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Comment by boringg | Hacker News Reader

I have to imagine that all these new EV rickshaws are significantly cleaning up the air in countries like India, Vietnam and Thailand. Anyone on the ground floor confirm this?

I recall the particulates in the air of decades past being super hard on the lungs.

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While ev 3-wheelers have become quite common in India, I am not sure if they have led to any visible improvement in air quality. The earlier 3-wheelers were already CNG based and not as inefficient as petrol/gasoline powered ones. We are a developing country so I believe the growth in private cars is also offsetting any gains from ev 3-wheelers.

To add to this, the particulates in the air are not entirely from this pollution, it is a sum of our terrain, geography, agricultural activities and pollution.

There's too many "legacy" vehicles still on the road for these to make a noticeable impact. I was in Bangalore recently and in various popular and upcoming parts of the city, it's basically unbreathable toxic sludge at rush hour, and only mildly OK otherwise.

Tons of other air pollution sources too, from trash fires to cooking.

It would be nice to cut down on any one source, and cars are definitely a big problem, but not the only one.

Yes like the sibling said, EVs are a fraction of the total number of vehicles on the Road. But adoption is growing every year. Hopefully in 10 years or so EVs will take over.

> are significantly cleaning up the air

Nope. They're a menace. The batteries are dumped after they die out, and random alleyway factories will make batteries without caring about externalities or chemical disposal [0].

> Vietnam and Thailand

Vietnam doesn't use 3 wheelers. Everyone buys a 2 wheeler.

Thailand has transitioned to cars. You don't see "Tuktuks" outside of tourist centers anymore.

A Toyota Hilux is the vehicle of choice in Thailand

[0] - https://m.economictimes.com/industry/renewables/govt-to-take...

So, cleaning up the air but poisoning the waters?

Not even cleaning the air.

While India is working on massive green energy projects, it's also doubling down on expanding Coal Capacity [0] as a short term solution to energy independence. China's doing the same

[0] - https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/india-increase-coal-...

With EVs, even if they are powered by 100% coal electricity, they still produce less CO2 and pollution than an ICEV.

Considering how dirty most gas-powered rickshaws have been, I have to assume that the electric versions are much much cleaner in this regard.

The e-rickshaws use lead acid batteries and "disposal infrastructure" is just chucking it to the side if it's dead.

A CNG auto-rickshaw is also similarly light on fumes.

In all honesty, all three-wheelers need to be banned in India, but it will never happen because that's political suicide.

Someone will collect the lead for scrap, it's valuable enough that even in wealthy countries it is worth stealing.

I take it you've never taken AP Chem.

Here's how you extract lead from lead acid batteries in the developing world (video is from Pakistan, but same principle in India, Vietnam, Phillipines, etc) [0], because Western Europe level environmental and labor laws aren't a thing.

[0] - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kNGg0P7B5fI

So what's the problem? The battery is clearly recycled, it's not going to end up in a river, burned or in landfill.

That's great and all, but lead is nasty stuff. I really hope it's use will diminish. Lead handling is always fraught with risks at every turn.

What do you mean gas powered, they used to run two-stroke engines. Burning half oil.

One of my expat buddies in Saigon owned a small scooter repair shop. Next door to him was a battery "recycling" place where someone would sit out front on the busy street and bust open batteries to take them apart for the valuable bits. Dust and whatever else going everywhere. The person wasn't wearing any sort of protective gear at all and was covered in soot. The shops all backed into a river, where they'd just dump all the waste they couldn't sell. This was on a street a couple km's long, full of shops like this.

Toxic af.

Yep! That's the same in India as well.

> One of my expat buddies in Saigon owned a small scooter repair shop

Oh whoa! Which quan was this? I subsisted off Grab so I never had to worry about scooter repair.

Best name ever: Phat Phuc Racing

Shop used to be here: https://maps.app.goo.gl/mwR8F7gCey1W2HUb7

I'm 99% sure he shut it down during covid though.

It wasn't really a repair shop, more about bolting parts on for expats. Parts and repairs are super cheap and not something to be afraid of.

I also can't imagine not having a bike in Saigon, it was one of the main reasons I moved there! The city is so massive and amazing to explore and you can really only do that if you own a bike. Or, in my case, I just bought and sold used bikes all the time. Probably went through 25+ during my time there.

> Thailand has transitioned to cars. You don't see "Tuktuks" outside of tourist centers anymore.

What are you talking about? I live in Thailand and there's tuktuks everywhere, especially outside tourist centres. And I make heavy use of an electric tuktuk ride-sharing service called Muvmi.

Yes, the Hilux is the most popular personal vehicle choice country-wide, because that includes a lot of rural areas. It's certainly not the most popular choice in the city. And people don't buy tuktuks for personal use, or Hiluxes for ride sharing, so I really don't know what you are trying to say.

What a weird, confident, and completely wrong comment.

at least in the Indian capital, over time the e-rickshaws have seemingly replaced most of the manually operated ones. neither was directly contributing to the problem, but i suppose the electric ones can be more efficient for space on the road.

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