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Comment by Workaccount2 | Hacker News Reader

Some of the most damaging people I have met are people that you are absolutely enthralled with when you first get to know them.

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There’s a whole extremely famous book series on this very topic, you might have heard about it. The first volume’s title is ‘Paul is bad’ but it’s more widely known as ‘Dune’.

Dune is about worms.

This is a deep cut. And c’mon, you can’t blame people for thinking Paul’s the good guy. He’s badass. It’s a great story.

It’s when fiction becomes non-fiction that it’s a problem.

Why is Paul bad? I read the books years ago but don't remember him being especially malicious.

Well, as Paul Atreides himself explains in the sequel to Dune, his Fremen Jihad causes the death of over 60 billion people throughout the empire. You can safely guess that the vast majority of them are innocent ordinary people, but just not important enough to pause over on the path to grand prophetic dreams. Basically, from when he takes power again, he becomes a genocidal monster in charge of an army of murderous fanatics, and then he spreads this right across the empire, well beyond Arrakis itself where he already caused all kinds of chaos.

The story is a classic narrative of hoped-for ends being used to justify horrible actual means, but cloaked in space opera.

Hmm I see, thanks. Is this in the first book? I don't quite remember that.

No, it's in the second book actually, (spoiler alert) which covers the time in which Paul's rule has been firmly developed following his enormously bloody jihad across the Empire, and the time after his death, after which his son Leto succeeds hims and lets himself be symbiotically covered in baby sandworms to turn into the eventual god emperor of the Imperium, ruling for 3000 years. (If I remember correctly)

I actually found the portrayal of Paul in the Villeneuve films to be closer to what Frank Herbert described as his intent in interviews when compared to the book.

That is, sincere with terrible consequences for bystanders. Not bad per se, but not conducive to the common good.

I also felt that the books undermined the warnings of tyranny by leaning on prescience to provide an ends justify the means argument. Moreso with God Emperor where the Golden Path seemed to be the ultimate end justifying any act.

That would apply probably to most famous entrepreneurs. Whatever I have read about Jobs, Musk, Gates and others, they all are very willing to abuse people to achieve their goals.

A => B <> B => A though

First impressions is a sales skill

True, and some of the most effective people I know haven’t been impressive when you first meet them.

I’m now extremely wary of blusteringly confident, glib talkers. Experienced a high correlation between these traits and sociopathy.

quite sure it's just unlucky ppl that got rewarded for acting like this

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