to many.
You're effectively left with rogue states, who tend not be to very good hosting partners.
Yes, because Microsoft has the other side where they take everyone's code and then repurpose it as a "coding aid as a service" kind of thing (copilot) without attribution or even permission in the first place.
If you can demonstrate genuine benefit to society --of course, beyond mere access to copyrighted material-- even if during the course of a commercial enterprise, copyright does not apply.
Eventually, one hopes to see _really good_ benefit, like... much greater than the cost and negative side effects of putting virtual pets on virtual, energy consuming hamster wheels.
https://www.edsurge.com/news/2017-08-10-what-happened-to-goo...
More discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40236699
I pirate. And if I can't pirate, I won't play.
However, I do not see any good reason to not enjoy their games. Yeah, if everyone does as I do, they go bankrupt. I do not care. Try not to be hated by people using your product, I guess.
I don't really care about your standing point anyway.
Discussion is over for me. Goodbye
The same is true of the west Nashville music-finance complex. And of Hollywood. And of every industry rent-seeking around the restrictions on speech and press which are branded as "intellectual property".
This just happens to be a transparently egregious example, as they are literally trying to censor a FOSS project and make its contributors' speech invisible / illegal.
"This just happens to be a transparently egregious example, as they are literally trying to censor a FOSS project and make its contributors' speech invisible / illegal"
Give me a break. The only reason this software was FOSS, was for the creators to receive protection from useful idiots like you. We all know that the purpose of this project was to profit from piracy.
We can observe that the nature of information is that it is free to copy. This is not a new observation; the myth of Prometheus tells us of this nature, and of the power that the gods foolishly attempt to shore up by pretending that it can't be copied.
Of course I agree that solid games are worth money, but if you have to avert your eyes to the entire evolution of the way information propagates in the universe in order to achieve that, you've gone down an incorrect path.
And yes, building entire media empires designed to leverage your right to distribute bytes as you see fit, while prohibiting others from distributing them under threat of violence, is most certainly rent-seeking.
The silly fiction that someone "owns" that information because of a previous historical event is not in keeping with any part of nature that I'm able to observe.
What makes anyone think that on sufficiently long time scales the internet will continue to abide this?
I'm done.
But I think we can make that decision without needing onerous and obstructive state infrastructure, so I don't think the comparison is particularly germane. Unless you are suggesting that it's the role of the state to stop animals from eating each other? (Isn't that the same impetus as suggesting it's the role of the state to stop data from replicating?)
Lastly, I think you've misunderstood the role of the free-rider problem in public goods, particularly in the application of building non-rivalrous markets; in fact, you have it exactly backwards.
Your use of libdvdcss is almost certainly illegal under US law though, as absurd and ridiculous as that is.
Yuzu did not distribute those.
However it did implement the code to use those keys and decrypt a game. So you could say the final compiled binary "implements a way to circumvent DRM". Although you could also defend it by saying "it just models what the hardware does".
Regardless, for the whole "emulators are illegal" discussion, you could technically distribute code for an emulator that does not include that piece of code. Then "ask" your users to "search" for it (kinda like with prod and title keys) and "tell" them to compile it.
But these are very technical arguments you would need to pass in front of a non-technical judge. So good luck.
This situation really sucks because soon there will be the Switch 2, and then maybe in 5 years or so you won't be able to play a lot of these games easily anymore (nevermind at good resolutions, etc.).
edit: ah, the number of 8,535 is in the beginning of the notice itself, but due to the large number they did not list all of the forks, I guess the listed ones are the only non-forked repos.