Comment by Beretta_Vexee | Hacker News Reader

Comment by Beretta_Vexee | Hacker News Reader

A common mistake is to think that the EU is limited to a few large economies (Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Holland), but this is not the case.

Ensuring that a Croatian SME can win contracts with the French or Germans is one of the EU's priority objectives. This is how the EU has lifted millions of people out of poverty. This is a very tangible reality. It worked with East Germany, Spain, Poland, the Baltic States and now the Balkans.

The European Commission is litteraly there to ensure that a water heater designed by an Italian, made by a Romanian from Polish steel, inspected by an Italian and put on the market by a Frenchman guarantees high quality standards. They take this mission very seriously because it's not just about protectionism or trade competition. It's a political project of peace and improvement of the living standards for Europeans.

You'd have to know very little about the European Union to believe that it was prepared to negotiate or grant a free pass to Apple.

When Bulgarian truckers started outcompeting French truckers the EU came up with new rules to shut that down. Requiring that the truck has to go back to the country the company is from every 2 months is ridiculous. Not the driver, the vehicle.

Why would it be ridiculous, if a truck has a Bulgarian license plate it's a reasonable expectation that it's based in Bulgaria.

If a worker has Bulgarian nationality, they are free to live and work anywhere in the EU, including France. And a Bulgarian business can also operate anywhere in the EU. It's a single economic market, so it's clear that rules like that are arbitrary and designed to be appease special interests.

This is about the vehicle. The Bulgarian company is welcome to acquire a French registered vehicle and let it drive in France for years - it might come with extra requirements around having a French subsidy.

As stated elsewhere: This is politics and does not really change the fundamentals. Change take time. When countries in the EU gets more assimilated, more and more of these restrictions will be lifted.

You ought to see the trajectory and direction more than the absolute position of the legislation.

yes and no. They are free to live and work anywhere in the EU, but through multiple rules they are obligated to pay income, city and employment taxes in the country they live and work.

I've heard that there are long term goals of unifying healthcare, retirement and the way work and local taxes are calculated so that it's more flexible and less based on small local bureaucracy. Similar to what they did with mobile phone subscriptions, where you pay to the country you spend your time in, but can use it anywhere. but that requires a lot more financial systems to interoperate.

In a "free" market why would a Bulgarian be forced to operate only near Bulgaria?

As an example, all food in Romania is from the Netherlands or other foreign countries. But you don't see the EU imposing regulations to make foreign food more expensive.

Essentially eastern Europe is an exploitation market: everything is manufactured in the west, and when the east has an advantage it's immediately shut down.

This is also very polluting: forcing eastern European drivers to migrate to their home countries frequently, transporting food from western Europe to eastern Europe.

> In a "free" market why would a Bulgarian be forced to operate only near Bulgaria?

But this isn't about a Bulgarian person - this is about a truck registered in Bulgaria. That means that the registration fees and taxes, which are a national responsibility and are not at the EU-level, are paid in Bulgaria.

So if you only drive the truck in, say, France, you're essentially evading French taxes for the said truck.

> As an example, all food in Romania is from the Netherlands or other foreign countries.

Why?

Probably because Romanian farmers make more money selling their produce outside of Romania and the Netherlands and other countries can produce so much cheap produce that it's cheaper for Romania to import it rather than pay the price Romanian farmers are willing to sell it in the internal market.

I don't see any issue with that, it's a win-win.

As with any large political entity, politics is gonna happen. Doesn’t really detract from the basic point.

Well sure, no political project is perfect. But you can't let perfect be the enemy of the good.

And that is wrong why? Because at the same time, drivers have to be paid at least minimum wages in the countries they drive in.

The practical implication of this is also that it is a huge market. You can ignore that at your own peril. And another thing is that the EU is inspiring other countries to also change their regulations. In the end what companies need to decide is if they can afford losing and alienating major markets across the globe.

E.g. Apple sells lots of iphones and other hardware in the EU. That should be more valuable than giving themselves preferential treatment in their own store, banning competitors from using their browser on IOS, and other anti competitive things that they are doing. And that's just Apple. Arguably, Google, Amazon, Meta, etc. each have their own issues with regulations in the EU.

The EU made us all poorer, it hasn't lifted many out of poverty

Go and explain that to a Romanian or a Latvian. Not so long ago, their citizens were prepared to give up everything to leave these countries. That is no longer the case. You're deluding yourself.

As a Romanian, I find this comment funny. To think that Romania improved because of the EU, not because we got rid of communism in 1989 followed by a period of wild west capitalism years before even entering EU. Most EU money in here are wasted on corruption with infrastructure projects.

Have you seen pictures in these countries from pre-2000 to today ?

- ireland is probably the only western europe country that was a net beneficiary,

- but also the whole eastern bloc : poland, romania, slovenia, croatia, hungary, czech, estonia, latvia, lithuania

Was there any other big event that happened in the eastern bloc in, say, the early 1990's?

And cooperation with EU (then still EEC) was one of the things helping build up, and even more later with accession process and post-accession cooperation.

Despite rampant crime post 1989 in many eastern bloc countries that flourished in the chaos, and the predatory capitalism plundering.

Especially since the foreign debt (to western countries!) that was big chunk of economical issues of some of the eastern bloc countries didn't disappear.

haha, have you seen how many problems the UK created for themselves when they left the EU? It's better to be a part of Europe than not.

The data disagrees with you.

Eu gdp 2013: 11,516.141 billion euro

Eu gdp 2023: 15,907.189 billion euro

39.58% increase

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_European_Union

Oooh right, money. Numbers in a bank account equals wealth of course, yeah you're right

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