I'd also argue that the most recent accelerator for the shift in culture in Berlin isn't so much the tourism, but the pandemic. People haven't really been the same since.
I think the biggest drag is actually rent prices. When I got to Berlin 20 years ago you could get a room in a shared flat for €100. That same room now would be €500. Same for music spaces: it was easy to rent unused warehouse space in the inner city 20 year ago. There are a lot of interesting things that happen to a city when rent is ridiculously low as it was in Berlin for a long time (there were more apartments than people).
There's still a lot going on in Berlin, but the character has very much changed. 20 years ago it was rare for clubs to be legal. Most of Berlin's well known clubs now started off as illegal clubs back then. But there were hundreds of other spaces that didn't survive and transition to being legal spaces. There's still some of that, but much, much less. Also back then just randomly setting up a sound system in a park in the summer was much more tolerated. "Open Airs" in Berlin were just kind of what you did in the summer.
Honestly, while I generally did not partake in such, the pandemic was the first time that I realized that came back some. Partying was illegal and the parties were moderately guarded secrets. I hadn't seen that much buzz around illegal parties in more than a decade.
Addendum: As a weird note, I don't even get the grandparent's comment about Potsdam? For the non-Berlin folks, it's a city just outside of Berlin's borders, but an hour away on the train from the more alternative bits of the city. It's neither known for its music scene, nor honestly as a place that rich people want to move. I know a couple of people that have moved there because of usual suburb reasons: they wanted a bigger place, and it's cheaper there. The other cities listed there are also weird. I've been out in all of them but Lyon and, yeah, there's some stuff, but to say the "scene" is moving there is really off. Three of the cities listed there are in the Balkans, but the best city for techno in the Balkans is undoubtedly Belgrade.
Sooner or later, the Berlin scene will just feel like the one in Brooklyn. Everything will be properly gentrified.
Also, often tourists aren't accustomed to Berlin's marathon club opening times (some clubs don't close on weekends) and end up too trashed and are annoying. So, yeah, tourists have a harder time at the doors.
Honestly, I've only been to Tresor once. It's kind of a misnomer since it's named after a very famous, very important long-closed club in a different part of Berlin with a totally different vibe. The current incarnation ... it's probably fine. Like, there are a handful of clubs in Berlin that actually feel a lot like the clubs Berliners do go to, but are mostly there for tourists. You can spot them because ... you can spot them. ;-) (Good rule of thumb in Berlin: if you can easily find the entrance, it's for tourists. Most of the more scene-y clubs don't have a sign.)
I get it though, where I live we have desert undergrounds and parties up in the mountains with a vibe that is threatening to be overrun by tourists. To say nothing of all the plug-in camps popping up at Burning Man...
I'm travelling there for the first time, as a woman alone I wouldn't like to have nasty looks tbh (or even be yelled at as other user suggested), not want to bother, know to behave and just want to get to know the city along with other places in Europe.
It's not about just line length, you would have to fit in and seem non-tourist to get into Berghain, and then you'd need to actually enjoy a dark, brutal, kink and techno club full of intentional degeneracy. I would absolutely go, for the music, but wouldn't be as much into the kink side, which I think is escalated somewhat from what Tresor was?
There's a good documentary on the history of Tresor: "Sub Berlin - The Story Of Tresor" which appears to even have a re-cut version on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iiuJhq-z2LE
I think the yelling at tourists is mainly going to be if you're doing something stupid (though some of those are non-obvious: e.g. taking pictures in clubs is mostly a no-no). I probably wouldn't mess with trying to get in to Berghain. Other places you'll have a decent shot. If you want to go like a pro, show up from 4-6 a.m. instead of midnight with the tourists. The pros come out late, and the lines are shorter and the dancefloors are less packed -- if you actually like to dance, later is better. I'll sometimes even go out on Sunday afternoon.
Also be prepared to be denied entry. It's allowed and not uncommon, especially for some specific clubs.
So research where you're going first! Helped me get in without having to say a word!
I think, no citizen of any larger city likes tourists and the way tourism shapes the city. It's mostly ugly, tasteless entertainment venues and ever the same groups of people standing in your way, the same questions asked. Don't expect anyone to be enthusiastic about your week long expedition through their lived reality. Do your own research.
You have to behave like a "tourist" to be noticeable as one. If you are disgustingly drunk and obviously in "don't be gentle, it's a rental" mode, you may not get into some clubs, tourist or not. Some legendary clubs are very sex/kink positive, and/or queer spaces, bouncers take their job serious and filter out people who may disturb the peace or don't fit the general vibe. It's not a zoo. As a "tourist", or really anyone not in the scene, you likely won't get the info on anything "underground" going on.
That said, Berlin's tourism really isn't that bad compared to e.g. Paris or Prague. The city feels very much like actual people are living there. Speaking English won't get you "flagged" per se and you won't have trouble communicating. Mind you, the "expat" type isn't exactly liked either...
My advice, to get an authentic feel for Berlin: Explore the city by bike! Rent or cheaply buy one for the time being there. Traffic is intimidating, but the city is much, much less overwhelming and exhausting on a bike. (Don't clog the bike lanes, tho!) Berlin is incredibly green and got several lakes (!) inside and around, where you can swim and hang-out. It's also very explorable, meaning you can discover nice, or odd places and things just by walking around, in many areas. Don't get too focused on certain locations.
Thanks for the tips :) ! Will make sure to rent a bike while there.
No. Maybe some, but not many I've personally met.
> Im travelling to Berlin and was recommended Tresor
Not a bad club, not particular popular with people here. It is well known, though.
Belgrade is long way from Europe although the scene is good, but I’d say Croatia and Albania are much more preferred by promoters
Imagine a guy comes around to your house every month and demands $1000 or else he breaks your kneecaps. You'd be quite motivated to ensure you can make that $1000 each month and you'd not be left with as much energy for doing everything else you might want to do. That's essentially the economic effect of rent. At least taxes are indexed to your income, so you can always afford to pay them; rent is not.
I moved to Berlin 15 years ago in my mid 20s. Back then we didn’t work very much, we constantly had hangovers, we were constantly out, running around Neukölln and Kreuzberg.
Whenever I chat to that age group now, while they often look the part, they’re actually tired, overworked, cash-strapped, and living far from the center of the city.
A good weird party scene needs that bad-judgment-high-enthusiasm energy of the young, and now there’s much less of it.
I've seen the pattern in several other places as well: arts thrive in the affordable undesirable edges of society until it generates enough buzz for capitalists to notice it and move in seeking to profit off of it. The problem is that culture is not valued in capitalism because it has no landlord.
Most of the places they shut down were mostly fine.
intellectual property is the way to monetize intangible culture
This is a super common cycle. City gets economically depressed -> rents drop a lot -> lots of young people and artists, etc. move in -> great "scene" develops -> people with a bit more money start moving in because of the scene -> rents rise -> young people and artists move elsewhere -> scene slows or stagnates.
Obviously that's an oversimplification, and just becoming cheap to live in isn't enough by itself, and just becoming more expensive isn't the death knell.
Charlottenburg, Steglitz, Wilmersdorf or Wedding were never known for "the scene" but prices still got way higher. And places like Prenzlauer Berg were already gentrified when prices got even crazier.