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I just replaced a furnace... everyone I called for a quote would not touch a heat pump with a 20foot pole, or they wanted prices that were 2X what a separate furnace and AC would cost to install. It was very strange. This is the second home where I had this experience.. basically, they really did not want to install it. I ended up going with gas as no local person would install/warranty a heat pump, or, it was priced so high it was a non-starter (e.g. a gas furnace is $4k, the AC is $4k, making it $8k, _but_ if you want a heat pump, well, that is going to be $15,999.85.)

This was recently, btw, as in last month. I am still kind of shaking my head.

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Your experience is extremely common. Residential HVAC contractors tend to be extremely conservative, and don't adopt new technologies quickly, or even attempt to understand them. I had some flexibility in time in replacing my 50 year old gas furnace, so I was able to call about 8 contractors before I finally found one who was comfortable with the tech and wanted to do it.

Yeah, it's not an innovative sector, though a lot of the blame belongs with the hardware manufacturers and not the installers. FWIW, the quotes I got for installation weren't that awful. But getting it hooked up to the Nest thermostat turned out to be a 2-day process and require a subcontractor to show up.

I've installed two Nest thermostats and there's industry standardized color-coding and functionality and Nest conforms to that. (I don't doubt that you had that problem, but I think that speaks more to the incompetence of the original installer than to the complexity of installing a thermostat with a screen.)

I think it was more that the heat pump itself really wanted to be integrated with the Carrier Official Thermostat (which I think might have been an ecobee but can't remember), and the documentation on how to run it in legacy/standard/on-off mode was missing or confusing.

Probably a bit more nuanced than that.

A lot of the installers run small businesses. If one of these units goes wrong or if they do the install wrong because it's new to them, then that's lost time and lost revenue rectifying it.

This is it. They price installs at generally a single day for complete system swap for install time assuming ducts are reused and never want even spend the travel time coming back on another day in my area. If they do, it’s eroding the profit they expected on your job. They usually have special crews that only do installs and also generally like to keep to a small list of manufacturers so they can keep as quick and efficient as possible. New and unfamiliar tech throws a wrench in that.

Inverter heat pumps shouldn't be controlled by dumb "smart" thermostats like Nest. They send only on-off signals, while a compatible communicating thermostat sends a numerical setpoint, allowing the unit to modulate

But heat pumps aren’t new. And aren’t much more complicated to install than a stand-alone AC. And certainly less complicated and less labor (overall) than than AC+furnace.

Price gouging seems like standard practice for HVAC companies.

I'd like to replace my 25+ yr old system (gas furnace/AC) with a new gas furnace & heat pump so I can have the option of heating with gas or electricity... but when I ran this by an HVAC technician who was here for a service call, I got the same kind of exorbitant figures thrown at me with the heat pump in the equation.

Same technician wanted $750 to replace a control board when my furnace had gone out during a blizzard - I sourced my own & did it myself for <$150.

I got three quotes for a new water heater just this week. One was more than twice the other. I'll see where number three comes in. $1900 for a resistive electric water heater seems steep, but at least there's an argument that it's reasonable. 4 grand is just so out there that I have to believe it was personal somehow.

For heat pumps, you actually want to start at the manufacturers. Their website or customer service will help find servicers in your area.

I’m in Northern california, I just got a heat pump installed by these guys: https://www.heliosclimate.io/ - a YC company btw, for those who think they just fund consumer apps :)

Overall it was a great experience, there were some minor issues immediately after installation that got dealt with quickly and efficiently. I think the list price was similar to what you were quoted, but in northern california (menlo park, peninsula clean energy) there were around $5000 of grants/tax incentives, and an interest free loan from pce for the rest, over 5 years meaning our monthly repayment should be about equal to the reduction in our gas bill.

We already had solar and batteries, otherwise I would NOT want to put myself at the mercy of PGE and their crazy electricity rates. But as they reduce the payment rates for solar electricity, the heat pump becomes a better deal.

Thank you Ghufran! It was great working with you. -- Jeremy from Helios

Shreyas here, one of the co-founders of Helios.

So great to have you as a customer! We're stoked we were able to help you ditch natural gas and decrease your carbon footprint.

Menlo park (and much of the peninsula) are such a no brainer for heat pumps. Like you mentioned, ~$5500 in incentives plus interest free financing can net to almost no out-of-pocket costs for most homeowners in San Mateo County. Many contractors aren't as familiar with heat pumps, and their quotes are often so expensive that it doesn't make economic sense to fuel switch. We are focused on offering affordable heat pump installations that have a positive ROI for homeowners.

I couldn't find detailed info on what incentives apply to my county, Alameda.

From your site: "In the SF Bay area common incentives are the Federal 25C Tax Credit, Tech Clean CA and Peninsula Clean Energy."

I'm assuming Federal 25C and Tech Clean CA apply but Peninsula does not. But I don't know how much these are without further research. It would be nice if you had a tool on your site to determine my net cost with incentives included.

Hey, agree that would be awesome. It's super specific, so probably the easiest way is to request a quote from us, and you'll get a list specific for your address. Go here https://www.heliosclimate.io/get-a-quote

We call a specific incentive API, automatically generate the net cost estimate, and send it to you. No issue for our software, pls add a note that you just want incentive info, and I'll know to remove you from our hounding salespeople (ME )

We're working on our live instant quote tool, but it's not ready yet.

... we love Alameda and have done a few projects there now.

If you’re somewhat rural the contractors just don’t have the experience to do it so they try to quote you out of the decision. I had to shop around until I found a contractor that had done this before and I was able to get a whole home heat pump for about the same price as a regular furnace/AC system (because of the rebates).

How well do they function? Do they provide nice consistent heat? How's the noise? Sorry to clog up HN with a random request of a product quality review but I'm in the market right now to replace my furnace as well. Thanks.

Heat pumps need to come with an electric heater because pumps stop working below 30 deg F.

They come with an electric heater, but they don't stop working until far below freezing point. It's normal for a heat pump to still be better than pure resistive electric heating even at 10°F.

This isn't true, the latest models work at temps far below that. There are still thresholds where you'd want another source, but they're very functional even in the upper Midwest.

Ground source heat pumps are available that go down significantly lower than 30F. They are more expensive. Though running the electric wires is also very expensive due to their inefficiency. Typical heat pumps are often better suited for warmer climates because of this

It also appears that the tech for the more typical air source heat pumps has improved significantly in recent years which makes it more viable for colder climates

I believe they run a heat conductive fluid through heat exchange coils in the ground. This allows you to pump heat into the ground during winter and extract said heat (not sure how accurate this is) during the winter.

You're not storing the heat that's underground, it's just that the ground is a huge thing with massive heat storage capacity that doesn't notice weather as much as above ground does.

If above ground ranges from 0-100 degrees F, underground likely ranges from like 64-68 degrees F, which makes it really energetically "cheap" to get to your preferred temperature range, heating to idk 70 at most and cooling to probably not even 65.

This is just not true at all.

Why do you even respond if you don't know enough about heat pumps?

It is practically true. Sure my heat pump can make heat below 28F - but it was sized for cool my house in summer and so it cannot make enough heat anymore and so I need the backup heat.

Oh, sorry, I guess I was brainwashed by the "anti heat pump mafia". I had this conversation with three HVAC installers but according to this thread any HVAC installer that speaks ill of heatpumps is old and stupid. Recently, I stayed at an AirBNB recently that had a heatpump and the temps dropped during the deep freeze and it was running 100% of the time and failing. The AirBNB owner said it was brand new and I would be responsible for excessive electricity use. They didn't charge me. Based on this, I am sooo glad I replaced my dead furnace with gas three years ago and steered clear of heat pumps.

But do go on about how I don't know enough.

Old heat pumps didn't do well in old temperatures. In the 80s and 90s, a heat pump couldn't handle freezing temps.

Modern heat pumps do fine well below 0 degrees Celsius. Here's one that's great to -15 C and okay down to -25 C[0]. If you search cold-climate heat pumps, you'll find plenty of information about how modern heat pumps are fine in most the temperatures you'll find in most of the US (including up north).

(I have heard that a lot of them are still only available in Europe, but you can definitely find some in the US.)

[0] https://carbonswitch.com/best-cold-climate-heat-pump/

I mean, instead of an argument you responded with some kind of rant about your Airbnb experience.

So his point still stands.

The reply made no point, so what exactly stands? Reply just said I don't know what I'm talking about, so I explained where my knowledge came from, which is more than the reply did. And somehow that's a better "point"? kids these days.

You clearly don't know if this is your only source.

"Below 0° Fahrenheit, heat pumps can still heat your home with more than twice the efficiency of gas heating or standard electric heating (such as electric furnaces and baseboard heaters). They’ve been tested and approved as far north as the Arctic Circle, and are popular options in very cold countries like Finland and Norway."

Finland has over 60% heat pumps.

And heat pumps, just to be clear, work by generating a temp difference. The main problem is the efficiency and that drops also because there is a heating cycle needed for the air intake.

How many models did you actually research yourself?

Not true, mine goes down to 23F with negligible decrease in efficiency and still functions after that, but with reduced efficiency.

One anecdote I've seen is that the right way to run them is to maintain a near-steady-state temperature in the house, including overnight. I'm not sure if that's maybe a bit extreme and just how they suggest use to non-savvy home-owners, but it makes sense... They're not going to blast out heat to raise the house temperature 10 degrees in an hour in the morning. Spreading heat-increase over several hours is more feasible. Good insulation presumably helps a bunch, too.

For a similar reason, heat pump water heaters tend to have a larger storage tank, as they take longer to heat the water and you want more of a usage buffer.

You don't need to run it overnight. But I do set a timer for mine to turn back on an hour before I get up. Because exactly -- it's not blasting hot air, it's merely circulating warm air. An hour beforehand works fine for mine though.

Do you’ll not run your heat at night when it’s the coldest?

Just in the bedroom. Don't need it anywhere else.

>> I had to shop around until I found a contractor that had done this before and I was able to get a whole home heat pump for about the same price as a regular furnace/AC system (because of the rebates).

Not sure the trouble is over. You are only good until you need servicing, and then you need to shop around again. Servicing is even worse, because it is an acute problem and you are under so much time pressure to solve the issue.

Sometimes even the company that sold the unit does not honor their warranty. They shut down. They re-incorporate under a new company, etc.

A guy at work doesn't have a heatpump, just some really high efficiency oil boiler. He lives in a rural area and basically had to become an expert on maintaining and repairing it himself because no one seems to know how to service the thing.

My father had similar issues with his new boiler although in his case after constant failed repair attempts his local place finally hired some guy who knew what he was doing.

There's also rebates on heatpumps around here but local forums seem to suggest that the installers are super backed up and quote "go away" prices. You can't get the rebate unless you go with a state approved installer, so even if you can install it yourself you're out of luck. Seems like they've just raised their prices to compensate for the rebate since they already had to much work.

> If you’re somewhat rural the contractors just don’t have the experience to do it so they try to quote you out of the decision.

Or they're so busy they can pick and choose their jobs. I had a quote to replace a 12 foot section of pipe come in at $700, not even two hours worth of work.

I thought of that, I am not rural (town is about 300,000 people)... Perhaps that is rural in some areas I guess.

The HVAC contractors here are pretty small, maybe they do not want to take the risk.

As someone else said, if I had more time, I would have purchased a few DIY split systems... I might do that for AC only, as I did not replace the AC at that time.

I had the same experience, twice as much for a heat pump as a traditional gas/electric AC here in Atlanta GA. Got quotes for multiple companies, then on a whim I talked to the guy at Costco who stands by the door on the way out. Turned out you get a ~15% discount for going thru Costco, so I saved the 1500 bucks and got Costco credit! And they used top of the line equipment!

That sounds like a fantastic opportunity for a fresh company to take over the market. Heat as a service.

It costs about 2kUSD to get air to air exchange heatpump installed here (minisplit, includes the cost of the pump, EU). Takes approx 3 hours.

Yes, HVAC contractors in the US massively overcharge.

I saved ~ 10k doing the install myself. The equipment is inexpensive, labor can be upwards of 2x equipment cost.

Do you feel like the number of invisible footguns was manageable? That's always my concern with diy trades stuff, the things that seem fine at install but come back to bite you 6mo later.

There's a bunch of DIY heat pump install videos on YouTube, I watched this one recently: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79C2StyNlBg Honestly it convinced me that it's beyond my skillset.

In general with contractors, you aren't paying for them to do the simple stuff right. You're paying them to get the one or two weird bits of the job done quickly and efficiently because they've seen something like it before and have the tools and parts on their truck.

That is why I didn't try to DIY. Sure I'm confident I could get it installed. However I'm sure that I would discover after the old furnace was tore out that I'm missing some part/tool and so off to the store - what would take a pro a single day would take me 3 weekends at best: time that I don't have HVAC.

That's what I was asking about. How likely I am to succeed at a DIY job seems to depend on the number of the "weird bits" as you describe them.

No invisible footguns, just a bit of anxiety releasing refrigerant and hoping my lineset connections don't leak. Theres only a preset amount of refrigerant, it dissipates into the air and theres no easy way to refill it.

That said, some will inevitably leak out (ie. while disconnecting manifold gauge set) but no big deal. I've done four installs and nothing catastrophic.

I looked into doing my own heat pump install. At least here in Vermont, you can't buy one without a refrigeration license[0] because of the ozone depletion issues with refrigerants. You also have to buy one from an in-state supply house to qualify for some of the incentives. Not all supply houses will sell to muggles.

My experience was that it was simpler and quicker to pay someone despite having basically the simplest possible installation: inside and outside units on opposite sides of the same exterior wall. The guy was great, and recommended a unit with an easily removable blower wheel for the dusty wood shop application[1]. I wouldn't have gotten there on my own, for sure. And he made sure that it qualified for the incentives. The list is long, and the models that are actually in production/available change pretty regularly.

Technically, it can be a pretty simple job. Practically, local regulations and circumstances might sway things towards hiring it out.

I say all this as someone who is a fairly competent shade-tree mechanic. I've done an engine swap and replaced a couple of clutches (transmission seal failure and previous owner's poor work; I know how to drive stick)

[0] I'm playing fast and loose with the exact words; it's been a few months since I looked into it.

[1] Cooper-Hunter, which is a Midea brand

Buy one that has precharged refrigerant in the condenser. New units use R410a which does not deplete ozone. You'll also never need to handle refrigerant, only open a valve which release it into the copper lineset.

You can buy a Mr Cool unit, you won't need to cut/flare/vacuum the lineset, just connect. I don't personally don't use them as their units generally cost a bit more, (30$ ~ 50%) and you're stuck with whatever lineset lengths they offer. However it's a great starter install and work just fine.

Cooper-Hunter units come precharged, so fairly easy to DIY.

I was looking at Mitsubishi units, which I believe also come pre-charged. I don't know if it's a local law or if the supplier just didn't want to deal with someone not in the trade.

costco/home depot sells mr.cool and they are quick and easy to install

Had exactly the same experience recently. It seems like there are plenty of good mini-split heatpump systems that will work down to 0F (or even lower) without any kind of backup heat source. But if you're replacing a forced air furnace that feeds an existing ducts the only options are heatpumps that need to have backup heat under 30F. So essentially you're buying 2 furnaces in one which increases the cost. I'm in the PNW where it rarely goes below 10F so the minisplit systems would work fine without backup.

That is what I got: a heatpump good to about 28F, and natural gas backup. I still save a lot of money over the previous 50 year old propane furnace. However so many variables changed at once I can't say if it was worth it.

There's plenty of central split heat pumps that can function just fine below 30F. Look for ones marked "hyper heat" or advertised for use in cold climates. As long as the heatpump can handle down to 0F or so, then your backup heat only really needs to be an electric resistance heat strip (inefficient, but very cheap) since it would be used so infrequently.

OTOH, if you're replacing a gas furnace and already have A/C, then installing a new gas furnace + heat pump shouldn't cost much more than a new gas furnace + new A/C.

> There's plenty of central split heat pumps that can function just fine below 30F.

They likely exist, but none of my local residential HVAC companies carried them.

Imagine the electrical demand on the grid during a cold snap if everyone switched to heat pumps with resistive heating as a backup. At the time of largest demand, the largest electrical appliance in each home would be reduced to a fraction of its normal efficiency. And all the homes in the region would be experiencing that same thing at the same time.

Electric resistive heating is not a suitable backup. If adopted at scale, it would tend to amplify demand spikes when the grid is at its most vulnerable.

A "multi position air handler" which match the aspect ratios of traditional air handler furnaces are available from the major manufacturers like Daikin or Mitsubishi.

They will pair to low ambient temperature capable condensers.

Daikin FXTQ series models

Mitsubishi SVZ series models

If you are searching.

I don't think having backup heat is a terrible idea, but it could be any fuel source. The fan should still function with minimal power to circulate air as long as there's some heat to move around.

The ideal design (IMHO) for a cold-climate (such as New England) is forced air ducting with a heat pump (better GSHP than ASHP if possible) with a 2-zone high efficiency natural gas boiler for domestic hot water and AUX heat.

People always forget the hot water. A GSHP usually has a de-superheater that can provide some heat during the shoulder seasons, but you can't rely on it and need the backup heat (as you do for the AUX heat for both when it's super-cold out and for the defrost cycle).

Any HVAC tech worth their salt should be able to work on a heat pump…

wait I didn't know I could replace my AC with a heat pump, can I replace my noisy AF condenser that's always grinding and hissing or do heat pumps make the same noises

A heat pump is just an air conditioner that can be run in reverse. Replacing your air conditioner might help if it makes the noise because it's old and broken, but if you just really dislike the sound of an air conditioner it probably won't help much.

Maybe one of the new variable speed ones would help?

The variable speed inverter ones tend to be much quieter than the old single-stage ones that most people have, fwiw.

Ah, right! I actually have a variable stage regular AC unit, so that's not a benefit unique to heat pumps, that's something you can get by replacing your AC unit in general.

A heat pump is the same technology as what your condenser is doing, just in reverse. So you could otherwise just think of an air conditioner as one half of the heat pump in this case. So no

A heat pump is just an AC that can move heat in either direction so you should be able to.

AC is just a heat pump that doesn't give you the option of running it backwards. There can be good and bad implementations of either.

New to heat pumps. Can I replace sub-components of an existing AC system with a heat pump for benefits of both?

You have just constructed a heat pump.

Heat pumps have the benefits of both.

I'd be very interested as well. My gas furnace is only a few years old, but my AC system is probably 10 years old. If I could replace just that with a heat pump, and leave my gas furnace in place as a backup, that would be ideal.

You can do that. It’s very common in New England to go this way because the heat pumps generally only work down to -15F and then you need to switch to furnace for heat.

You can install non ducted mini splits, which is what I did.

I left my oil furnace intact and added 4 high wall units (each bedroom and living room) with 2 outdoor condenser/compressors.

I still use my oil furnace when it gets below 40.

I'm surprised this isn't more common. The only difference between a heat pump and standard air conditioner is a reversing valve. These are usually $50-$100, and just require one more wire to the thermostat. In colder weather, defrost and fancier controllers are needed, but for mild climates the reversing valve is really all that is needed.

You are dealing with different pressures on the refrigerant lines, but honestly that shouldn't really matter all that much. You also need a bit of logic for if the condenser starts freezing over to temporarily reverse the flow (and turn off the home fan) to defrost.

But otherwise, yeah, almost identical and a little crazy they'd cost much more over a typical install.

Off the shelf heat pumps will have a defrost control board too, but you make a solid point.

The hard part is that you have to recover the refrigerant and refill, which takes HVAC/R equipment and and EPA certification to do legally.

In theory but not practice. No one makes that kind of conversion kit, and there are enough "minor" differences (e.g. heat pumps need a defrost mechanism where AC's are presumed to operate with hot ambient air) to make it impractical.

Not really. You replace your existing AC with a split heat pump. It's not a mix-and-match situation, but the heat pump will both heat and cool and, if you already have existing ductwork that's correctly sized, you should be fine to just drop in a heat pump. (In an extreme heating dominated climate, you could have ducts that are too small for a heat pump, but adequately sized for AC and a furnace. That's pretty uncommon though.)

Things like the ducts plug right in.

Other things like the blower and condenser may need to be swapped out. It also depends on how old your system is. The controller will probably most certainly need to be swapped out. Do the normal thing with contractors like that. Call 3 different dudes have them come out and give you an estimate. Tell them you want quotes for partial swap out, full swap out, and 3 different price points. Within a couple of weeks you will have most of the knowledge you need if you want to do it.

My parents when they switched out they replaced both the indoor unit and outdoor too because they were 30+ years old at that point.

Now you probably have NG? If so you can also leave that fairly in place as is. I did that with my prev house. Then have the heat pump for when it is warm outside. Then switch over to NG when it gets to a particular temp. I set it to switch over at about 30F. I could have gone as low as 15 with that unit. It worked decently for most of the time. Where I live it maybe gets in the 20s for about a week a year at most. So the heat pump worked decently.

One thing though I would say is if you have a older home especially 1990 or older start with the insulation. It is wildly cheaper to get and gets you part of the way there. Many power companies even run deals where they will help you buy it.

A "heatpump" is an AC with a reversing valve. Yes you can just get a reversing valve and have some hack cut and solder it in for you. I'd assume any normal contractor would charge $1000+ for that job though. It would take multiple hours for a tech when instead he could make multiple house calls in that same time (and possible making more money doing house calls). So that is why you won't find someone to do it. It make no sense. Right now on ebay you can get a "Goodman 4 Ton 14 SEER Heat Pump" for $1800 delivered to your doorstep.

Oh and I guess another thing a heatpump has that an AC doesn't is a defrost controller board. You'd need one of those too.

No, it's actually worse. The heat pump will make that same compressor noise when cooling in the summer AND heating in the winter.

Reminds me of the hissy fit plumbers made over no-flush urinals.

Turns out they were right about that one though.

Are you sure? I still see them around in some local shopping malls.

If your criteria as to if something is actually long term useful/the best tradeoff is if you can find it at your local shopping mall, you might want to rethink that a bit.

I've never hard that they were. Only that they had the lobbying muscle to mostly get their way.

They have nearly impossible to solve maintenance issues unless you use special chemicals and maintenance procedures, and unless you wash/flush them (and the surroundings) regularly the urine smell is hard to deal with.

Since most maintenance staff don’t do the special procedures properly (and barely manage to deal with normal toilets properly!) they were a big headache. [https://www.waterless.com/blog/the-pros-and-cons-of-selectin...].

Everywhere I know of that was using them eventually got rid of them because they weren’t worth it for the small water savings they actually got.

Especially since water usage was never anything but a hot button PR topic - there are probably only a handful of places humans habitate that the difference is actually non-negligible when you factor in showers, landscaping, etc.

I've never noticed those issues, and your link seems to say otherwise. But your post does read like the whinging of plumbers that I mentioned. You wouldn't happen to be, or be affiliated with, one, would you?

https://www.12ft.io/https://www.wired.com/2010/06/ff-waterle...

That's because the link is to the advocacy organization for flushless toilets. They don't deny it, and even mention it as cons! hah.

The links you're pointing to are to articles when the idea was 'hot'. And when all the press was going on around saving water in California (notably dead now, as is the norm).

If you didn't notice the issues, then congrats! someone in the maintenance team was doing the work so you didn't have to see what was happening.

I'm not a plumber, but I do own property and have installed (permitted/inspected) several toilets and had to do my own maintenance. Flushless was never worth the squeeze for me, but then I never had to deal with PR issues or fads. I was my own customer, and got to pick what worked for me and those around me.

Tradesfolk are _so_ political, it boggles my mind. I own a house, and need to get quotes for HVAC and plumbing stuff occasionally, and holy shit, I do not look forward to those conversations. Just nodding my head for 15 minutes while they look over my setup ranting about what they heard on cable TV last week.

I mean, it's good to force me out of my bubble, but maybe not right into the deep end where, and this is from about 8 hours ago, "heat pumps are no good in the Pacific Northwest because they use more electricity than resistive heating". The PNW: a climate renowned for two things: rain and mild temperatures, where heat pumps are no good. All I can do is nod and say "uh huh".

I have the same thought when someone gives me an opinion on the car I drive or the food I eat and how I'm killing the earth, meanwhile they take 10x the number of flights I do and have no idea how their food gets to them.

what were the justifications, did you ask out of curiosity for them to share what was driving their decisions?

where are you located? I was quoted 14k to replace a gas furnace for a single family in NJ

Unless that's a massive furnace that's robbery. In philly I replaced my furnace for $6k 2 years ago.

Got two quotes thus far and they're in the same ballpark. I asked for quotes in December 2023, 2 months ago. Bergen County, NJ.

I had our gas furnace replaced this past November, a 100k BTU Rheem one, for $2,200. This was outside Chicago in Northwest Indiana, though, which is a pretty low cost of living area.

I spent some time trying to get a heat pump instead, but no one around here was familiar with them. I worried that if it failed service would be a pain.

We've owned three homes, our first one had a heat pump. In Virginia. It generally sucked. It wasn't as good as real A/C in the summer and wasn't as good as gas or electric heat in the winter. I hope to never end up in a place that uses a heat pump.

... what do you think real ac is?

https://www.thisoldhouse.com/heating-cooling/reviews/heat-pu...

"Heat pumps use refrigerant to condition the air in your home by adding or removing heat through thermal exchange."

"Air conditioning is a cooling system that circulates cool air into an enclosed space, creating a comfortable atmosphere and improving indoor air quality."

"Air conditioners generally last longer than heat pumps because air conditioners only run when the air needs cooling, while heat pumps operate year-round."

> "Heat pumps use refrigerant to condition the air in your home by adding or removing heat through thermal exchange."

This is what air conditioners do, too.

> "Air conditioning is a cooling system that circulates cool air into an enclosed space, creating a comfortable atmosphere and improving indoor air quality."

This is what heat pumps do, too.

These are two sentences that describe the same process, just in different words.

The last quote is potentially relevant: a heat pump is an air conditioner that can run in reverse to provide heat in the winter, so you're running it in both situations, and thus for more time.

My guy, a heat pump is effectively an air conditioner with some added reversing valves.

It may have been low on refrigerant. I'm in Virginia now and most of my neighbors have heat pumps including me. Mine is 17 years old and is definitely low on refrigerant so I use the original baseboard heat instead.

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