Hacker News Reader

Comment by SimianLogic | Hacker News Reader

Is there a reason something like a water rower wouldn’t work on the moon? Possibly with a weighted vest or a weighted seat.

Rowing is pretty full body and doesn’t seem that reliant on gravity.

View on HN

I'm always baffled that these studies don't put more emphasis on resistance training, since the main issue is that your body no longer has to resist the forces of gravity on a day-to-day basis.

In theory exercises like the major compound lifts should go a long way because they stimulate almost every muscle in the body. You get a lot of sustained muscle growth out of doing big lifts even just 2-3 times of week.

Of course you're not going to be literally lifting weights in space because they're weightless! But resistance can be produced with bands, pneumatics etc.

Rowing is a really good one because you get resistance training and cardio at the same time.

But the Moon does have gravity, just less of it. Is no one considering just squatting and deadlifting huge-ass boulders? Fill a big basket with moon rocks and eventually it's gonna be heavy...

But you also want to have impact shocks, like your foot hitting the ground, to stimulate bones. Resistance training is certainly helpful, and perhaps a rowing machine could be modified to give you that shock to the legs, too.

Resistance training doesn't just grow muscles, it stimulates bone growth as well.

That's why it's recommended for osteoporosis.

NASA has IRED for resistence training on ISS. IIRC regiment was ~1xBW squats/deadlift for 3x10s in space every few days. Upper body was even more "normie" strength requirements. I think the routine included many hours of resistence training in general with very conservative weights to maintain mass and avoid injury at all costs.

>>~1xBW squats/deadlift for 3x10s

For super-fit astronauts, that's pathetic.

Dunno why this is being downvoted because it's correct. In their 20's most people can be at this level by their second session in the gym

I have read about IRED but never heard the particulars of their training regime before. Dunno about that workout plan, it is a workout which would not induce hypertrophy on earth, so I wouldn't expect it to do much in zero g. Hopefully they don't give up on the idea just because they were doing weak lifts

Really though when they get to the moon I just want to see them bring a barbell and two big buckets which they fill up with moon rocks. In general free weights are better for hitting a variety of muscles at once vs machines being better for isolation exercises, if you're trying to prevent muscle wastage across your entire body, a barbell may very well be superior!

I looked list of artificial objects to lift on the moon.

Lunar Roving Vehicle curb is only 76lb/34kg. That's would be a fun OHP set.

The Descent Stage of Lunar Landing Module is 358kg/789lb. Probably strong man car squat with one of the legs for reps.

Many landed probes/landers between the 1-5 plate territory territory.

>if you're trying to prevent muscle wastage

I actually like all the new light weight resistence cable machines that perfroms like IRED released in the last few years. But a 24 ft barbell with 10 ft of mooncrete bumper plates on each side to replicate a 5plate pull would be neat.

I think the NASA goal is to build up muscle base on earth and do least impact/injury risk routine to preserve muscle mass and bone density. I'm assuming it's not bro science, and they have injury table for astronauts who are genpop fit but not lifter strong, and optimizing for that. I wonder what their policy on steriods is.

Well, if nothing else there's a lot of basalt lying around on the moon, which would weigh about 3,000 kg/m3 on earth. That means it should weigh around 500 kg/m3 on the moon. So you're gonna need some big plates, but getting up to the amount of weight they have people lifting on IRED sounds pretty doable. This way all you have to send over from earth is a bar and some buckets!

> In theory exercises like the major compound lifts should go a long way because they stimulate almost every muscle in the body. You get a lot of sustained muscle growth out of doing big lifts even just 2-3 times of week.

Keep in mind that you are doing your 3 squat sessions a week on top of a whole week of lugging your own body around in 1g.

Resistance training is, of course, 100% what astronauts already do on the ISS; how to optimally exercise in zero gee (and cramped conditions) has been extensively studies for half a century now. So it’s kind of understandable if some one wants to study a mode of exercise that works on the Moon and is not resistance-based.

A rower wouldn’t provide the same impact forces on the feet, a key driver of the physiological processes that maintain bone density in the legs, hips, and likely even spine.

Forces from the muscles are the main bone stimulator. Running in low gravity would probably use less muscle force then a rowing machine.

They do mention that an erg doesn't have the full effect wanted:

> Low-intensity steady-state exercise or high-intensity interval training on ergometers may serve to preserve cardiorespiratory fitness [12,25–27] but have little impact on muscle and bone mass.

I wonder if they use a rower on the ISS.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com