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Comment by samspenc | Hacker News Reader

Like other comments have pointed out, I think of this as similar to how Google controls the Android OS. While theoretically open, the real useful stuff on top of Android (Google services etc) require a license from Google along with their Play store, so Google makes revenue from there.

Certainly more open (edited) than the Apple ecosystem, but still controlled by one (big) player, with a little bit of flexibility but not a whole lot.

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> A bit more open than the Apple ecosystem

It is not "a bit more open" than iOS, it is a completely different approach to OS development that enables wildly different results.

> While theoretically open, the real useful stuff on top of Android

That stuff is by no means necessary; I've run Android without Google services for years and it just feels like a normal tablet OS. Again, it is not "theoretically open" but in fact practically usable without any first-party services, unlike iOS.

:D Fair, I didn't want to be yelled at by the Apple fanbase that comes out in defense to comments like this, have edited my original post with a note.

as an apple fan i can assure you this is exactly what I think, I just prefer the results that Apple's approach enables and wish legislators would let consumers choose it as opposed to forcing the results to look more like Android

You can choose. If Apple services are all you intend to patronize, then legislation won't stop you; it does stop Apple from using their dominant position to enforce less competitive terms for their competition. If you depend on Apple's market abuse to use your iPhone, I'll just tell you now; it's time to find a new workflow.

Have you ever used a Mac? It's a great example of what the iPhone will look like, in a few years. You boot it up, log in, and open up the App Store... and it's only junk. Freemium apps with monthly microtransactions, paid trial versions of professional software you have to buy from the web, iPhone games that are barely anything more than a casino with flashy graphics... these are the developers that choose to stay with Apple when they get the choice. They'll be your only bedfellows if you're dumb enough to use an iPhone that only Apple curates.

Amazon used AOSP to create tons of their products. Even if most Android devices have the Play Store, there are successful variants that don't. And I'd even include Meta's Quest line here: every headset since the Go has the ability to sideload apks using standard Android tools.

My quest (1) I bought on launch day got an OS update and now I have to find my old credentials to log in (and thus accept some (probably) draconian EULA, just to enable developer mode to side load apps on there. You can't just plug a USB stick in the side and copy paste them to "side_loaded_apps" dir it's still a ridiculous task of doing backflips through flaming hoops to use it as an open device. And it may yet again reset my login.

You’re discounting the huge number of android devices that use it as a base OS. E.g. Amazon and Peloton use android without Google services for consumer devices.

These are devices built with a specific use case in mind that need an operating system that is easy to develop for. Non-Google versions of Android have struggled to make much headway in markets like smartphones. Even Amazon's own phone flopped pretty hard.

Kindle tablets on the other hand have done well.

> Non-Google versions of Android have struggled to make much headway in markets like smartphones

You may have forgotten about China: Huawei smartphones are doing very well on an AOSP-based OS.

Edit: Google was concerned about a Chinese fork of Android flourishing, they wrote to congress at the time the tech-transfer ban was being condidered

The thing about Android is that a device doesn't have to make headway by selling 100 million units plus to continue being adapted to many different types of devices.

In any case, the Play store can be sideloaded on every Android device even if it isn't officially supported.

>Non-Google versions of Android have struggled to make much headway in markets like smartphones. Even Amazon's own phone flopped pretty hard.

Not much headway? Pretty much all Android phones used in China do not come with GMS.

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