Landfills Leak More Planet-Baking Methane Than We Thought
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It doesn't come from nothing. Methane is a compound generally produced by the breaking down of organic compounds in the absence of oxygen (anaerobic decomposition)
Organic compounds generally gain carbon from the atmosphere. So where is the extra carbon entering the system?
Should the focus not be on disposal methods but on ensuring sustainable regeneration of farmland in this case?
Also, if the food gains the carbon as CO2 but releases it on decomposition as CH4, that’s a big increase in GHG potential, we want to avoid that.
Moreover it shouldn’t matter the original carbon source - if we have the opportunity to capture some methane from concentrated point source like a landfill we should be jumping at it. One of the easiest marginal tons of CO2e saved
Regularly converting a bunch of atmospheric CO2 to methane is not good.
Over 100 years it’s 80x for years 0-19 years and 15x for years 20-99 which averages to 28x by weight. Largely because 1 ton of methane turns into almost 3 tons of CO2.
Except when you start with CO2 at 44.01 g/mol it turns into CH4 at 16.04 g/mol you only get 16.04/44.01 ~= 36.4% as much methane and thus 36.4% of that global warming.
Net result for years 0-19 it’s 29x as bad and years 20-99 it’s 5.5x as bad. And considering the relatively trivial amount of CO2 released as methane vs sequestered in landfills they are a massive reduction in climate change.
Isn't "sustainable regeneration of farmland" (whatever that means) orthogonal to methane being generated from landfills? After all, food waste in landfills generate the same amount of carbon regardless of how they're farmed. It's not like a rotting tomato that's grown using "sustainable regeneration of farmland" magically emits less methane than one that's grown conventionally.
Obviously things ending up in landfills is not sustainable.
It's rather wiser to use the remains of the tomato to directly or indirectly make fertilizer to fertilize new tomato plants, eg by composting them [1]. Now you've sort of got a cycle going on there, which you could in theory sustain indefinitely. (Hence the word.) Composting has been done since at least roman times.
Properly done, you can reduce methane emissions from composting considerably. (Releasing mostly CO2 back into the air, and the remainder is sufficiently low for 'the environment' to be able to deal with [2])
If you at least believe in the conservation of mass [3], you'll realize that [C released from composting] = [C the Tomato originally captured from the air in photosynthesis].
I'm summarizing entire fields of science, so there's devils in the details here. But closed cycles of chemical reactions where matter cycles endlessly (driven by incoming energy from sunlight, and ultimately emitting waste heat back to space), is a real thing in Biological systems.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compost
[2] assuming composting were the only methane source, there'd be more than sufficient methane sinks to handle the flow. Unfortunately, it's not the only methane source. But we still need to deal with the organic waste.
[3] I mean, for one: the total mass of our planet isn't noticeably changing much, that I'm aware of.
(edits for clarity and readability)
>It's rather wiser to use the remains of the tomato to directly or indirectly make fertilizer to fertilize new tomato plants [...]
Maybe you should read my comment and the comment I was replying to more carefully. The comment I was replying to says in pretty clear terms that we shouldn't care about "disposal methods"
> Should the focus not be on disposal methods but on ensuring sustainable regeneration of farmland in this case?
Your suggestion of using rotten tomatoes as compost or whatever arguably falls under "disposal methods".
I explained one common sustainable regeneration method, and I touch why it meets the required elements of regeneration and sustainability.
You arbitrarily reclassify this as a "disposal method"; without including any counter-reasoning.
You berate me for not reading and not providing an alternative to mere disposal.
As a reminder: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith." --https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Ask any agricultural engineer why that is a bad idea. Tomato pathogens from the old culture end up in your new one. That's one of the ideas behind culture rotation. But one could use that compost for other unrelated cultures like apple trees or grape vine.
Is it because composting is not always done perfectly? Or is it because some tomato pathogens intrinsically survive the process due to eg. heat resistance?
https://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/tomato-diseases-disorders...
How noticeable they are will depend on how you've decided to define noticable.
Growing plants pulls carbon from the atmosphere.
Rotting puts that carbon back into the atmosphere.
None of that has much to do with sustainable farming, which is about soil fertility, pest control, and micronutrients like fixated nitrogen - and not raw carbon.
Which is why nitrogen fertilizers and pesticides have been so important in producing mass yield improvements in farming.
Are there ways of doing this more naturally, using crop rotating, etc? Yes. In field Composting can help a little too, but has major disease and pest vector issues.
They’re also less efficient when you factor in transportation and land use costs. And they don’t really have any impact on macro level carbon cycle stuff.
I think you’re missing the forest for the trees? Or crossing wires?
Carbon is of course a factor in the case of stubble burning, but short of that biomass is being pulled from the atmosphere?
"Soil organic matter significantly improves the soil's capacity to store and supply essential nutrients (such as nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, calcium and magnesium), and to retain toxic elements. It allows the soil to cope with changes in soil acidity, and helps soil minerals to decompose faster."
https://www.google.com/search?q=benefits+of+soil+organic+mat...
https://www.politico.eu/article/denmark-garbage-gamble-amage...
Now imagine in 20 years we find some way of cheaply separating plastic polymers into raw precursors, say by designing some bacteria or fungus that selectively targets a specific polymer. Had we just burned all of the old trash, we'd be out of luck - but assuming we find such a process, old landfills just became gold mines.
You do realize that vinyl is far more worse than PVC?
Here's a 40+ year old landfill that didn't generate enough methane to operate its original flaring station, but still generated a significant amount of methane so the station had to be replaced:
https://www.berkeleyside.org/2024/04/04/cesar-chavez-park-me...
https://19january2021snapshot.epa.gov/lmop/frequent-question...
I vaguely remember reading about a planned project that would be able to call companies and countries out on their actual methane production, not just what they report
The amount of confusion with the multiple bins is surprising at first glance
What can you recycle? Who knows. Bottles, usually, but only if they're clear, green, or brown glass. And not if they're broken. Definitely no glass from mirrors. Also, probably not the bottle lids, or the the triggers from spray bottles. Aerosol cans? Sure. But not their caps. Aluminium foil, yes, but only if it's not got food contamination on it, so no. Same with aluminium baking tins and tin cans (actually steel!) from canned food. Can I recycle my pizza boxes in this council? Currently, yes, but only if they're not too greasy. What's too greasy? Still who knows. Coffee cups are recyclable in some councils, but not all, by the way. The lids are recyclable in basically all of them. As an aside, there are issues with recycling soft plastics, even if the plastic is actually recyclable, so be careful to make sure that even if it has the right symbol on it, it's not too bendy.
All of that, and ... well, it doesn't matter what I do, because my neighbour just yeets literally everything that smells like plastic or paper into their recycling bin, so my careful work is just commingled with garbage anyway.
This feels like an over-wrought analogy for a lot of things in my life, really.
And that's extra confusing because some of the bins use a wineglass with a broken rim as the symbol for glass, but the council flyer goes and states no broken glass.
This exists in some US cities, at least.
Green, Blue, and Black bins, respectively.
By comparison, the point of composting is to break down the organic waste where it can be reused as soil and fertilizer.
Edit: Downvote me all you want, it won’t change the fact that we’re consuming resources at a significantly faster pace than the planet can provide them and people having three or more kids are a huge part of the problem, especially in developed countries. Deal with it.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/one-child-policy/Consequenc...